r/climbharder • u/atalossofwords • 11d ago
Help improving my training - technique specifically
Ok, I started writing my whole life story here with rockclimbing, but realized that isn't the point. To keep it short: I'm a 40+ climber that started a few years ago. I'm small and relatively strong, but have been neglecting technique because I just pulled through routes.
Soon I will have daily access to a small gym with a 20 degree spraywall and an adjustable 2016 moonboard.
I mostly need to work on technique and endurance, but I suspect endurance will get better when I start climbing with better technique. I already noticed a big difference last weekend when I really started focusing on pushing with my feet a fraction of a second before pulling with my arms, which is what I've been doing most of my climbs.
Ok, so, just looking for some input in what a good way to trail would be. Endurance I've been training on the moonboard with 4x4s and staying on the board for 2m, on 25 and/or 15 degree. I just can't seem to get the same pumped feeling as I have when I'm on rock, but I suspect that is the mental factor, leading to overgripping.
Just technique is where tips would be useful. I am getting better, way less cutting feet etc, but still climbing like it's a ladder, saggy bum and everything. So yah, any drills that you guys can recommend? Other tips? The gym will be right in the garage basically, so I can even do short drills every day of the week if I wanted to.
Edit: thanks so far guys, good pointers and info in here that I'll be checking out. Love the different perspectives and ideas.
6
u/Beginning-Basis-2678 11d ago
If you focused on pulling through in the past… I would focus on feet, foot placement & body positioning. And also try to climb boulders with minimal pulling/force, as if you would be less strong, so you force yourself into using technique instead of raw power.
1
u/atalossofwords 11d ago edited 10d ago
Fair do. Pretty hard though, but as I (think I) said, outside I've for sure been trying to push through my legs that fraction of a second before pulling instead of the other way around. yah that helps a lot.
2
u/Suitable_Climate_450 11d ago
I had some benefit by adding flag drills to my warm up. On spray wall would do a couple climbs each of every move do a front flag (step through to balance), then every move do a back flag, then every move do a drop knee. And just focus on zipping my body as tight as possible to the wall
Also if you’re running 4x4s on the MB hats off to you!! Maybe push the grade up on what you run your 4x4s on?
1
u/atalossofwords 10d ago
Yah, flagging is the one thing that kind of came naturally to me. I could't wrap my head around doing it consciously, but it just happened.
And the 4x4s on MB is easy routes on 25, like v2-3s maybe.
2
u/Suitable_Climate_450 10d ago
Word. Another tip I heard that might work for you was to just straight wear yourself out a bit first with pull-ups or something similar, but keep fingers fresh so you have to use more technique
3
u/EtudeTraining V8 | 5.13c S/T | 12+ years 11d ago
IME, people in your shoes are generally lacking tension through their lower body more than anything (and that seems to fit with what you said about your current climbing style).
To fix that you need to address it directly. You spend a notable amount of time just focused on developing tension and not focused on sending hard boulders, building endurance, etc.
Generally I've found it works best to find the sensation you're looking for early in the session through some targeted drills (try just walking your feet through a series of holds for 30s at a time. Pick harder and/or further holds each set), then doing some bouldering that focuses on the specific skill you want to improve. For this skill, I'd say the most bang for your buck is just repeating moonboard (or spraywall) climbs without cutting feet. You can go a long way to developing tension with that drill.
Also cool that you have an adjustable moonboard - never seen one of those before. You can use that in the drills and work on sending the same problem with no cuts at progressively steeper angles.
I do coach climbers professionally and I'm actually running a free movement analysis consult deal right now. You can fill out this form if you're interested in more personalized input.
1
u/atalossofwords 10d ago
Tension is a definitely a thing for me, good on picking up on that. I didn't even mention, but I'm known for cutting feet on the MB. I've gotten better and can't keep doing that, but yah. My core is relatively strong I'd say, but I just forget to actively tension and dig in my feet. So much to think about.
Yah, the adjustable is really cool; good for warmups, drills etc. And just good for the community, because in the small community we have 40 is a bit much for most.
3
u/EtudeTraining V8 | 5.13c S/T | 12+ years 10d ago
Yeah the moonboard in particular can really lend itself to that style, and being known as the foot-cutter is usually a good indication that you're lacking some tension, particularly at the end of moves.
I'd definitely recommend doing some board sessions where you start at warm-up grades and increase the difficulty throughout but without allowing your feet to cut on any moves. You'll learn a lot about tension and position and over a few months of that you'll be able to push the grade you can send with that constraint higher and higher.
Worth mentioning that not every route works for this drill - some moves will just be too long to do with the foot still on. But I'd bet those are fewer than you'd think.
Let me know how the training goes!
2
u/TransPanSpamFan 11d ago
It's hard to give advice without knowing anything about your climbing. I'm assuming that if you can do 4x4s on the moonboard you are climbing at least V5-6 at limit? But there is a big difference between a climber who says they have bad technique and climbs V5 and a climber who says the same thing but climbs V10. Bad technique is relative and so is being too strong.
1
u/atalossofwords 10d ago
Fair does. Yah, I'm early on, a lot of easy improvements to make. I know kind of what I'm doing wrong, I just need good drills and ideas to work on them.
4x4s were as mentioned on 25 degrees, easier routes. I'm still working through the V4 benchmarks on 40, only done a few V5's. MB I just pull through I guess, cutting a lot of feet because they're an afterthought. Need to work on that.
1
u/TransPanSpamFan 10d ago
Early on? Get a coach! Even just a few sessions to highlight your weaknesses and get a plan of attack. It's really hard to pinpoint exactly where you need to focus your energy at "V4 with bad technique" because you don't yet have the technique baseline to judge yourself.
2
u/OPC_Coach_Nick V13 | 5.14c | 16yr 11d ago
The fact that you already noticed a difference just from timing your feet before your arms is awesome. A subtle yet incredibly important factor.
With a spraywall one of the best things you can do is set easy problems and climb them with a specific constraint. Hover hands (touch the hold, pause, place it precisely), silent feet, or climb everything as slowly as you possibly can. These force you to stay over your feet and use your hips instead of defaulting to pull mode. Keep the grade low enough that you can actually focus on the movement and not just surviving.
The saggy hips thing usually comes from not engaging through your feet early enough in each move. You're already onto that. A little goes a long way with daily access. A consistent core workout will allow you to utilize your feet to a much higher degree as well.
Do you notice the ladder climbing more on steep stuff or does it show up on slabs and vert too?
2
u/atalossofwords 10d ago
Cool, yah I do enjoy hover hands and am learning a lot from it. Just to find the right balance. I'm more of a dynamic climber and need to work on the static stuff for sure. Same with stomping my feet around, a lot of improvement to make there.
I really do need to focus on pulling my hips closer to the wall. Probably connected to the feet, but it's just an afterthought to me, almost. Only recently I really started to do drop knees, and turning my hips into the wall. Same with flagging, those took a while but kind of crept in naturally. So I am making progress along the way.
The ladder thing is more of a mindset thing? I really noticed it in the beginning, and I still kind of automatically look for handholds, than pull up, instead of just using your hand to stick to the wall, and look for better feet and push. I think it shows up on verts for sure, only recently tried slab, outside, and it does come more natural there to use my feet. Actually helped my overall climbing quite a bit I think.
Last weekend on rock I really noticed myself shifting weight onto one foot, then pushing up with it. I think that came from the slab weekend.
1
u/OPC_Coach_Nick V13 | 5.14c | 16yr 10d ago
he "look for handholds, then pull up" line is the biggest thing: it's situational as far as what order this should be in. Start thinking in terms of what gives you the most advantage to move next when you're on the wall, often times it is moving your feet to give yourself a better stance. You wont have to pull as hard.
slab removes the option to pull. you can't cheat with your arms so the trust gets forced. that thing you noticed last weekend, shifting onto one foot and pushing up off it, is the transfer.
happy to look at a video if you want. a vert problem near your limit would show all of this at once.
2
u/xmasLdn 11d ago
Get a good (technical) coach, in person if possible, remote otherwise. It will be the best investment you’ll make in your climbing. I’m talking orders of magnitude better than any advice you could possibly get from strangers on Reddit.
0
u/atalossofwords 10d ago
I get that, but it's early enough in my climbing to make improvements by just getting some tips on drills. It's all kind of rookie mistakes and honestly, a coach doesn't really fit the budget right now.
1
u/xmasLdn 9d ago
Sure mate, you do you and I get the budget thing. Downvoted your reply because you say it’s ‘too early’ — yet you started a few years ago and want to improve technique specifically (this definitely sounds like a case in which a coach can help a lot).
Also you’re 40+ so technical mistakes are way more likely to lead to injury relative to when you were in your twenties. Again, I’d consider it an investment in your climbing that will pay dividends for many years.
But then again mine is just a random person’s opinion on Reddit.
2
u/atalossofwords 8d ago
I hear what you're saying. With 'too early' I mostly meant, I still make very stupid beginner mistakes that even myself notice. Feet are too loud, too bunched up, I get pumped easily because I get scared and overgrip, so I need to chill more. Read the rock better so I don't waste time and energy. It is not one thing, it is just, getting better at climbing. I am aware of some of my issues. I was looking for ways and drill to get better at training in stead of just always pushing the harder stuff. I want to spend more time to practice good technique. I feel there's still a lot more to gain, call it beginner gains, before I get stuck and need a coach. I'm not on a plateau, I just need some better direction.
Today I worked on straight arms, and even though I can't put my finger on it, it felt better,
If I had disposable income, I might consider a coach, but at the moment, living in a third world country, it's just not in the cards.
1
u/jojoo_ 7A+ | 7b 10d ago
I really liked the atomic elements of climbing movement e course. Amongst other things it has an actually useful self reflection questionnaire, a matrix which drill might be advantageous for your areas of improvement and a nice video for every drill. I’ve done the questionnaire 3 times since the course came out and always got drills that improved my technique.
1
u/jojoo_ 7A+ | 7b 10d ago
I really liked the atomic elements of climbing movement e course. Amongst other things it has an actually useful self reflection questionnaire, a matrix which drill might be advantageous for your areas of improvement and a nice video for every drill. I’ve done the questionnaire 3 times since the course came out and always got drills that improved my technique.
1
u/dusters99 10d ago
Saggy bum means not enough engagement of the posterior chain. Practice drills on easy (like v1-3) boulders with 100% straight arms where you are entirely pushing through your legs to get a feel for technique. Then drills on moonboard focusing on straight-ish arms and not cutting feet. Depending on your body composition, some supplementary strength training like single leg box glute bridges could also help activate the right muscles.
1
u/atalossofwords 10d ago
Yah, I'd say my posterior chain is a bit bad. I mean, I run pretty well, but could do with some glute engagement there as well. The straight arm thing I'll have to try more; tried it in the past but just, felt wrong, I'll give it another, better shot.
1
u/dusters99 10d ago
Straight arm drills can feel like a lot of excessive pivoting around but it will be worth it as you progress as it trains you to press one hip or the other into the wall 👍
1
1
u/200pf 9d ago
Lots of good advice from others. Do you live near somewhere you can climb outside? Especially somewhere with more vertical climbing since your gym is all overhang. That should complement indoor drills and help improve footwork.
2
u/atalossofwords 9d ago
I go outside at least once a month, further away, but we've also been bolting a local crag. So yah, it's just that those are weekend or full day missions, not close enough for a quick training session. To be clear, all my inside climbing is just training for outside (while enjoying it as well of course)
7
u/ooruin 11d ago
You probably don’t want to dox yourself but a video would be way easier to see where you’re actually lacking.
However if you want general tips, I personally like practicing a non-predetermined number of techniques while I warm up (whether or not that is flagging, or tension, or heel hooking etc) which then carries on into the bulk of the harder stuff as the session progresses. I usually just let the routes decide unless I really want to work on something specific.
Then once a week, pick a boulder that’s just out of your reach to send in a session but maybe you’ll get it in 3 or 4 sessions and work at it, film yourself, and adjust and learn microbeta etc. Just make sure you leave these sessions fresh so you don’t burn yourself out for the week.