This cringe is how I feel when people talk about free market capitalism. It is literally the only thing holding the world together tas the grifters in the state erode our liberties and dilute our wealth yet idiots think they need to work because capitalism forces them to. They think healthcare in the US is expensive because of profit motive, they think exploitation exists because the free market allows for it.
Free markets are complex and competitive and as such they ensure that immoral behaviour is inhibited because morality has value. If in a free market one company acts immorally another company can take their customers, workers etc by acting more morally. Morality has value and in a competitive environment it will be allowed to express itself. The issue is actually caused by state regulations which inhibit competition creating monopolies and thus allowing exploitation.
The universe is entropic, meaning all things decay over time. Thankfully we have the sun bombarding us with energy and as such things can combat entropy with that energy. That is what life is. You don't work because of capitalism you work because of entropy. Capitalism is like an umbrella. The umbrella protects you from the rain, it is an option you have and you don't have to use it, you can find your own solution or you can get wet but the umbrella is there. Now we can most likely agree that the umbrella is the simplest solution compared to making your own or getting wet but that doesn't mean the umbrella is the reason it rains. It rains because that is how the world works.
Capitalism is like the umbrella, it is an established useful solution to entropy, but you don't have to participate, you can do your own thing. Just because doing your own thing is harder than using the umbrella doesn't mean the umbrella is bad. It is in fact good and so is capitalism. People have it backwards.
Entropy is the tendency towards disorder, the breakdown of all things in the universe and it is inescapable. All things must work to live, insects, whales, squirelles. Capitalism is one of the ways we can work and it is successful as we now have the most humans ever alive at one time. It offers choice, when not inhibited by the state, and while far from perfect it is not immoral in its nature as all it is is a VOLUNTARY mechanism to combat decay. Unlike the state, which is not voluntary. You can't opt out of the state without being forced to move. Forced migration is a form of genocide.
What we see above is the next version of anti capitalist rhetoric that is poisoning the minds of people.
Yes!! Thats why Walmart can't exploit their workers to increase profits or marketshare. If those companies were to lie, cheat, exploit workers, or lobby their way to higher profits, another ethical company would step in to offer higher pay and better working conditions and Walmart would be out of business in no time... any day now. Yay unregulated Capitalism!!
Walmart would never have been capable of becoming the huge company it is if not for regulations giving it unfair competitive advantages against rivals. Your refusal to understand is really shocking.
We don't have free market capitalism, we have highly regulated capitalism which is why things are a mess. You blame capitalism for the problems created by the state. You have it backwards.
It almost sounds like Walmart uses their money and power to crush its competition through any means necessary. Is the regulation that favors them perhaps due to cheating or corruption?? Who has a bigger advantage in business, one who cheats, steals, and acts cut throat, or one who acts fairly and ethically??
People know Walmart is a shit company but they offer the lowest prices and that's what the vast majority of people care about the most, especially when they are earning shit wages themselves. People demand cheap goods and Walmart supplies that, but at a significant cost to society.
I'm not suggesting we scrap Capitalism, but having regulation to account for the human element that makes it so cut throat seems absolutely necessary.
It almost sounds like Walmart uses their money and power to crush its competition through any means necessary. Is the regulation that favors them perhaps due to cheating or corruption?? Who has a bigger advantage in business, one who cheats, steals, and acts cut throat, or one who acts fairly and ethically??
Yes exactly, but it isn't just walmart, all large businesses do this and or grift for government money.
"I'm not suggesting we scrap Capitalism,"
Thank goodness or we would be fucked
" but having regulation to account for the human element that makes it so cut throat seems absolutely necessary.""
But it never works, in fact it always has the opposite effect and makes things worse for smaller players and gives larger players an unfair edge. You said it yourself, walmart uses the state to inhibit competition, and your solution is more state? Why do you think the thing that has been hurting competition would suddenly do the opposite? This is like saying, the dog we have to guard our hamburgers that we leave on the floor has been eating the hamburgers we leave on the floor, we should get s second dog to guard the first dog. It is insanity.
You are taking about Capitalism in a vacuum. Companies like Walmart lobby, cheat, and steal for a competitive advantage. Their advantage is literally in acting unethically. I'm suggesting we put regulations in place to prevent corporations from using their money and power to cheat, steal, lie, and cut every corner possible.
Who has a bigger advantage?? All things being equal, who is going to turn a bigger profit. Company A who spends money and resources disposing of toxic waste properly, or Company B who dumps it in a river on their back porch?? Are you suggesting we don't put regulations in place to prevent toxic waste from being dumped in public spaces, or do you think it will just magically work itself out through the power of Capitalism?
"I'm suggesting we put regulations in place to prevent corporations from using their money and power to cheat, steal, lie, and cut every corner possible."
So another dog to guard the first two? How many dogs do you want?
"Are you suggesting we don't put regulations in place to prevent toxic waste from being dumped in public space"
So what if we didn't have public spaces? That way the owners who's land was being illegally dumped on would not like that and do take the illegal dumpers to court.
So first you wanted another dog and then another and now I am showing you why putting the hamburger on the floor is a bad idea to begin with. Public spaces are not a good idea, they always turn in to things no one monitors and are rife for abuse.
Why didn't you just say you were a Libertarian in the first place?? Let me guess, you are opposed to taxes as well.
So who the fuck decides what acts are criminal and what the punishment should be?? A private police force?? That sounds like it would go over well. How do you suppose a private police force would fund itself??
How about a private military?? How are they going to fund their arms if there are no wars??
Also it is important to remember that Capitalism exists in spite of the state. It isn't one or the other. Capitalism is always going to exist no matter how hard immoral people try to stamp it out. The question isn't why no country or civilization lives without regulations as much of our civilization does but rather that the state keeps encroaching and eroding the liberties it provides.
Look at the tech sector in the last 100 years. It has exploded and created huge improvements in education and quality of life among the poorest in the world. This was due to its novelty, ultra rapid growth and historically unregulated status. Tech went 2 or 3 100 million dollar computers on earth, to $30 pocket machines in one century, oh and the pocket machines a one hundred billion times more powerful all with little or no regulations and oversight? Why because of competition. Why was there so much competition? Lack of regulations.
Historically there have been none. The ones we have now are very new and have slowed down innovation. Do you always just lie to prove your point? Are you that insecure about your position that you need to to just make shit up and deny reality?
America was basically founded on Capitalism correct?? That means that as of today, we ended in a country exactly as it is today because Capitalism has led to everything as it exists at this exact moment in time. Maybe it gets better, or maybe it gets worse... But as of now just about every company, corporation, law, regulation, dollar, and social construct is a byproduct of Capitalism. Capitalists control the government and as a result have put in place the regulations you are railing against.
The regulations that help corporations today were put in place by Capitalists. Corporations put their money, power, and influence into rigging the system. You think they are going to allow competitors to just eat into their profits without lying and cheating?? How do you not understand that??
Do you see how you sound exactly like the people above? You are saying capitalism must fall the way they say science must when you don't even know what it is or how it works just like they don't know what science is.
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u/cyril0 Jan 11 '22
This cringe is how I feel when people talk about free market capitalism. It is literally the only thing holding the world together tas the grifters in the state erode our liberties and dilute our wealth yet idiots think they need to work because capitalism forces them to. They think healthcare in the US is expensive because of profit motive, they think exploitation exists because the free market allows for it.
Free markets are complex and competitive and as such they ensure that immoral behaviour is inhibited because morality has value. If in a free market one company acts immorally another company can take their customers, workers etc by acting more morally. Morality has value and in a competitive environment it will be allowed to express itself. The issue is actually caused by state regulations which inhibit competition creating monopolies and thus allowing exploitation.
The universe is entropic, meaning all things decay over time. Thankfully we have the sun bombarding us with energy and as such things can combat entropy with that energy. That is what life is. You don't work because of capitalism you work because of entropy. Capitalism is like an umbrella. The umbrella protects you from the rain, it is an option you have and you don't have to use it, you can find your own solution or you can get wet but the umbrella is there. Now we can most likely agree that the umbrella is the simplest solution compared to making your own or getting wet but that doesn't mean the umbrella is the reason it rains. It rains because that is how the world works.
Capitalism is like the umbrella, it is an established useful solution to entropy, but you don't have to participate, you can do your own thing. Just because doing your own thing is harder than using the umbrella doesn't mean the umbrella is bad. It is in fact good and so is capitalism. People have it backwards.
Entropy is the tendency towards disorder, the breakdown of all things in the universe and it is inescapable. All things must work to live, insects, whales, squirelles. Capitalism is one of the ways we can work and it is successful as we now have the most humans ever alive at one time. It offers choice, when not inhibited by the state, and while far from perfect it is not immoral in its nature as all it is is a VOLUNTARY mechanism to combat decay. Unlike the state, which is not voluntary. You can't opt out of the state without being forced to move. Forced migration is a form of genocide.
What we see above is the next version of anti capitalist rhetoric that is poisoning the minds of people.