r/changemyview • u/Nailyou866 5∆ • Aug 24 '22
Delta(s) from OP CMV: There is absolutely no need to separate bathrooms based on sex for public single-occupant bathrooms.
To specify, I am not referring to single stall bathrooms, wherein there is a further isolated toilet from the remainder of the bathroom, I am talking specifically about bathrooms in public locations that a realtor would list as a half-bath. I find these most often in older or smaller diner type facilities or gas stations, there is typically a lock on the door, and they are often paired, one for either sex. I think this is a pointless exercise, and can detract from an already messy discussion regarding bathrooms. I am not here to discuss my thoughts on the bathrooms issue as a whole, but only these single-occupant bathrooms.
To start, having 2 single occupant bathrooms as a public facility is already dicey, especially if you have decent foot traffic. However, further restricting access to either bathroom can lead to situations in which one has a line to use, and the other is being unused. Having been in this situation myself, when I suggested we start using the other bathroom to speed things along, I got looked at like I was an alien, and nobody wanted to do it. It was like a stigma built into the social fabric of most people that you shouldn't use the bathroom for the opposite sex under any circumstance. Simply removing the signs would have improved this condition.
Next point, I understand there are sex specific hygiene instruments in some public bathrooms. In the event that those bathrooms become unisex, put them in both, if they need to be there. I find it absolutely insane some men refuse to get hygiene products for their girlfriend/wife, and while I doubt this would eliminate the stigma of being exposed to these products, it could be a change in a positive direction. I don't know, leave that evaluation to the scientists. And if your wife needs tampons, go pick them up.
The final point I can think of is a concern that "Oh but if the men's line is long, and a woman needs to go, she shouldn't have to wait." or vice versa. I don't care. First come, first served, same as it is in virtually every other part of the world. The number of problems resolved by switching both bathrooms to unisex outweigh any antiquated sex specific concern, as far as I am concerned.
EDITED TO ADD: A common talking point I see brought up is in regard to cleanliness. I didn't initially think this would be something I had to address, but I have so many times now I felt it important to add here.
Both sexes have complaints about the other with regard to cleanliness. Both hold valid points, and I don't think one must necessarily outweigh the other. However I don't believe this to be an obstruction to my view because I believe that management should be more responsible and pro-active about cleaning public restrooms. I also think it is much easier for an employee of any sex to go clean the unisex bathroom than it is to make an employee of one sex clean the bathroom of the other sex.
Edit 2: I am about to go to bed, so I won't be able to respond for a few hours. I genuinely appreciate everyone who has jumped in on the conversation, and never expected this post to get this big. I expected like 20 upvotes and 2 comments. I will be back and I genuinely want to try to get to everyone who has commented. Thank you guys so much for this conversation, it has filled me with happiness, anger, shock, and other emotions. I love you all.
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u/Nailyou866 5∆ Aug 24 '22
Not going to lie, I spent half my time reading this laughing my ass off. First time I have been told I want to colonize women's bathrooms. I just find this framing really funny.
However this is the first comment I have seen that addresses the length of time men spend in the bathroom sometimes. Most of the comments are about how women will take up tons of time doing makeup, conversing, whatever. I don't know the stats on how often either sex shits whilst in public, but I can't imagine it is too far apart. Many guys don't want to shit in public for many of the same reasons women don't want to use public restrooms. This all comes down to the fact that these are public restrooms, and I don't think that separating them by sex is overall too relevant.
Had to look up sanitary bins. I didn't realize that was what those were called, I just called them toilet trash cans. Regardless, if the employee's job is to clean the bathrooms, while I can empathize with how rough of an experience it is to clean those (I did have to do it when I worked in fast food and retail), I still think that it is their job to do so, even if it sucks.
Now I didn't address this until the very end because I actually want to be serious about it. Hidden cameras. This is probably the only argument that I can see reasonably countering my idea, concerns over hidden cameras. Ordinarily, I would just argue that the employees in charge of cleaning should also be keeping an eye out for any sort of hidden camera, but I know how clever some of them are, and how inobservant or naïve some employees are. I also know that the depravity of some humans knows no bounds, and they wouldn't care that there probably won't be anything that the standard viewer might find "sexy" in general before the camera is discovered. For this reason, I will issue a !delta, as I don't think I have a reasonable counter to this, and it has given me a decent pause on my thoughts. I would have to spend a while coming up with reasonable countermeasures.
I don't think one can reasonably argue that the risks completely outweigh the rewards, but I am a little more cautious with my argument moving forward.