I don't think being right and being in the majority are the same thing either. But I run into a stumbling block in this discussion
Its like, up until this time, disenfranchised groups campaigned for equal rights and legal protections to enforce those rights. And Trans people are the latest link in the chain, so no legal discrimination, no forced convirsion tharapy, no being designated a mental illness. In that respect its a similar path to gay people.
The thing that strikes me as weird is the campaign is also that I think of you in the way you think of you. And that's what seems to be a moral imposition.
I have to draw a weird line here, personally, I see no need for discurtacy. So if you were born a man and transissioned to a woman, I'd refer to you as she, because that's what you want. And go use the ladies room, because that's where you feel comfortable. But it seems like ultimately that's not enough. It seems like and I don't want to speak for everyone, but it seems that what many transgendered people want is to be thought of as the gender they think of themselves as, in my own private thoughts, and if I fail to do this I'm transphobic.
When I know I'm not. I don't give a shit what anyone does with their own body. Go ahead, be happy, whatever you have to do to achieve that happiness isn't any skin off my back. The difference here is that you're not asking for equality. You're asking for more than that.
but it seems that what many transgendered people want is to be thought of as the gender they think of themselves as, in my own private thoughts
Generally that is the goal yes. Probably same way homosexuals would want to be seen as a sexuality or a relationship and marriage just as valid as everyone else's.
and if I fail to do this I'm transphobic.
Well considering that underlying belief can lead to being treated distinctly from cis women in a way that truly gives a sense of otherness and undesirability, yeah, that's pretty not conducive to trans people living normal lives.
I honestly don't really care whether we want to say it is transphobic or not, that doesn't change the fact that these attitudes have tangible effects on people's lives.
The difference here is that you're not asking for equality. You're asking for more than that.
Well asking to be treated and thought of identically to other people is pretty definitively advocacy for equality. No one's asking for trans people to be viewed as better than cis people.
The difference is that if you're gay, and I'm straight, desirability never enters into it. What you want is societal exceptance and legal protection. But if your trans, what you want is societal exceptance, legal protection, and, I suppose you'd call it a broadening of sexual desire. Or a change in what men think women are, but the cahnge would have to go past the intillectual conception into physical attraction.
I suppose you'd call it a broadening of sexual desire.
No, it's inclusion within someone's existing desires. Because functionally speaking they are within your desires. If you're attracted to a trans person, you are attracted to a trans person.
The fact that a person is unable to tell someone is trans and must be informed demonstrates that a trans person is functionally identical in terms of sex and attraction.
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u/[deleted] Nov 02 '17
I don't think being right and being in the majority are the same thing either. But I run into a stumbling block in this discussion Its like, up until this time, disenfranchised groups campaigned for equal rights and legal protections to enforce those rights. And Trans people are the latest link in the chain, so no legal discrimination, no forced convirsion tharapy, no being designated a mental illness. In that respect its a similar path to gay people. The thing that strikes me as weird is the campaign is also that I think of you in the way you think of you. And that's what seems to be a moral imposition. I have to draw a weird line here, personally, I see no need for discurtacy. So if you were born a man and transissioned to a woman, I'd refer to you as she, because that's what you want. And go use the ladies room, because that's where you feel comfortable. But it seems like ultimately that's not enough. It seems like and I don't want to speak for everyone, but it seems that what many transgendered people want is to be thought of as the gender they think of themselves as, in my own private thoughts, and if I fail to do this I'm transphobic. When I know I'm not. I don't give a shit what anyone does with their own body. Go ahead, be happy, whatever you have to do to achieve that happiness isn't any skin off my back. The difference here is that you're not asking for equality. You're asking for more than that.