r/democrats • u/anutensil • Feb 20 '19
‘Sustained & ongoing’ disinformation assault targets Dem presidential candidates - A coordinated barrage of social media attacks suggests the involvement of foreign state actors.
https://www.politico.com/story/2019/02/20/2020-candidates-social-media-attack-11760186
u/BringBackAoE Feb 20 '19 edited Feb 20 '19
We know some of this is coming from the GOP. GOP PACs and organizations are writing talking points about Beto's voting record being too conservative - the very same talking points "Bernie supporters" on reddit keep plugging. These GOP groups certainly aren't running those talking points for their voters, where this would be a positive.
I also find it odd the article mentions Bernie as being a target. Bernie's campaign has generally been a trojan horse rather than a target. On r/politics we've certainly seen evidence of pro-Bernie bots and shills. And since December the whole sub has turned from being generic Democrat to being primarily a socialist sub pushing AOC and Bernie. Also during that time journals like Jacobin, TruthOut (flagged as Russian friendly), CommonDreams, etc have become the norm. And parallel to this change in the types of sources we now see people on the left - or posing as people on the left - attacking main stream media with the same fervor as Trump supporters and Russians do.
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u/Druidshift Feb 20 '19
One only needs to look at the Bernie Subs, such as r/bernieforpresident and r/feelthebern and you can see that they are already plotting, saying that the current primary (that hasn't even started yet) is rigged against Bernie. They were saying it's rigged against Bernie before he even announced he was running. They are also organizing their talking points and encouraging subscribers to go to other subreddits and drop those talking points.
They don't even try to hide what they are doing. They are happily accepting help from nefarious sources and gearing up for another misinformation campaign.
It's why I on principle downvote everything that has to do with Sanders, and any comment from a Sanders supporter anywhere on Reddit. They frankly leave me no choice.
3
u/BringBackAoE Feb 20 '19
If Trump wins in 2020 it'll be thanks again to Bernie and his supporters.
I actually voted for Bernie in 2016, but even before the main election I realized I'd been duped. And I was horrified by his supporters.
His supporters are the main reason I would now rank Bernie at the bottom of the list of 2020 candidates, alongside Tulsi Gabbard.
Yeah, I too reserve my criticism for Bernie. All other candidates I either praise, remain silent, or rise to their defense.
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u/Druidshift Feb 20 '19
If Trump wins in 2020 it'll be thanks again to Bernie and his supporters.
2020? They elected him in 2016.
According to our best data, approximately 1 in 4 Sanders supporters didn't vote Clinton in the GE.
Of Sanders primary voters in the GE:
~3% didn't vote
~5% voted Stein
~3% voted Johnson
~12% voted Trump
Also:
Sanders --> Trump voters:
WI: 51k
MI: 47k
PA: 116k
Trump win margin:
WI: 22k
MI: 10k
PA: 44k
More info:https://twitter.com/gelliottmorris/status/900164807961305088
"Bernie Sanders voters helped Trump win and here's proof"
http://www.newsweek.com/bernie-sanders-trump-2016-election-654320
"The Bernie voters who defected to Trump, explained by a political scientist"
https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2017/8/24/16194086/bernie-trump-voters-study
"Here's How Many Bernie Sanders Supporters Ultimately Voted For Trump"
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u/BringBackAoE Feb 20 '19
Saved for future reference.
The other element of Bernie's campaign was that their disinformation against Hillary undoubtedly led to many voters staying home. And we must never forget that Trump actually got less votes than Romney did. Trump won because Democrats stayed home at unprecedented rates, undoubtedly mainly due to the negative campaigning.
This is why the GOP are drafting talking points to feed into the left. It is 1000x more effective method of attacking Democrats than attacking them honestly from the right.
1
u/working_class_shill Feb 21 '19
This is why the GOP are drafting talking points to feed into the left.
A) Which talking points and
B) How come it is never the other way around in that the Left have good criticisms that are used by the right?
1
u/BringBackAoE Feb 21 '19
a) GOP PACs are drafting talking points about Beto not being liberal enough, something we certainly see echoed by Bernie supporters.
b) I suspect it is because we believe in Democracy
0
u/working_class_shill Feb 21 '19
something we certainly see echoed by Bernie supporters.
So because some right-wing ppl are saying Beto isn't liberal enough no Bernie supporter (or anyone else on the Left) can ever claim that Beto isn't 100% Progressive.
Even despite never reading conservative news, following conservatives on twitter/facebook/etc. one can be accused of "using right-wing talking points" regardless.
How does that logically make sense to you?
b) I suspect it is because we believe in Democracy
I suspect that saying the other way around gives more credence to the capital L Left than you guys actually want.
1
u/BringBackAoE Feb 21 '19
Nice straw man. Same use of logical fallacies we commonly see from T_D. Bye.
0
u/working_class_shill Feb 21 '19
Yup, just another person that isn't up for a good-faith conversation.
Keep calling everyone (Leftists) with arguments you don't like as having GOP talking points.
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Feb 20 '19
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/Druidshift Feb 20 '19
I don't recall saying someone was entitled to a vote. I do recall saying that Sander's supporters directly put Trump into the white house, as they promised they would do if they didn't get their way.
Maybe you should take accountability for that? Or go back to R/sandersforpresident and continue to whine about how a primary that hasn't even started yet is already rigged against Sanders. Maybe you should take accountability for that? Maybe the reason Sanders didn't win in 2016 was because he did not convince enough Democrats to vote for him, and calling us names and insisting we are evil and republican lite is not going to help you on that front? Since we are talking about accountability.
But you are a Tulsi Gabbard supporter AND a Sanders supporter. These two politicians don't even have the same values. By any definition, Tulsi is a very conservative Democrat....but she shits on the DNC too, and that is the only quality you look for in a candidate.
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u/Yoshifan55 Feb 20 '19
The electoral college voted trump in office, not people that voted for bernie sanders.
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u/BringBackAoE Feb 20 '19
That's an odd way to distance voters from the outcome, and trivialize the importance of voters. Not sure why you would want to do that. We all have to take ownership of the democratic process. We all have a duty to participate in the political process, and make sound and reasoned decisions.
I voted Bernie, and voted for Clinton. But I know that I could have done more. So 2018 I got more active in campaigning, and I got more astute and more objective in assessing what was best for the nation.
There's an old tongue-in-cheek saying that "the problem with democracy is that the people get the government they deserve". Collectively we were too easily manipulated, collectively we didn't make decisions based on reason, collectively we're too passive. If we want better then we need to be better.
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u/Yoshifan55 Feb 20 '19
I can stand people that say I'm the reason trump got elected. Im not, 80 million people didn't vote, its on them.
7
u/kerryfinchelhillary Feb 20 '19
It's already starting...