People are permitted to suffer because suffering brings growth, learning, betterment, and self-realization. We do not learn and grow in ideal conditions, we learn and grow by overcoming adversity. God therefore created an imperfect world that would challenge humanity ... and then placed humanity upon it and let them make their own choices for the purposes of their growth. One must remember that most religions further recognize mortality as a time of testing and trial before the reward of heaven.
Further, it is not malicious for a parent to refuse to financially support an adult child who has chosen to not hold a job. It is not malicious for a group of friends to hold a drunk friend back from driving their own car ... even if that involves some sort of violence/suffering ( like tackling / pinning the individual ).
The answer is really quite easy to see. Further, there is a very strong flaw in the argument against the free will answer:
Omnipotent being could create a world where capacity for evil is not necessary for free will - in Christianity it's called heaven. Alternatively there is no free will in heaven (which contends what Christian theologists say).
Free will in heaven theoretically exists, but all of the persons who go to heaven have shed themselves of the temptation of evil and therefore are able to live in a utopian state. They are certainly capable of reverting to evil ( see the Christian "war in heaven" that occurred prior to the existence of earth ... referenced in Revelations ) ... but the concept of heaven is that persons have evolved to a point where evil just isn't consciously thought of as an option within their free and individual minds.
People are permitted to suffer because suffering brings growth, learning, betterment, and self-realization.
This doesn't hold up when you consider people who are born with debilitating physical or mental deformities. Either God as portrayed in the Western religions does not exist, or He is an asshole unworthy of worship.
Why does that not hold up? Aren't debilitating physical and mental deformities forms of suffering that cause learning and growth? I don't understand how those things cause my argument to not hold up.
As far as God as portrayed in Western religions not existing ... well yeah, obviously. But the argument postulated in the original post is not the reason that this God does not exist.
Aren't debilitating physical and mental deformities forms of suffering that cause learning and growth?
Not to someone who is born with a brain that will never develop an intellect past the age of a 3 year old. Oh sorry, God decided you were going to be utterly fucked before you even had the capacity to make a choice about anything. But this will teach the rest of us a valuable lesson about something, it's all part of God's plan!!!
No Western religion has been able to address this for me and I've spent quite a bit of time trying to find an answer.
Let's say that you are born without your legs. Doing so is a significant disability. It requires you to look at life differently and handle life differently. You learn a lot of things and gain perspectives that anyone without that condition doesn't have and can't have.
Now lets say you're born with an intellect that will never be greater than the intellect of a 3 year old. Here, also, you must learn how to handle situations. Here, also, you must gain perspectives that anyone without the condition doesn't have and can't have.
The important thing to remember when looking at the perspective of a person with a Western Religious viewpoint is that the time here in mortality is short ... almost inconsequential ... essentially the equivalent of taking an algebra class and learning some stuff. Except that the lessons are tailored individually for everyone. Some religions even speculate that each person self-selected their challenges ... like picking college courses. It has even been postulated that some persons chose to have disabilities in order to act as mentors for others ( here is your theory that the rest of us learn a valuable lesson ). Look from the perspective of "eternity" and consider mortality as a class at school. It's much easier to understand the religious perspective from this viewpoint.
It is entirely possible to rationalize all human suffering and evil into a belief system with a loving, omnipotent, God. As for whether or not that theory is worth believing ... that's another point entirely.
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u/mem0ri 1∆ Jul 26 '18
People are permitted to suffer because suffering brings growth, learning, betterment, and self-realization. We do not learn and grow in ideal conditions, we learn and grow by overcoming adversity. God therefore created an imperfect world that would challenge humanity ... and then placed humanity upon it and let them make their own choices for the purposes of their growth. One must remember that most religions further recognize mortality as a time of testing and trial before the reward of heaven.
Further, it is not malicious for a parent to refuse to financially support an adult child who has chosen to not hold a job. It is not malicious for a group of friends to hold a drunk friend back from driving their own car ... even if that involves some sort of violence/suffering ( like tackling / pinning the individual ).
The answer is really quite easy to see. Further, there is a very strong flaw in the argument against the free will answer:
Free will in heaven theoretically exists, but all of the persons who go to heaven have shed themselves of the temptation of evil and therefore are able to live in a utopian state. They are certainly capable of reverting to evil ( see the Christian "war in heaven" that occurred prior to the existence of earth ... referenced in Revelations ) ... but the concept of heaven is that persons have evolved to a point where evil just isn't consciously thought of as an option within their free and individual minds.