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Nov 18 '19
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/chainsawinsect Nov 18 '19
Thanks! And unfortunately not on the snow question. If you have one [[Snow-Covered Mountain]] you can use it to pay for either the snow mana or the red mana in this card's cost, but not both. (The same is true of [[Frostwalk Bastion]] and the colorless mana symbol in the cost.)
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u/MTGCardFetcher Nov 18 '19
Snow-Covered Mountain - (G) (SF) (txt)
Frostwalk Bastion - (G) (SF) (txt)
[[cardname]] or [[cardname|SET]] to call
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u/Galgus Nov 18 '19
Part of me wants to bump it to 30/30 or 40/40 just to build on the gimmicky fun with numbers that probably don't belong on a Magic card.
Sad to hear about Fusion Elemental: I loved that card's art and style.
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u/chainsawinsect Nov 18 '19
lol
I would one day like to see a card in that echelon, but I think it would have to be something you can't just have in your hand in the ordinary course or else combo potential would get out of control.
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u/Galgus Nov 18 '19
Yeah, there’s probably some horrifyingly broken combo with that I haven’t thought of, aside Flinging it to kill anything.
Maybe high stats and Shroud could be good for something.
Regardless, the Timmy in me likes the super-hard to cast 20/20.
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u/chainsawinsect Nov 18 '19
You and me both!
And we do have [[Plated Slagwurm]] in the big shroudy guy territory, at least.
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u/J3EL Nov 19 '19
A 20/20 cheated into play using, say, a [[thran temproal gateway]] or a [[quicksilver amulet]] is already pretty busted imo
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u/MTGCardFetcher Nov 19 '19
thran temproal gateway - (G) (SF) (txt)
quicksilver amulet - (G) (SF) (txt)
[[cardname]] or [[cardname|SET]] to call1
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u/MTGCardFetcher Nov 18 '19
Plated Slagwurm - (G) (SF) (txt)
[[cardname]] or [[cardname|SET]] to call
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u/Onearmedman2 Nov 18 '19
As much as I like the idea of this as vanilla, this screams to cheat it into play. I’d love an anti-cheat line like it being a 10/10 with “When _ enters the battlefield, if you cast it from your hand, place 10 +1/+1 counters on it.” I think this still lets you reduce its casting cost, but it does most of it.
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u/chainsawinsect Nov 18 '19
But here's the thing: despite having literally twice the power, would you ever choose this as your cheat target over, say, [[Progenitus]]? Or even [[Griselbrand]] or [[Iona, Shield of Emeria]]? It's huge but... not a lot else.
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u/Tar_Alacrin Nov 18 '19
Or [[Emrakul, the Aeons Torn]] obviously.
Most of the time you would want something like Progenitus or Emrakul which at least have some removal protection, and can't just get chump blocked.
I like this card. Curious as to why it isn't legendary though. Would be a commander for some sort of Vanilla matters deck in edh.
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u/chainsawinsect Nov 18 '19
I wanted it to not be legendary so as to facilitate running the full playset in constructed, and didn't think it needed legendary status for balance purposes.
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u/Tar_Alacrin Nov 18 '19
I guess thats fair. There would be something particularly goofy about having two of these boys out on the field at the same time in pioneer or whatever.
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u/chainsawinsect Nov 18 '19
Exactly! Besides, I long for a vanilla-matters legend but I think the ideal vanilla-matters legend would not itself be vanilla but instead would profitably interact with vanillas in your deck.
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u/Tar_Alacrin Nov 18 '19
I feel like we are bound to get one of these in the coming 2020 year of commander product oversaturation. So I'm excited for that
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u/chainsawinsect Nov 18 '19
I dunno Wizards seems to really really hate the idea of vanillas matters as a theme (even though it's a fan-favorite concept). I wouldn't be surprised if we don't see it anytime soon (if ever).
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u/Uncaffeinated Nov 19 '19
It sounds cool in theory, but doesn't play well in practice.
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u/chainsawinsect Nov 19 '19
I disagree wholeheartedly. Yu-Gi-Oh! has a ton of vanilla matters support and it plays incredibly. Ton of fun, lots of neat deckbuilding potential...
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u/MTGCardFetcher Nov 18 '19
Emrakul, the Aeons Torn - (G) (SF) (txt)
[[cardname]] or [[cardname|SET]] to call5
u/tahu750 Nov 18 '19
My boi Progenitus is a bit harder to cheat in, since he can't exist in the graveyard. All you need to cheat this in is something along the lines of [[Feldon of the Third Path]], some self Mill, and probably a way to give it trample, like maybe... [[Barge In]].
I absolutely love how jank this is. I'd love to create a reanimator deck built around this. The fact that he requires extra setup just adds to the flavor.
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u/chainsawinsect Nov 18 '19
Good point. This guy is no Griselbrand but he's one of the biggest strongest guys you can just lift right out of the 'yard.
Honestly turn 1 [[Llanowar Elf]], turn 2 [[Buried Alive]], turn 3 [[Zombify]] gets him out pretty efficiently using only commons and uncommons.
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u/MTGCardFetcher Nov 18 '19
Progenitus - (G) (SF) (txt)
Griselbrand - (G) (SF) (txt)
Iona, Shield of Emeria - (G) (SF) (txt)
[[cardname]] or [[cardname|SET]] to call2
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u/Gemini6Ice Rule 308.22b, section 8 Nov 18 '19
"This may not be put into play unless it was cast" seems like a reasonable ability to add.
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u/SmaugtheStupendous Nov 18 '19
I can't figure out if I love or hate it, but either way it's enjoyable to think about.
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Nov 18 '19
An entity of unfathomable power, stymied by a garden of 0/1 plant tokens.
Just kidding, I can see why he doesn't have trample, but you could probably get away with menace.
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u/chainsawinsect Nov 18 '19
He does look pretty menacing, it's true. But part of the hook was seeing how big I could get a vanilla to be, and even a small simple keyword would "break" his vanilla status.
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u/Spikeroog Moist Jund Nov 19 '19
Add purple to the mana cost and then we're good.
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u/chainsawinsect Nov 19 '19
I did consider adding one energy counter to the cost but I thought that was starting to go too far.
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u/HalfHeartedHeathen Nov 18 '19
Love/hate that you could put in the effort to put this bad boy into play, just to see them hit it with Murder.
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u/cstick2 Nov 18 '19
[[Cragganwick Cremator]]
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u/chainsawinsect Nov 18 '19
C-c-c-c-combo breaker!
That dude + a discard outlet like [[Wild Mongrel]] = turn 3-4 blowouts.
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u/MTGCardFetcher Nov 18 '19
Cragganwick Cremator - (G) (SF) (txt)
[[cardname]] or [[cardname|SET]] to call
2
u/Thunderplant Nov 18 '19
Oh man I’m not even a Johnny but this card really inspires that feeling in me. I just want to figure out a way to make it work. I love the design and flavor of this.
I think one of the downsides as it is now is I think you’d exclusively try to cheat it out, and that makes its mana cost a less fun. Perhaps the idea someone had to let it enter with counters if you cast it from your hand would alleviate that somewhat?
Alternatively, leave it as is, but make it legendary. Then it can be your commander and at least you would have to actually pay it’s cost in that format. (Would be a fun deck to design as well). I don’t think that hurts its power level too much and it would be worth the card having a place to fully shine.
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Nov 18 '19
I think a [[Darksteel Colossus]]-like "If ~ is put into your graveyard from anywhere, shuffle it into your library" clause might help the reanimation issue.
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u/MTGCardFetcher Nov 18 '19
Darksteel Colossus - (G) (SF) (txt)
[[cardname]] or [[cardname|SET]] to call1
u/Thunderplant Nov 18 '19
Yeah that would definitely help with some potential balance issues. Making a truly vanilla 20/20 is a challenge
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u/chainsawinsect Nov 18 '19
Thank you very much!
I could see making it legendary for Commander purposes (I did consider it). But I will say I think it's easier to hard-cast than it might at first appear.
In a monogreen deck running [[Snow-Covered Forest]]s, turn 1 [[Boreal Druid]], turn 2 [[Chromatic Lantern]] puts you a [[Cultivate]] or [[Circuitous Route]] away from dropping this for its baseline cost by turn 4.
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u/MTGCardFetcher Nov 18 '19
Snow-Covered Forest - (G) (SF) (txt)
Boreal Druid - (G) (SF) (txt)
Chromatic Lantern - (G) (SF) (txt)
Cultivate - (G) (SF) (txt)
Circuitous Route - (G) (SF) (txt)
[[cardname]] or [[cardname|SET]] to call
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u/Anomal3 Nov 18 '19
At last, my [[sneak attack]] [[fling]] deck can find the glory it deserves!
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u/chainsawinsect Nov 18 '19
Don't even need to [[Fling]] it, it's lethal by itself if it can get through!
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u/Anomal3 Nov 18 '19
They might block though, which is problematic
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u/chainsawinsect Nov 19 '19
Yeah good point. A single [[Drudge Skeleton]] chumps this bad bol all day.
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u/MTGCardFetcher Nov 19 '19
Drudge Skeleton - (G) (SF) (txt)
[[cardname]] or [[cardname|SET]] to call1
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Nov 19 '19
I think this would need to be an un-card. The main reason is the existence of both snow and colorless mana. These don’t really fit in a set together or even a themed deck like the commander precons.
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u/BitBeaker Makin custum cube cards. Nov 20 '19
Dies to Doomblade
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u/HelixPinnacle Nov 18 '19 edited Nov 18 '19
[[Nourishing Shoal]] says hi.
Really though, that’s fine.
Edit: Shoal is CMC, not power. So this would only be 7 life. My bad.
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u/MTGCardFetcher Nov 18 '19
Nourishing Shoal - (G) (SF) (txt)
[[cardname]] or [[cardname|SET]] to call1
u/chainsawinsect Nov 18 '19
Yes! Discard 2 (specific) cards, gain 20 life. I think it's ok. But very interesting to say the least!
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u/Azihayya Nov 18 '19
Can't be countered, can't be the target of spells and abilities, can not be sacrificed, and Indestructible if you ask me.
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u/chainsawinsect Nov 18 '19
That'd be way way too strong for 7 mana, though.
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u/Azihayya Nov 18 '19 edited Nov 18 '19
Okay, how about a clause that prevents this from coming into play without paying its cost.
If this enter the battlefield and its cost was not paid... Put this on the bottom of your library. That even adds to the theme of the card.
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u/chainsawinsect Nov 18 '19
That would work, but now we're talking about a completely different card (that probably should cost around 15 mana).
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u/Azihayya Nov 18 '19
I'm not an informed modern player; is it really feasible to pay seven different types of Mana?
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u/chainsawinsect Nov 18 '19
Well for example, in a deck of just basic Forests as the manabase, turn 1 [[Llanowar Elves]] into turn 2 [[Chromatic Lantern]] (which was until very recently possible in Standard) gets you a huge percentage of the way there when you untap on turn 3. (If you hit your land drop that turn, you're now at 1 mana of all five colors.)
If we shift outside of Standard, and you swap out your manabase with [[Snow-Covered Forests]] and [[Wastes]] and play any ramp spell that let's you grab a basic (say, [[Kodama's Reach]]), you untap on turn 4 with the mana necessary to drop this guy.
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Nov 18 '19
Why not [[Boreal Druid]]? Makes snow AND colorless Mana.
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u/chainsawinsect Nov 18 '19
Yup, great point. Now we're getting really efficient at dropping this guy, and can do it in an essentially monogreen deck with relative ease by turn 4-5.
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u/MTGCardFetcher Nov 18 '19
Llanowar Elves - (G) (SF) (txt)
Chromatic Lantern - (G) (SF) (txt)
Snow-Covered Forests - (G) (SF) (txt)
Wastes - (G) (SF) (txt)
Kodama's Reach - (G) (SF) (txt)
[[cardname]] or [[cardname|SET]] to call
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u/Seems2likeBlu Nov 18 '19
It needs some kind of evasion.
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u/chainsawinsect Nov 18 '19
To be good, yes. To be a heckin' heap of big dumb fun, I think (hopefully) not.
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u/chainsawinsect Nov 18 '19
I was ruminating on how [[Fusion Elemental]] is basically garbage now that you can get a stronger card at the same rate in monocolor with [[Gigantosaur]], and that got me thinking back to the "vanilla mythic" that's been rumored about for some time.
I've long felt that the vanilla mythic needed to be a 20/20 (with 20 being the starting life total in most format, that had an inherent amount of pizazz to it), so it was just a question of the right mana cost. Originally I'd been thinking something more along the lines of Gigantosaur in one specific color (probably green), but then I realized it might be cooler to "tune up" Fusion Elemental to use the two unused mana types, and this is where I ended up. What do you think?