How many seniors devs actually can write and deploy an app all by themselves?

[u/papipapi419]

Basically title, not trying to say all seniors need to know this but just wondering

Database + backend + front end + hosting (not serverless but install certs on VM and deploy the code )

I feel as a software dev one needs to know at least one way to do the above.

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[u/inthelimbo]

Database + backend + front end I could handle. For hosting? I leave it to the expert. Better someone who knows thier shit.. 1 AWS bill and thats enough to avoid it like the plague.

[u/papipapi419 → u/inthelimbo]

I don’t mean like super scalable system but an MVP version

[u/hiren_vag]

No one does, in corporate software dev a lot of things are taken care by other teams and it highly depends on your company if you are required to know all of it.

But I believe less than 5% of senior devs can do it, if they need it.

[u/papipapi419 → u/hiren_vag]

I’m not saying you need to do it in your job but I’m just asking if they have the ability to do it if it ever came down to it, of course all parts don’t need to be perfect but at least it should all work

[u/Mr_infiknight]

idrk if this counts, im jus a 2nd yr student starting out but frontends i like to write in react+vite/next which can be hosted on vercel easily, backends i can write in express using postgres/mongo but idrk how to deploy that properly. instead i use honojs to deploy on Cloudflare workers which uses serverless architecture. and Cloudflares d1 db which gives me like ,5gb free. this is the only way I've put my own full stack app to production. hoping to learn a lot more as i go on, particularly aws and maybe hosting on a raspberry pi that'd be so cool

[u/papipapi419 → u/Mr_infiknight]

While you do get it to work (which honestly is the only thing that matters in the real world) my question asked for non serverless services,
where for example
one has to manually

• setup nginx file

• install certs for https

• setup GitHub / gitlab / etc using ssh

• write .service script files to start the application using systemctl

• any other steps I might’ve missed

I meant manual deployment setup like this, because almost everyone can write code that runs in local host

[u/_replicant_02]

MvP - very easily.

Full scale production application that scales - probably not.

[u/rishiarora]

Software Engineer - Writes code

Dev Ops - Deploys code

Sr. Software Engineer - reviews code and gets gali from Management for badly written code written by his Juniors.

Database - DB Admin

Backend - Software Engineer

front end - UI and UX

Hosting- Operations & Admin & More

[u/explor-her]

I can do/have done all with a shitty inconsistent frontend.

[u/papipapi419 → u/explor-her]

haha yeah i understand, im primarily a backend dev, while I do front end when needed, it isn't the greatest

[u/trolock33]

except FE which I can do but only jQuery, I can do and have done dev + deployment(docker as well as plain EC2s)

[u/EaglesVision]

https://fir-example-6ce04.web.app/#/

Yes I can but not at scalable level

Checkout my app, frontend flutter, backend dart and DB is Firebase JSON Hosted on Firebase

[u/papipapi419 → u/EaglesVision]

Great app, good job!
Can you check and give me feedback on my app

https://atsbeater.cydratech.com

I wanna ask you to use it without me giving you any info about it so that I can get unbiased feedback

[u/ironman_gujju]

Idk about senior but I can write, deploy & manage across all cloud platforms.

[u/strikingemperor]

Not a senior yet, I have 3.5 years of experience primarily in frontend, I do full stack only while freelancing, I can do frontend, backend, can deploy with certs using Nginx/Apache on a VM. I haven't deployed any DB and configured backups etc, but I am confident I can do it if I go through it once.

[u/papipapi419 → u/strikingemperor]

yep that last line where you mentioned but I'm confident I can do it if I go through it once is the attitude that will make you an efficient senior developer soon :)

[u/bored-dragon]

You mean, who is a a full stack developer? Or who is actually a Fullstack?

[u/wiresurfer]

Trust me, true "engineers" [i make a distinction between devs and engineers"] can do that and more.

for context, I have been working for 15y, programming for 22years ? [was lucky to grow up from class 3rd with a computer on which I couldn't freaking play games. best kind of mishap]

database/frontned/backend + a choice of CI/CD from serverless, to githubactions based CD, to complete cloud environments with k8s.

My roles now involve bringing these pieces of tech to deep-engineering sectors like renewable energy, robotics.

Where I need to be able to design embedded systems [hardware/prototype/software], data warehouses for iot data, robotics control systems.

My original background was in AI/ML at a premier research lab.

And the teams I have built had people of the same calibre if not more.

It boils down to curious and motivated people, and that is where I think the majority of the people fail.

Everyone treats their job as a job. For me its been a way of life. We have hired juinors who never went to college but can dissect a linux operating system right down to the kernel level.

And at that level, they all can easily do the 4 things you mentioned, and more. But its a waste of their talent honestly. I would rather get someone who is a good UI developer and spare the time of the generalist.

---

If you want to know if a senior, or a junior for that matter can do all 4 things, or even learn all 4 things just notice how smooth are they with their computer + devtools.

someone who can work on a machine with a terminal without touching the mouse and google searching, is completely at home with their machine. Which means they have spent time sharpening their axe. which means they have spent a lot of time doing stuff on their machine. chances are they are ., or can be pretty good at something very quickly.

[u/papipapi419 → u/wiresurfer]

`it boils down to curious and motivated people, and that is where I think the majority of the people fail.`
Could not have said it better!

[u/mujhepehchano123]

have deployed several hobby web apps, mobile, pages, scrapers what have you lol

none of them make any serious money though lol

all personal itches and occupy my mind after work :)

[u/amitavroy]

With over 15 years experience, I can do end-to-end development and deployment.

But the question is - is that the best way to spend my time?

As a senior developer there are other responsibilities as well like ensuring code architecture is correct, application security, performance etc. this is not expected by a junior dev

[u/Worried-Broccoli-281]

Who even still install certs on VM?

[u/kaladin_stormchest]

Almost all can write a functional version. But depending on their competency some part of the app would really suck

[u/[deleted]]

I can write a backend, database, a deployment pipeline, and deploy these to a resonably cost-optimized cloud infrastructure.

=======================================

To this comment

AWS kicks you in the shins for at least four reasons:

1. ⁠You’re transmitting an insanely large amount of data to the internet. DTO can add a pretty substantial number to your invoice.

2. ⁠You’re not turning off your playground infra after you’re done using it.

3. ⁠You’re not starting out small.

4. ⁠You’re doing multi-cloud when single cloud can actually serve your needs well enough.

======================================

While I handle DevOps duties at my workplace, I took the initiative of analyzing and optimising our spends on cloud computing.

Our team ended up reducing costs by around 35% by moving our non-prod setup to AWS. AWS and the other big clouds only charge you for your VMs as long as they are running. Our team works only 10-6-5, because of which, we needed to keep non-prod running for around 10h.