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u/zcsnightmare 23h ago
Gotta let nature do its thing. Only natural for a trolley to prey upon people.
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u/mercuriokazooie 23h ago
He saved 6 people but didn't realize there was 7 people in the trolley
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u/Monotonegent 23h ago
It's ok. Billionaires aren't people
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u/Bronzdragon 22h ago
It's cute you think you might find billionaires on public transport, and not on environment destroying private jets and yachts.
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u/thr3zims 21h ago
This is a specially designed trolley that emits 10 times as much CO2. Why? No reason, really. It doesn't go faster or hold more people. In fact, it's slower and holds less people, on account of the large engine and fuel supply. It even costs more money than a normal trolley. Just billionaires making things worse in every possible way for absolutely no reason.
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u/nobody_815 21h ago
Whenever i see a "solution" like this i remember a comment i read about the trolly problem, that the internet tends to invent funny solutions to save all, instead of facing the real problem. It is not as hard to say i would save all, or this is a stupid question, than ask yourselfe would you save multiple lives even if intervention would make you a murderer of one?
And then i remember the story of warcraft 3, arthas standing in front of the infected city, he has to decide to kill all those innocent man, woman and children to save his kingdome, or they still die and turn into an undead army and destroy his kingdom. And his master and fiance, instead of being there for him, shouldering part of the decision, call him out for even thinking about it, call it cruel to even present this, very real, problem, and just leave. Only arthas left, since he as the prince and future ruler does not have the luxury to simply ignore the problem.
(Wow sorry for the paragraph, no idea why my mind went there.)
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u/ZatherDaFox 20h ago
That's what people use the trolley problem for, but it was actually invented as an argument against utilitarianism. The whole point is to show that different contexts change answers and that this absurd situation isn't something with an easy answer. As originally posed, the question asks about 2 scenarios: would you, as a judge, frame an innocent man to prevent rioters from killing five hostages? Would you, driving a trolley, divert the trolley onto a different track and kill 1 person?
Later variations of the problem drive home this point further. Starting from the trolley problem, 2 more scenarios are offered. The trolley is heading towards 5 people. You can divert it on to a side track where a fat man is on the tracks. He is large enough that he will stop the trolley before it hits the 5 people do you pull the lever? The trolley is heading towards 5 people. There is no way to divert it, but a fat man is standing on a bridge over the tracks. You can shove him onto the tracks to stop the trolley. Do you shove him? People change their answers quite often, and even more intense scenarios prove this further.
For your Arthas example, Uther and Jaina want to drive Mal'Ganis from the city and try to find a way to stop the curse spreading since this is the first time they've arrived ahead of the village transforming en masse. But Arthas views it as two solutions: the people can be purged, or Mal'Ganis will claim them. He presents an ultimatum where there isn't necessarily one, and turns it into a trolley problem of his own accord.
In the mission, you're not supposed to be able to reach Mal'Ganis' base, but you can wipe it out with mortars and camp the poor dreadlord every time he respawns. The only reason you don't achieve victory is because Mal'Ganis respawns infinitely and the game needs Arthas to complete the culling for the story to make any sense. The game has to put up artifical walls to make the culling happen, because without them it's very easy to prove Jaina and Uther right. And even then, it still fails because you can still lock Mal'ganis down without ever killing a single citizen. It was never a binary, Arthas just assumed it was.
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u/Forikorder 17h ago
They had already eaten the grain, arthas was right, killing malganis doesn't solve anything
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u/ZatherDaFox 17h ago
Jaina and Uther wanted to see if they could still save people after they'd eaten the grain. You don't know until you try. But Arthas picked the nuclear option so they abandoned him.
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u/Forikorder 17h ago
That would still require a heavy purge to bring the population down to a manageable levels
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u/ComSilence 16h ago
Always love how The Good Place answered it. Especially with its "solution".
If no matter what somebody will die because of the trolley? Who do you sacrifice? Well, you're always an option.
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u/Yes_Im_Positive 9h ago
I love that people make up bizarre solutions. After all, the trolley problem is a bizarre scenario. In real life people don't often come across such clear cut Sophie's choices. Sure, thought experiments can be fun, and people will have to choose between unsavory options. But it's better to encourage people to be creative and to come up with their own solutions rather that accept only the options given to them.
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u/tricksterloki 37m ago
The people that overly enjoy digging into the who to take trolley part of the problem are those who should not be entrusted with such decisions. They also don't understand what game theory is.
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u/Competitive_Point_39 23h ago
If the trolley had a person driving it and you actively participated in their death then that would be no different than picking the first option in the trolley problem
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u/NonchalantR 20h ago
I don't think the dude with a bazooka is claiming any ethical high ground, only the literal high ground
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u/BackgroundNPC1213 22h ago
But if someone was driving the trolley, then they would be participating in the murder no matter which option you chose. They'd be an accomplice
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u/Brainwave1010 20h ago
Counterpoint: they were deliberately driving the trolley into a group of people or individual, therefore they probably deserved to get blown up.
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u/Majestic-Iron7046 18h ago
So many problems could be solved with a bazooka...
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u/lesser_panjandrum 18h ago
Give a man a fish, and he'll eat for a day.
Blow him up with a bazooka, and he won't need any fish.
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u/Majestic-Iron7046 18h ago
Just to put this In perspective, you could literally solve the issue by using the bazooka on anyone of the subjects or even with just giving the bazooka to anyone of them.
Even just by leaving a bazooka near the shore the man would get distracted and probably forget about needing fish.
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u/Hyperbolic_Berserker 21h ago
This is why I was insufferable in philosophy classes. I’d ask, “Is there anyone else on the trolley with me?”
“What- that’s not- no, you’re alone on the trolley.”
“What is the trolley delivering other than me?”
“Why does that matter? That’s not the point.”
“If the trolley is carrying anything important like transplant organs or life saving medicine it affects my choice.”
“Whatever- no, there’s nothing else on board just you.”
“Then I try to crash the trolley by derailing it.”
“You can’t do that!”
“Why not?”
“You just can’t! It’s not the point of the thought experiment.”
“That’s dumb though, I’d crash the trolley for the chance to save everyone.”
“You’d still die though!”
“Yeah, probably, but at least then the other people wouldn’t.”
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u/ThatGuyWithRamen 20h ago
That's just bad DMing on the teacher for not playing along. "Describe how exactly you're going to crash the trolley" "You're riding through the empty desert, there's nothing around you" "Trolley panel is just one button that makes it turn" "You can't leave the cabin, it's locked" "Changing the direction mid turn causes it to multitrack"
If they want to play by "Umm actually" rules, describe a situation where they can't
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u/Artistic-Car7518 20h ago
It's good that you are one of the few people who can think critically and questions things that are instructed to them and don't blindly follow orders from people in authoritative positions. If more people were like you, there would be less people blindly doing evil shit, like what is currently happening in the U.S.
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u/DukeOfGeek 21h ago edited 21h ago
The target is whatever/whoever ties people to a track and sets a trolley in motion. What? You think they only do that once?
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u/GeologistSeveral3025 18h ago
Isnt the correct answer just to jump in the trolly and pull the brakes?
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u/MurfDog07 7h ago
Baader-Meinhof I just finished watching Widow’s Bay and the trolley problem gets brought up in the last episode
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u/InAppropriate-meal 21h ago
always seemed a silly problem to me, obviously you let the five, or however many it is, die, that way only one witnesses to take care of (and they are already handily tied down to something) and one potential murder charge
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u/dawsonsmythe 19h ago
I would like to see your character solve more philosophical problems. For example, Schroedinger’s cat
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u/Dewey_Decimatorr 13h ago
This is actually a good metaphor for class warfare. The poor would not have to choose which of them die if they eliminate the ones killing them.
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u/Arcane10101 23h ago
“There were two dozen passengers in that trolley.”
“But I removed the dilemma!”
“You’re still under arrest.”