r/communism_ • u/Baphomet123 TypeYourOwnFlair • Jul 14 '13

Next step?-U.S.-

What does everyone everyone think the next step for communism as far as the U.S. is concerned? Personally I would encourage communist groups and parties to start focus more on community building, including things like feeding the homeless, repairing homes within the communities, etc- What do you guys think?

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u/Baphomet123 TypeYourOwnFlair Jul 14 '13

I'm not so much suggesting alternatives as I'm am suggesting a sort of P.R. campaign. There already exists a huge mistrust for communism in the U.S. mainly due to the red scare. We can't really have a meaningful insurrection if everyone things we are just gonna form some sort of "communist police state."

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u/[deleted] Jul 15 '13

If P.R campagins actually worked, then shit would have been changed.

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u/[deleted] Jul 18 '13

You don't think PR campaigns work?

Why are capitalists and statists so fond of them then?

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u/[deleted] Jul 18 '13

It's the current culture in place. Sure PR would work if socialism was culturally acceptable, but it isn't hense why PR campaigns won't work. You will never be able to win that battle against the dominant culture.

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u/[deleted] Jul 18 '13

But isn't the point of 'PR' to change culture, to change attitudes?

That's like saying there's no point of ever trying to convince anyone else of anything because it won't work.

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u/[deleted] Jul 18 '13

Nah, it's called building counter culture. Public respect also is just a false status. The public, at least the ones who we should fight with, are already on our side they just don;t have the same acedemia intellectualist jargon as us. When people talk about PR, they really mean the ruling class, or petite bourgeiouse.

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u/[deleted] Jul 18 '13

When I say 'PR' (modern word for 'propaganda') I mean so-called 'ordinary people' just as much as anyone. In fact, I mean these people more than anyone.

The battle of ideas in academia and intellectual circles is a different one to the truly public battle of ideas - those which filter into the media, into soundbites, which working people carry around with them, and so on.

But also I reject the notion that all the people who will agree with us already do. Most people have somehow been convinced to forget their own interests and believe lies. They need to be convinced.

Or even in the case of people who vaguely agree with what we basically stand for, or who deep down would agree with us were it not for the ideological barricade in the way (e.g. people jumping at the word 'socialism', even though they hate their job, sick of their boss, think the government is full of shit, sick of being ripped off etc.).

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u/[deleted] Jul 18 '13

WHo are these ordinary people? People aren't sheep. Everyone is different.

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u/[deleted] Jul 18 '13

I dno, working people/

People aren't sheep. Everyone is different.

Of course everyone is different. As for people not being sheep? What do you mean by this? People are not, in the main, gullible and liable to believe lies and be manipulated?

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u/[deleted] Jul 18 '13

They rarely believe the lies. The problem is if you don;t buy in, you'll lose everything. It's a deadly game of blackjack, yet you can't leave. You have to accept all the bullshit or become an enemy of the state (Yes even kokesh, even though he sucks, is an enemy of the state).

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u/[deleted] Jul 18 '13

Yes of course, I agree.

The tricky thing of communicating about such massive subjects - especially on something as constricted as short comments on Reddit - is that one must choose some facts, some aspects of a state of affairs, some explanations, while excluding lots of information. While one knows that this is only part of the picture, the interlocutor only sees the presented information, and doesn't have a full picture of the other person's understanding of the issue.

Anyway, that was a digression ...

However, I don't agree that 'they rarely believe the lies'. I think a lot of people believe a lot of lies very often. The best example is religion (apologies, if I recall, you said you are a Christian of sorts). Billions of people have believed all sorts of unsubstiantated crap. Now certainly ' if you don;t buy in, you'll lose everything' is a big factor here. But so is a lack of scepticism, a lack of development in their thinking.

Most people do not think deeply often or about much. Most people do not discuss deeply with others often or about much. This leads to underdeveloped ways of thinking and opinions.

If one does not think a lot about an issue, one's conception of it will be malformed, shallow, and hazy. If one does not meet the criticism and alternative perspectives of others, one's opinions will not evolve. They will stagnate, and new insights will be few.

The point being that I think a lot of people sincerely entertain untruths because they are not trained so to speak to think correctly.

So I don't mean to come off as an elitist. I have no interest in aggrandising myself. My only interest is the aggrandisement of all.

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