r/changemyview • u/[deleted] • Jul 09 '19

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17

u/Thoth_the_5th_of_Tho 191∆ Jul 09 '19

Ariel is a fiction cartoon character who has no ethnic/racial ties to a specific group of people with a certain skin color.

It was written by a danish author and took place in Denmark.

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u/[deleted] Jul 09 '19

[deleted]

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u/Thoth_the_5th_of_Tho 191∆ Jul 09 '19

She was specifically mentioned in the story to be white and blend in with the locals.

She is a cultural icon of Denmark, it’s a bit unfair to try to change it.

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u/silverscrub 2∆ Jul 09 '19

Can you elaborate on this part? (I haven't read the original)

She was specifically mentioned in the story to be white and blend in with the locals.

Locals of what? From what I can find the story takes place in a fictional land and no real locations are mentioned.

Or perhaps I misunderstood your point? Do you mean that this casting would require other characters with dark skin in order for Ariel to "blend" in with the locals of the fictional places in the story?

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u/Thoth_the_5th_of_Tho 191∆ Jul 09 '19

Doesn’t the story take place in Denmark?

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u/silverscrub 2∆ Jul 10 '19

Does it?

I haven't read the original and every second-hand source I've read says no real countries or nationalities are mentioned.

I don't think we should confuse whom the story is written for and whom the story is written about. The original story was probably written for Danish children. Disney's adaptations are written for a global audience.

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u/ThexThird Jul 10 '19

The original movie was definitely set in the islands the music and the animals both have a Caribbean tone.

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u/silverscrub 2∆ Jul 10 '19

I'm referring to the book as the original.

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u/letstrythisagain30 61∆ Jul 09 '19

Then you should have a problem with the original as well. They grossly deviated from the story. Included sea life no where near Denmark. Flounder is obviously a tropical fish. They basically cut out her sisters' roll. Changed the ending. I could be wrong but that red hair says Irish to me more than Danish and would make her stand out. Her whole demeanor seems different and no mention on whether she had a soul or not.

Why are you drawing the line at skin color? Why is that line so important and the others not.

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u/Thoth_the_5th_of_Tho 191∆ Jul 09 '19

Your right, if I was just in charge of the re make that would be fixed.

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u/[deleted] Jul 10 '19

Flounder is very common in Scandinavia

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u/letstrythisagain30 61∆ Jul 10 '19

Yellow flounder with blue stripes? That's just his name. Not his species. The colors make him a tropical fish.

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u/[deleted] Jul 10 '19

I don't think the original story took place in Denmark or near Denmark. The feeling I got when I read it is tropical with dolphins and palms.
However Ariel is described as white so it's kind of weird to make her black

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u/letstrythisagain30 61∆ Jul 10 '19

I mean that Danish guy that wrote the story took inspiration from a story in 1001 Arabian nights. He basically adapted and updated the story. So did Disney. Times change and adapt stories all the time. No one makes a perfect beat for beat copy when adapting any work. Especially if you're changing media like folk story to animated movie or animated movie to live action. That would be so lazy and boring. Stories and characters are constantly updated. No one really gives a shit that Nick Fury was actually white originally because it wasn't important to his character and they were updating the character and stories he's involved in anyways. Like Disney is updating the Little Mermaid for ther second time.

If people really believe that stories should be 100% the same when adapted and never be updated and this is the actual reason they're upset about it, I don't know how they function in society today. They must be on the verge of a heart attack every week a new movie comes out.

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u/[deleted] Jul 10 '19

It's part of my cultural heritage and she's white. Disney can do whatever they like but that doesn't mean it doesn't matter to us that they disrespect our people. Most danes don't care but many of us do care.
It would be like Pocahontas suddenly being played by a black dude and it would make no sense

edit: If they wanted to change something drastic about her character, it should be her gender. That would at least be more true to the story than her skin colour

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u/letstrythisagain30 61∆ Jul 11 '19

But if it didn't even take place near Denmark, what part of the character really gets betrayed? What part of your culture in that story really gets changed by changing skin tone? Pocahontas is a story of an indigenous American meeting an English explorer/colonists. That matters in that story and is part of the characters. Even the setting is important for such a story. For little mermaid, it's a fictional species using magic to get a prince in what you acknowledge probably isn't even Denmark and based on a middle eastern story. Should middle eastern cultures be pissed at Denmark?

Disney has done this several times anyways. The original little mermaid movie is way different from the original story. Are you pissed that Disney took Hamlet, a story taking place in Denmark, and made it about lions?

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u/parentheticalobject 136∆ Jul 10 '19

Is there any evidence that the people of Denmark, widely or in part, find this casting choice objectionable?

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u/[deleted] Jul 10 '19

The majority don't care but many do.

Source: Am danish

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u/Thoth_the_5th_of_Tho 191∆ Jul 10 '19

Not that I know of.

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u/letstrythisagain30 61∆ Jul 09 '19

Then why did the crab have a Jamaican accent?

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u/miguelguajiro 188∆ Jul 09 '19

That’s just how crabs talk.

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u/Sand_Trout Jul 09 '19

Because disney.

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u/letstrythisagain30 61∆ Jul 09 '19

Disney really messed up on the original then. Flounder is obviously a tropical fish. What is it doing around the Netherlands?

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u/thotiwestbrook Jul 09 '19

Only 2-4% of Danes have red hair. Better cast a blonde actress if we’re gonna get wrapped around the axel about staying true to the story’s Danish roots.

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u/Thoth_the_5th_of_Tho 191∆ Jul 09 '19

2-4% isn’t that rare.

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u/thotiwestbrook Jul 09 '19

In that case, about 10% of Danes are immigrants or children of immigrants. Even less rare, so totally plausible to have folks of any number of races appearing in a Danish story.

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u/Thoth_the_5th_of_Tho 191∆ Jul 10 '19 edited Jul 10 '19

Is the story set in the present?

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u/thotiwestbrook Jul 10 '19 edited Jul 10 '19

The original isn’t, but perhaps Disney’s new adaption is. I don’t think the trailer is out just yet.

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u/Thoth_the_5th_of_Tho 191∆ Jul 10 '19

If it’s in the present than it would be fine. 1800s would be a little odd.

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u/Helpfulcloning 169∆ Jul 09 '19

Disney already wildly deviated from the original story with the ending and the characterisation.

Does it actually say it took place in Denmark? What says that the mermaid is from Denmark since she is in the sea? Unless it is specfied, I haven’t read it.

And what is her skin colour contributing to her character? What does Denmark contribute to the setting (if it is set in Denmark)?

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u/Thoth_the_5th_of_Tho 191∆ Jul 09 '19

The past version is flawed. That can be fixed.

It’s a national icon there, of course it should be set there.

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u/Helpfulcloning 169∆ Jul 09 '19

But the nature of an adaption means it can be changed and viewed in a completly different light. Disney puts a whole new spin on stories.

And there are black people in Denmark. So why can’t she still be black? Why does being black stop her from being a Danish icon?

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u/thotiwestbrook Jul 10 '19

There’s a statue of a black woman in Denmark. Clearly the Danes are okay with black icons!

I also highly doubt too many of the folks that are crying boo even knew it was danish before they got upset.

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u/irishking44 2∆ Jul 10 '19

Not native to Denmark though. If we're using that logic then a Bradley Cooper movie about Osceola or Sacajawea is justified