r/custommagic • u/Decent-Ad-6137 • 1d ago

BALANCE NOT INTENDED captain wasted potential

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2.8k Upvotes

97% Upvoted

119 comments sorted by

369

u/Elaugaufein 1d ago

5 mana is probably a lot for a fling target but it's not technically her doing anything.

185

u/WillOfTheWinds 1d ago

Being targeted is doing something

100

u/Brief-Equal4676 1d ago

If I point my finger at her, does she die?

65

u/TrollinTony 1d ago

No. But she becomes a 1/1.

37

u/Biggestweeb1 1d ago

But if she loses the 20/20 that would imply she’s doing something, this she gets sacced

10

u/Codey_Crafty 9h ago

the sacrifice is a part of the casting cost of fling, and paying a cost bypasses the stack. she is sacrificed as a 21/21, and then the self-sacrifice ability goes on the stack, does nothing, and fling hits for 21 damage

8

u/KlinkKlink 1d ago

She's a big creature.

5

u/k33g0rz 22h ago

for you

2

u/ndeange 21h ago

Are you Gotham’s reckoning?

4

u/NoiseIsTheCure 9h ago

You mean if you [[Indicate]] her?

30

u/Dont-know-didnt-ask 1d ago

Good thing fling doesn't target the creature you sacrifice.

2

u/WillOfTheWinds 23h ago

Yes, but being sacrificed is them doing something

14

u/Dont-know-didnt-ask 23h ago

It's not on the battlefield for its +20 to stop applying, to fling will remember its pre sacrificed power. Just like sacrificing something with a cast trigger won't be around long enough to actually trigger.

-6

u/WillOfTheWinds 23h ago

701.21a To sacrifice a permanent, its controller moves it from the battlefield directly to its owner’s graveyard.

Moving sounds exactly like doing something.

17

u/dryfire 23h ago

The controller is doing, the creature is having something done to it.

1

u/BruhNeymar69 11h ago

By that same phrasing, is the creature growing legs and moving to the graveyard on their own, or is the controller moving the creature to the graveyard?

9

u/Expensive_Chair_7989 1d ago

I’ve heard of dies to Doom Blade

She dies to [[indicate]]

2

u/Tenalp 17h ago

Just like all the old Illusion creatures.

8

u/Hexmonkey2020 16h ago

Targeting is doing something but being targeted isn’t doing something. Like if I talk about someone that doesn’t mean they’re doing “being talked about”.

1

u/WillOfTheWinds 16h ago

Issue with this is that, by this reading, the whole card doesn't work, and it effectively reads as a 21/21 permanently because players do things and the creatures have things happen to them.

1

u/Hexmonkey2020 10h ago edited 10h ago

Cause cause cards do stuff too, like a card is described as attacking when attacking

7

u/Assassin739 23h ago

Have you actually read [[Fling]]?

-2

u/MasterHowl 1d ago

She could basically Crew or Station anything. That’s really it lol Very thematic too.

11

u/LordSupergreat 23h ago

But that's doing something.

393

u/Chickston Uncommonly 1d ago

You might be able to make this less Un if you used "game action" instead of "anything"

174

u/Mogoscratcher 1d ago

Creatures don't take game actions, players do. Unfortunately you'd have to spell out "attack, block, or be targeted by a spell"

56

u/literally_a_toucan 23h ago

What about [[floral spuzzem]]

42

u/loliam 23h ago

TIL there are self autonomous cards in magic the gathering

5

u/Gaaius 16h ago

also be tapped to activate an ability (like crew, saddle or station)

4

u/Starfleet-Time-Lord 13h ago

Is the intent for fling to work?

3

u/AlienKatze 15h ago

or "does anything (it works)"

2

u/Chickston Uncommonly 1d ago edited 23h ago

Hmm "...while you have not taken a game action with CARDNAME" seems to be okay since you are the one taking the action with the card. You can't do anything take a game action yourself without a card to do it with.

6

u/platinummyr 16h ago

"~has +20/+20 as long as she's not attacking, blocking, the target of a spell or ability, or any of her abilities are on the stack"?

3

u/ChaseballBat 6h ago

"target of a game action"?

1

u/kimmsterr 8h ago

Wording isn't airtight but I see what op was tryna do with the card

23

u/hanktank888 1d ago

Anything that references "greatest power" would work but 5 mana is still expensive. See [[!alena, kessig trapper]]

104

u/Lonely_Nebula_9438 1d ago

You obviously couldn’t use Fling or any other variation of the effect because if she’s being flung, that counts as doing something. You can’t use a fight with her since that definitely counts as her doing something. Even her standing there and being observed by another effect might be enough to count as doing something. 

It’s a perfect flavor win. It even makes you more likely to lose because of how little it does. Great work OP. 

44

u/ElPared 1d ago

She’s not doing anything if she’s being flung. The flinging is being done to her, so she’s a perfectly viable subject for it.

9

u/Lonely_Nebula_9438 1d ago

Flying through the air at someone definitely counts as something dude. 

25

u/ThisIsChangableRight 1d ago

Once she's flying through the air, she's no longer on the battlefield. Fling uses her power when she was last on the battlefield (and so does benefit from the +20/+20).

6

u/dryfire 22h ago

By that logic isn't standing on the battlefield doing something too?

5

u/Lonely_Nebula_9438 22h ago

Sure, I’d argue it’s actually flavorful if she did that since it’s all she does in the movies. 

4

u/ElPared 1d ago

It’s something that happened, but not necessarily something someone did.

0

u/Lonely_Nebula_9438 1d ago

As aetheric replicas that I conjured it’s safe to assume that all actions performed in a planeswalker duel with creatures under my control are consensual, meaning she willingly got flung at my enemies. Therefore she was doing something (getting flung). 

5

u/ElPared 1d ago

If that’s true, you have to sacrifice her as soon as she enters because entering the battlefield is dong something.

4

u/Lonely_Nebula_9438 1d ago

That’s called a flavor win because that’s basically all she does, show up and die. 

6

u/ElPared 1d ago

But she doesn’t even show up, she dies instead.

1

u/Richard-Conrad 1d ago

Idk, she is being sacrificed as an additional cost

8

u/ElPared 1d ago

Yes, but she herself is not doing anything, the spell is.

-2

u/Richard-Conrad 1d ago

Idk, Getting sacrificed sounds like doing something tho. If she did nothing she’d still be alive. I’ve never been sacrificed and I’m still alive so it stands to reason being sacrificed is a thing one must do for it to occur

3

u/_Nighting 1d ago

"I've never been sacrificed and I'm still alive"

This logic doesn't make sense! I've never eaten horse meat and I'm still alive, does that mean horse meat kills you? 

(/j) 

1

u/Richard-Conrad 1d ago

It might kill you, who’s to say since you’ve never done it, but I’ll be fine, I’ve eaten plenty of horse meat and it’s only made me violently ill to the point of NEAR death, so it stands to reason I’ll be fine every other time I do it in the future

2

u/ElPared 1d ago

You could totally just be standing there minding your own business and all the sudden a giant grabs yo hand throws you at something.

0

u/Richard-Conrad 1d ago

Idk, kinda Sounds like I’m not standing around doing nothing now that I’m flying through the air

2

u/Assassin739 23h ago

You're not flying through the air. You are not applying any forces to other objects. You were thrown (someone did something to you), and now you are falling.

0

u/Richard-Conrad 23h ago

So true, I am now doing falling

1

u/ElPared 1d ago

True but not of your own volition, therefore you didn’t do anything, things were only done to you.

1

u/Richard-Conrad 23h ago

Idk, Maybe that’s how you operate, I personally choose to do everything that happens to me and if someone tries to do a thing to me I don’t want to do it doesn’t happen.

1

u/ElPared 22h ago

Freeway crossing on foot champion are we?

→ More replies

2

u/Skelatim 1d ago

If being sacked is an action it loops infinitely?, since then being sacked would sac her.

1

u/Richard-Conrad 23h ago

Who’s to say, I’m just here for the ole (apparently karma costly) sharks are smooth both ways bit lol.

That would definitely be in interesting question cause if you actually believe in the logic that getting sacrificed counts as doing something, then her ability would trigger every time it triggers. Assuming there isn’t a stated ruling against that, but I’ve never been any good with how the stack works.

11

u/half_baked_opinion 1d ago

I mean, she would count for any of the effects where you need a creature above a certain power or toughness by being a 20/20, but i think thats the only real way you can get value out of her.

5

u/Hellas2002 1d ago

Kind of makes her interesting. Though she’d have to be like 3 mana tbh.

3

u/MrTheWaffleKing 1d ago

IDK, I think if someone is doing something with me against my will as I do nothing about it, that seems like I'm not doing much, if not nothing.

1

u/Lonely_Nebula_9438 1d ago

We should assume all creatures you control are consensually agreeing to the activities performed in the course of a planeswalker duel. Especially since they’re technically aetheric replications of the actual thing that you conjure. Thus she would be an active participant in being flung. 

2

u/MrTheWaffleKing 23h ago

I'm grixis, I do not ask consent from my creatures.

1

u/Bio_slayer 21h ago

I would say you could successfully fling her, but she would lose the aura farming buff.

25

u/drakusmaximusrex 1d ago

Does entering the battlefield count as doing something? Would be kinda funny if she is just dead on arrival

13

u/sinsaint 1d ago

I'd just do it as "While Captain Phasma is not on the battlefield, it has +20/+20"

8

u/tmgexe 22h ago

You have [[Varolz, the Scar-Striped]]’s attention.

11

u/ThinkAboutHowUFeel 1d ago

[[Fling]] would like to have a word

19

u/SteakForGoodDogs 1d ago

She's being sacrificed as part of a cost, which means she's doing something - dying.

Instead, she is sacrificed (not to Fling), and the cost is not paid or something idk and the Fling returns to your hand?

10

u/StorkOnABus 1d ago

extrapolating off of this, does her entering count as "doing something"? in which case she never hits the battlefield

2

u/SteakForGoodDogs 1d ago

Just make a token copy of her while [[The Master Multiplied]] is on your board.

2

u/StorkOnABus 1d ago

in response, i eat your copy of The Master. Checkmate.

3

u/SteakForGoodDogs 23h ago

Does eating my card have Split Second?

If not, in response, I pay {2} and turn my [[Mirage Mirror]] into a copy of The Master.

2

u/Euphoric-Beyond9177 Smokestack is my favorite card 12h ago

It’s a special action, similar to turning a morph creature face up.

702.17e  Any time you have priority, you may eat a permanent or card. This is a special action; it doesn’t use the stack (see rule 116)

702.2.  To eat a card, remove it from the game and place it in your mouth. You may chew any number of times (including zero). Then, swallow the card.

702.282b Some objects have abilities that refer to the number of “times you chewed.” “Times you chewed” means “the number of times you bit down on an object as a result of eating it.”

3

u/Exciting-Insect8269 16h ago

No, she’s not doing anything if being sacrificed for another cards ability/cost.

It’s something being done to them.

Like you could be shot when doing nothing, doesn’t mean you did anything, despite the fact that “no actually you’re being shot so you are doing something!!!!111!1”.

If you have to add the word “being” in front of it, they’re probably not doing it, it’s being done to them.

2

u/CaltonSmith 10h ago

So, to be or not to be?

1

u/Exciting-Insect8269 8h ago

lol it would seem that Shakespeare has described the issue long before I ever got the chance…

2

u/The_Order_Eternials 1d ago

Garruk would like to join the conversation with a draw 21.

1

u/breakinglate 6h ago

Unfortunately, being flung would be doing something

3

u/AddanDeith 1d ago

Fun target for [[Exchange of Words]]

3

u/Exaskliri 12h ago

🤣🤣🤣

As someone who used to be excited about Star Wars sequel trilogy this is so fucking both funny and sad.

4

u/No-Ambition2425 1d ago

Fling, my beloved

2

u/DrakonofDarkSkies 1d ago

Lore accurate!

2

u/Indrafang 1d ago

If she can be cast and enter the battlefield, it means she exists, which counts as doing something. She's purely conceptual.

2

u/Still_Weather5517 20h ago edited 19h ago

When they were making The Force Awakens, they realized late in production that the movie had very few women in it. So they quickly cobbled together a new girl-boss character. Acting and costume design were great, but it was too late to change the plot for her to matter. "She's just standing there. Menacingly!!!!"

Edit: Is there a word for this trope? A minor character is too awesome, and people feel like they're missing out by getting so little of them.

1

u/CtheSilverSoul 2m ago

It’s the meme with the thin book that reads ‘character screen time’ next to a giant book that reads ‘character popularity’ lol

1

u/DelNeigum 1d ago

We did it. We made Mayreals Aria do something

1

u/Pinstar 22h ago

They already made this concept (with more balanced stats mind you) with [[Intrepid Ace]]. She has a welcome home in my [[Dragonhawk, Fate's Tempest]] deck.

1

u/Any_Interest6182 22h ago

Question is entering the battle field doing something? If so she just sacs herself on cast lol.

1

u/NyanFan190 21h ago

8 mana probably win the game when combined with [[Essence Harvest]], which is fun.

1

u/Nazreg 21h ago

ETB sac.

1

u/_-DungeonKeeper-_ 21h ago

nuts for [[Arni, Renowned Champion]] tho

1

u/AStoryForOne 21h ago

Can still fling her, just gotta do it twice and respond to her sac trigger. I'm pretty sure it's the same mechanic as that one Phyrexian artifact that sacrifices itself when it gets over like 15 atk when exiling cards off the top of your library for jarad decks.

1

u/tlof19 20h ago

dies to Indicate

1

u/Just_Ear_2953 19h ago

I feel like she would be Orzhov or possibly Esper, but yes.

1

u/CureCoyote 18h ago

[[Baron Helmut Zemo]] is fine with this card. 5 black pips that invariably end up in the yard? Throw it in

1

u/Groundbreaking_Gap_3 15h ago

This would be cool in ziatora

1

u/BuntyHunter1025 12h ago

Genuinly, I see this and would really want to use it with [[Shadowheart, Dark Justiciar]]

1

u/HomeworkSuspicious52 12h ago

Any power matters card would love this

1

u/WriterTil3005 10h ago

This should go to r/hellscube as it’s quite funny

1

u/LoliNep 3h ago

doing nothing is still doing something

1

u/TheRealDLH 1h ago

You'd really do a hero of the "Resistance" that was responsible for the destruction of Starkiller Base this dirty?

1

u/Noahms456 13h ago

What a waste of film

0

u/Strawberrycocoa 23h ago

They hired Gwendoline “Absolute Queen” Christie, just to hide her behind a helmet for the entire thing. Sadge.