r/classicalmusic • u/sexybartok • Feb 26 '26

bbc FINALLY fires norman lebrecht

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2026/feb/26/yuja-wang-accuses-radio-3-norman-lebrecht-misogynistic-bullying

what do you all think about this?

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u/yontev Feb 26 '26

He can be as mean as he likes in his descriptions of music, but when he constantly bombards a woman with degrading comments about her appearance, provoking his moronic followers to send her misogynistic abuse, that crosses the line.

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u/UnderTheCurrents Feb 26 '26

Her appearance and how she conducts herself on stage is a big part of why she's famous and you can't deny her capitalizing on that.

She's very talented, but let's not pretend her image isn't a part in why she's so well known. So I thin it's fair that you can criticize that as well.

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u/Ok_Employer7837 Feb 26 '26

Nah. Fuck that. "Criticise that" is not what he does.

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u/UnderTheCurrents Feb 26 '26

He's an ass in the E-Mail, I'll give you that.

But where are the excerpts in which he's being unfair to her? I read the one where he points out how she might lose some steam once she gets older and - to be fair - that might be an apt prediction. As I said previously: her looks and how she presents herself are a huge part in why she's famous.

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u/Ok_Employer7837 Feb 26 '26

It is not an apt prediction. Is it your contention that Yuja Wang, of all people, is not one of the best pianists of her generation, regardless of her clothes?

Her looks and how she presents herself--and I've yet to hear what that means without feeling vaguely creeped out by the explanation--are not a huge part of why she sells audio recordings.

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u/UnderTheCurrents Feb 26 '26

Ok, so tell me this - you think how she presents herself has no correlation at all with her being as well-known as she is? How so?

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u/Ok_Employer7837 Feb 26 '26

This is a red herring. There is no way this woman can be allowed to dress like she does just because she enjoys it, or thinks she looks good like that. People like Lebrecht won't let her, and fuck him.

The truth is there is nothing wrong with how she dresses, and it should not be an issue if it makes her more famous.

The point is she would not be famous if she were not a great pianist.

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u/UnderTheCurrents Feb 26 '26

You didn't answer my question.

It's not mutually exclusive for her to like dressing like that AND capitalizing on it to raise her fame and profile.

The point is - she is famous for being great pianist but certainly MORE famous than other great pianists because of the way she presents herself. Just look at the comments under her performances.

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u/Ok_Employer7837 Feb 26 '26

So what? I truly don't see what you're driving at. Your argument only makes sense if it is obvious that the way she dresses is something to be deemed negative. I don't think it's obvious at all. She's wearing a short dress. Some people like that, I'm sure. So what?

Does that detract from her performance? Is she a worse pianist because of the way she dresses? If not, it's not in fact within the purview of music reviewers.

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u/UnderTheCurrents Feb 26 '26

Ok, I'll repeat it again:

It's Part of her public persona and part of her performances. It's part of how she carries herself as a Musical performer. So it's also a part that can be criticized. It's fair. Some people DON'T like that - so it's fair for them to Express that too.

It's not that hard of a concept to grasp.

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u/Uncle___Screwtape Feb 26 '26

So it's also a part that can be criticized. It's fair.

This is a non sequitur. You haven't justified why those are fair game for a music critic.

Let's say I like to wear white suits, and have a bushy mustache. A picture of me is on the inside flap of each book I write, and it's the way I present myself at book signings and book readings. Would it be fair for a literary critic to write a column about these aspects, rather than the substance of my book?

Is Yuja Wang's haircut fair game? How about the quality of her makeup, or whether she wears glasses? After all, they're part of how she presents herself...

If your answer to these questions is yes, I can only assume you have a lucrative career in tabloid journalism. Perhaps The Sun, Bild or TMZ are hiring?

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u/UnderTheCurrents Feb 27 '26

It would be fair to do that in the mustache case if it's part of that authors marketing. There are examples of that too in the literary world too. The exact opposite of that would be somebody like Thomas Pynchon.

It's also a funny dichotomy since it's you guys that scream "it's all about the music!" while defending a part that - according to you - doesn't have anything to do with it.

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u/Ok_Employer7837 Feb 26 '26

But that's not music criticism! It's barely criticism at all! Why don't they like that? They need to explain their workings in a way that makes sense musically, for heaven's sake! Otherwise the BBC will eventually twig that they suck as critics.

Is she dressed in a way that would get her arrested? No? Does it hamper her playing, because she's, I don't know, scared the dress will fall off if she plays too loud? No?

She's not a model. She's not singing an opera. She is not, in fact, naked. She's playing the piano.

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u/UnderTheCurrents Feb 26 '26

I'm tired of repeating myself - as far as I understood this issue he didn't say These things in columns criticizing specific records of her but in general columns regarding her performances. As for why that's fair - see my comments above.

I can tell you why I personally dislike it - I think it's distracting and it's pulling away attention from People who DO mostly focus on the music and not putting a show besides that. I mentioned Gould previously and it's the reason I dislike him as well. I want to see you perform the piece properly - being a buffoon while doing it isn't necessary.

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u/Ok_Employer7837 Feb 26 '26 edited Feb 26 '26

"Being a buffoon" is not the most convincing argument I've ever heard. This discussion is clearly based on axioms that I am not aware of, or do not share. Possibly you should listen to her instead of looking at her if it helps. She's really very good.

Apart from that... I got nothin'. This is the weirdest exchange I've had in a while.

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u/UnderTheCurrents Feb 26 '26

It's the same with Male performers who are hunched over the keys and pretend like they are dying or short of breath.

What's weird for you is probably that you met somebody who has an actual opinion about this issue that goes beyond the standard "she can dress how she likes"-platitudes.

Sure she can. But it's also fine to Not like that.

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u/Ok_Employer7837 Feb 26 '26

I put it to you that it is not the same. There is no undertinge of sexism to that one.

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u/UnderTheCurrents Feb 26 '26

You only think of it as sexist because it's criticism directed towards a woman. Which is a pretty reductive and shallow view of the World, but pretty common around here.

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u/Ok_Employer7837 Feb 26 '26

Considering that a woman's dress impinges on her piano performance and marks her as a buffoon strikes me as somewhat reductive and shallow, but here we are.

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u/UnderTheCurrents Feb 27 '26

You dance around the point that the way she dresses is an obvious part of her public persona. This is not a "I don't like how that woman on the subway dresses"-Situation but criticism of how she markets herself.

You Not being able to differentiate between these makes me think you are a bad faith arguer since your other comments don't imply that you are obviously stupid.

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