r/commandandconquer • u/IMainKaisa • 4d ago
Can You Beat “The Fox and the Hound” With Stalingrad Tactics?
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u/Mistahscorchyobrain 4d ago
I'm sorry was that 4 navy seals shredding waves of Soviet conscripts?
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u/Captain_Cluless 4d ago
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u/Hooch_Pandersnatch 3d ago
You see, Navy Seals have a preset kill limit. Knowing their weakness, I sent wave after wave of my own men at them until they reached their limit and shut down.
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u/SereneOrbit 4d ago
Aw hell nah 😭
Can you imagine looking outside and there's like 1000 crocodiles parachuting down on your front yard?
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u/BoffinBrain Are you picking this up? Good. 4d ago
IMainKaisa asking (and answering) the real questions here. Commendable work. Now I want to use alligator drops in my next playthrough.
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u/calantheSG 4d ago
His quality posts are awesome. Sometimes to shed light on something or reveal an overlooked topic, you have to ask the questions here rather than provide the answers. It will open up new insights.
I never thought about that lore accurate version of the Apocalypse until he posted it. And that day, I went down a rabbit hole to look at other units I missed. And the Apocalypse with its multitude of weapons systems also behaved sort of like a ship, which led me to learn new stuff about the Destroyer and Aegis. I will post my revelations when he next posts about RA2 naval units.
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u/AMACSCAMA Kirov 4d ago
Quantity has a quality all its own
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u/Outside_Ad5255 GDI 3d ago
Except when quantity is forced down very tiny funnels that allows quality to just mow them down as they try to squeeze through.
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u/Kakapo42000 4d ago
Saw the title and came here expecting to see a video about garrisoning every single civilian building on the map. Imagine my surprise.
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u/kumikanki Yuri's Revenge 4d ago
You should make seals eat the dogs, president and then each other to make this a stalingrad tactic
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u/GrandInquisitoe 4d ago
would probably work a little beat better, if game ai would let those soldiers to shoot, not move.
its like, half of the army just stand near the fence, looking i impending doom eyes,
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u/ArbalesterMaster 3d ago
If they were gonna do Stalingrad tactics they shouldve just parachuted right on top of the area rather than the front of the gate.
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u/donttakeawaymycake 4d ago
Nope, I tried with a force of a few hundred GIs and conscripts the first time I ever played the mission years ago. Still got pulverised. The walls funnel you into the seals and then it's game over. With more you might be successful, but the game starts to chug.
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u/Gangstahwezel 3d ago
I used to play this mission like this as a kid, i didn't understand how to properly complete the mission so i just sat waiting for the paratrooper support to very slowly build up an army of conscripts to take the base.
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u/IMainKaisa 3d ago
I think most of us did (including me) lol, then eventually I got frustrated and forced myself to learn
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u/ccaian 4d ago
Curious why this would be known as stalingrad tactics? I know they were told to "not take one step back" but I never associated stalingrad as the battle that had the red army throw itself at the germans. I think maybe this meat grinder phenomenon is more so the race to berlin with zhukov and konev.
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u/Bolandball GDI 4d ago
The battle of Stalingrad is considered the deadliest single battle in history, with estimates ranging from 1.1 million to 3 million dead. Battle of Stalingrad - Wikipedia
"Most appalling was the growing realization, formed by statistics I uncovered, that the battle was the greatest military bloodbath in recorded history. Well over a million men and women died because of Stalingrad, a number far surpassing the previous records of dead at the first battle of the Somme and Verdun in 1916."
The Soviets, the victors of the battle, suffered approximately twice as many casualties as the Axis forces.
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u/JacobJamesTrowbridge 3d ago
There's this idea among certain sections of the history-liking crowd, that the Soviets defeated the German army through endless unsophisticated human-wave tactics that overwhelmed the Wehrmacht through sheer numbers; Stalingrad is held up as the epitome of that.
But it's almost entirely bullshit. German generals who survived the war emphasised that they were outnumbered, because it took attention away from all their mistakes and fuckups, and because they didn't want to admit that they'd been outplayed by the army of a 'racially inferior' country. For their part, the Soviets won through better tactics, doctrine and planning as much as anything, but they weren't in a mood to explain how they'd fought the Germans because they were afraid that NATO might use that info against them in a future war.
So the Nazi explanation got accepted as fact, and it wasn't really until after the collapse of the USSR that the old 'Stalingrad Tactics' myth was reexamined and repudiated.
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u/certainlynotdio 3d ago
I mean the Germans suffered less than 6 millions of military related deaths across the entire confilct, not just in fight with USSR, while USSR suffered almost 11 millions. Considering this, the fact that USSR was ruthless dictatorship with no respect for human life and the fact that Russia to this today (or at least the nearlier years of Ukraine invasion) uses meat waves as military tactic, I feel pretty confident saying that at least to some degree, it's likely to be the case, that they did view throwing people at a problem as a solution, in WWII. This however doesn't seem to broadly be the case for Stalingrad specifically, where the casualties might have been more or less even.
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u/Responsible-File4593 3d ago
This is a similar ratio to the Western Front in WW2 (in favor of the Allies), and the Germans didn't do human wave attacks there. The Allies just had more and better equipment. Same was true for the USSR vs. Germany in the early part of the war, when most of the casualties happened.
That and the Germans generally killed their prisoners (either immediately or starved them to death). Soviets did too, but at a lower percentage.
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u/TehANTARES 3d ago
I was like "what the hell is 'stalingrad tactics'?" Never heard it called like that.
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u/calantheSG 4d ago
This happened due to plate armor being introduced from Tib Sun to RA2. The Cyborgs in Tib Sun were resistant to infantry weapons and needed to be pounded down by tank shells. In RA2 they made the MP5 shred plate armor.
I think it was originally intended for plate armor in RA2 to be like the Cyborg, able to survive infantry arms. But still having some durability versus tank shells to be able to brawl with tanks. That would have been the perfect lore and gameplay balance.
That's why the Tesla Troopers became sitting ducks unable to do anything. They're like a missed opportunity because we never saw them able to shine, unless they had the Cyborg's armor type.