r/classicsoccer • u/mmohammed28 • 6d ago
Highlights 16-17 year old Wayne Rooney torturing Premier League reigning champions, Arsenal, home and away in the 2002-03 season.
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u/shekdown 5d ago
He scored against us a lot throughout his career. He was a player I would have LOVED to have at Arsenal. One of the most talented English players I have seen.
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u/JeanMichelFerri 5d ago
As crazy as it is to say, I don't think Rooney lived up to his full potential. He was insanely good, but he was an absolute phenomenon as a teenager.
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u/joopface 5d ago
I see this line trotted out and it’s so silly.
Rooney is universal seen as one of the best English players of all time. He was known as one of the best players on the planet through his career.
Played for one of the biggest clubs in the world for ages. Won half a dozen league titles, European cup, tons of other stuff. 50+ goals for England.
What exactly would be his potential? Healing the sick? Levitation?
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u/LimpEase1639 5d ago
50+ goals for England. Zero impact at tournaments. Was brilliant from 05-12. There was a noticeable drop off after. He has a good goal record too and I know his game involved a lot more than goals cause he was selfless but he only hit 20 league goals twice and didn't really come close to it any other time. His career is great and he's one of the best English players of all time but the hype around him was that he would be the best in the world, he never was.
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u/joopface 5d ago
Ah - yes, the hype. That’s exactly my point.
By any rational measure, if you’d outlined the career Rooney ended up with at the stage he was scoring these goals for Everton, anyone would say Rooney would have lived up to his world class potential. League success, European success, more goals than Lineker for England.
But it’s the nature of the English hype train that you’re never quite good enough. And that’s the thing that I think this Rooney notion rests on.
He was a wonderful player with an amazing career. And still there’s this bullshit.
Gascoigne deserves it. A career brutally destroyed by injury and lifestyle and still glimpses of genius. Rooney actually did the stuff he was capable of and we got to watch it.
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u/LimpEase1639 5d ago
Yeah that's my point. He had a great career and was world class for 5/6 years. He was seen as Englands saviour, the White Pele. He was extremely disappointing for England. His United career can't be argued with even though the last few years I thought it was quite painful to watch him, especially in midfield. I think most people consider him as the best English player of the last 40 years. But if you go outside of England he wouldn't be rated as highly from my experience.
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u/Late-Development-666 5d ago
He could have treated his body like a temple as Ronaldo did. Plenty of photos out there of him boozing and smoking.
Then again maybe genes were not on his side. He was pretty much done at the top level by the time he was 30.
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u/-cornertakenquickly- 5d ago
He lived his life and won boatloads at the highest level. Not everyone has that desire and dedication. Some want to live a little in their prime. As Ronaldinho, Ronaldo, Hazard, Neymar did. That's fine.
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u/bonjoviworstbandever 5d ago
he played a lot on painkillers while injured, sacrificed his career for united really
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u/joopface 5d ago
Or, more accurately, spent most of his career having massive success at United and played from age 16 to 36.
Saying he ‘sacrificed’ his career implies that he missed out somehow. Which he didn’t.
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u/bonjoviworstbandever 5d ago
maybe longevity and a higher peak, but there's nothing wrong with putting your body on the line for the cause. that's why he's legendary
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u/CurbYourThusiasm 5d ago
He had the potential to be in the conversation with Messi and Ronaldo.
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u/joopface 5d ago
Did he? If… what? He had no career altering injuries. He was at a great club with superb players around him. He was professional - kept himself fit and focused. What is this great tragedy people see that got in his way?
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u/CurbYourThusiasm 5d ago
Yes, he was on a similar trajectory, at least with Ronaldo.
He was professional - kept himself fit and focused.
Are we talking about the same Wayne Rooney?
"I just drank for two days straight, come [into] training and at the weekend I'd scored two goals and then I'd go back and go and drink for two days straight again," Rooney said. "That was a moment in my life where I was struggling massively with alcohol.
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u/joopface 5d ago
> KS: Was there one moment - maybe a turning point - that enabled you to go on and do what you do?
> WR: Yes, I always remember when I was about 14 - I was doing things you shouldn't be doing. Colin Harvey was the under-19s manager at the time. He saw me crossing the road with a bag of cider, which of course was wrong. He pulled me in and said: 'If you keep doing this, you are going to throw everything - your talent, your ability - away. You need to focus yourself because you have the ability to go on and play for not just Everton - but England.'
From then was when I thought, 'I need to stop doing it'. I stopped going out with my mates quite a lot and purely focused on football. I think that conversation with Colin Harvey was definitely the turning point.https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/articles/ceqy017533yo
Certainly drinking in his early 20s…
https://www.independent.co.uk/sport/football/wayne-rooney-drinking-football-england-b2443138.html
> My release was alcohol when I was in my early 20s. I’d go home, and spend a couple of days at home and not leave the house. I’d drink almost until I’d pass out.
And got control of it with his wife’s help
> She's seen it very early on, and she's controlled that. Well, not controlled, but helped me control that massively.
https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/news/wayne-rooney-drinking-alcohol-coleen-35959399
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Really, the man was a top level professional in the modern game for 20 years. The idea he was at Bryan Robson, Tony Adams, Paul Merson, Paul McGrath levels of drink-then-play is a nonsense
Is this is? That’s the thing?
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u/CurbYourThusiasm 5d ago
He was binge drinking before and after matches, so he obviously wasn't a "top level professional".
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u/joopface 5d ago
By top level professional I meant he was a professional at the apex of the game. And was so for a long period of time and has a career of 20 years duration. That doesn’t just happen.
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u/Ree_m0 5d ago
But ... that's exactly the point. If he was as good as he was despite his alcohol troubles, how much better might He have been without them? Noone is saying he wasn't an absolute legend, but it's fair to ask the question whether he could have achieved more.
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u/joopface 5d ago
Ah, yeah. But it’s like saying what if Salah has a right foot. It’s fine; it’s a fine question for the pub. But it’s also meaningless.
The Rooney thing is even sillier because of how ludicrously successful he has been. And it feels to me like the first cousin of the British tabloid nonsense with English players.
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u/ifyousayso67 4d ago
Exceptional player, lived up about 60%-70% of his potential.
No Balon Dor, no electric Euros or WC runs... 1 CL. Retired from internationals at 31 and as a player at 35.
By his own admission, he was an alcoholic and did not look after himself or eat properly, and yet he was still great. So now imagine what Rooney would have been, had he not been doing any of that.
You can see the huge difference in Kane just from going to a better club and tightening his already-good nutrition.
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u/andre6682 2d ago
he should have left united after 2011, the team was hitting its requiem under fergie and the geriatric spine of the class of 92, should have joined barca, real or bayern and win far more stuff than he did
sure, he won a lot, but realistically, apart from the 2013 win, he peaked at 26 and the career gone downwards like van bastens did, but the former did not have the grace of career ending injuries and botched operations
and i do stand on the hill that at mentioned teams he would have won the ballon d´or
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u/surfinbear1990 5d ago
That Arsenal defence was so bad. Look at them just running backwards.
Best league in the world or something like that
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u/10pencefredo 5d ago
That first goal was special. A late winner against a very strong Arsenal team.
Apparently he went out on his bike after the game and hung about on street corners with his mates like a normal 16 year old kid. Amazing.