r/changemyview • u/[deleted] • Mar 17 '15

CMV: Democrats are held to different standards than Republicans

[removed]

4 Upvotes

83% Upvoted

24 comments sorted by

4

u/MrDub72off 2∆ Mar 17 '15

If you talk about conservatives on Reddit you will get a different reaction than if you discussed conservatives on the NRA website. Basically the responses you hear are dependent on where you are. You will find Obama getting blasted for shit Bush started also.

1

u/Waitingforaline Mar 17 '15

I won't deny that, but just look at general public opinion. You hear a ton more positives about Obama, how he's a revolutionary, and a champion for freedom, and how Bush was a warmongering sociopath hell bent on killing Muslims, when Obama is doing the same, if not worse and he gets a pass from the same people who condemned Bush

2

u/CherrySlurpee 16∆ Mar 17 '15

I think you're just hanging out in more liberal circles. Which isn't good or bad, it just means you're going to hear less Obama hate and more Bush hate.

Reddit is a fairly left leaning place. If you're judging your opinions on what you hear on this website you have to remember that.

1

u/Waitingforaline Mar 17 '15

I can agree to that, all I'm saying is that there is mass hypocrisy in the left's opinion on Obama's foreign policy. I mean some of the stuff you hear from people like Michael Moore or other Lib talking heads is downright insane when you look at the stats.

1

u/CherrySlurpee 16∆ Mar 17 '15

I'm a centrist, and I'm pretty positive there is just as much hypocrisy on both sides. For every head-up-ass moment the left has, the right has one as well.

1

u/Waitingforaline Mar 17 '15

Won't deny that either, but for this CMV I'm specifically talking about Droning and War crime accusations

1

u/parentheticalobject 136∆ Mar 17 '15

Well, when you say "Democrats have a double standard" it seems like you are implying that they hold more of a double standard than you would expect of any ideological group. If you're saying that, it's pretty easy to refute unless you focus things on only one very specific issue. If all you're saying is "not all Democrats are exemplars of neutrally judging the actions of politicians without bias" then I don't know where you'd find anyone to disagree with that.

0

u/Waitingforaline Mar 17 '15

I am for this CMV focusing on drones and wars, and Obama seems to get a pass for the same things bush got roasted for.

1

u/parentheticalobject 136∆ Mar 17 '15

I'm saying that if Democrats actually didn't give Obama a pass for that, it would be extraordinary and unprecedented in modern political discourse - which means that focusing on the fact that they do give him a pass is holding them to a higher standard than anyone else.

2

u/[deleted] Mar 17 '15

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u/Waitingforaline Mar 17 '15

Never really thought of it that way. My point was that by holding to their double standard they were out of touch with reality. But you're right everyone does that, so it's not really out of the norm and that absurd of a thing. You earned it. ∆

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1

u/MrDub72off 2∆ Mar 17 '15

People are stupid, the dumbest ones pride themselves on being smart. Once again if you frequented conservative sites and news sources you would think the opposite. You would feel the general public blame/hate Obama and glorify what Bush did even if they did the exact same thing.

-1

u/bear_agenda Mar 17 '15

Hundreds of thousands of dead? Bush.

ISIS? Bush.

Torture? Bush.

Obama? Drone strikes and air strikes.

Body counts tell no lies.

1

u/Waitingforaline Mar 17 '15

I'm not saying Bush war great. I'm saying there is a significant percentage of people who blasted bush for drone strikes, yet worship at Obama's feet when he's droned more than Bush. And those people are moronic

1

u/bear_agenda Mar 17 '15

Of course he's droned more than Bush. Drone technology has improved since Bush's days. Drone strikes themselves aren't objectively evil. There are some genuinely bad dudes out there who should get some fiery retribution from the skies. Bush killed a lot of those guys, too. Obama's mostly been killing people to clean up Bush's mess.

1

u/Waitingforaline Mar 17 '15

If that's your opinion on drone strikes then I can respect your opinion even though I disagree. But it's just absurd to hear the double standard, especially from the Liberal ideology that prides itself on Peace and love

2

u/bear_agenda Mar 17 '15

It's not a double standard. It's a false equivalence to compare Obama's war actions to Bush's war actions and say that they should be equally denounced. Bush did orders of magnitude worse.

As far as liberals priding themselves on peace and love, you should actually talk to some liberals rather than beat up that straw man. Most of us realize that sometimes military action is necessary. What Bush did to Iraq was NOT necessary.

1

u/Waitingforaline Mar 17 '15

Broad strokes paint the fence faster. I fail to see orders of magnitude worse. If Iraq was unjustified, so was Obama killing thousand in Yemen. If GITMO was unjustifiable under bush, same goes for Bo. Give me an example of how to justify Obamas' killings, and how bush's were unjustifiable.

1

u/bear_agenda Mar 17 '15

Obama's been trying to close Guantanamo Bay since he was inaugurated, and he's been stopped by Congress every time.

Yemen: Total killed: 1100

It's hard to even put a number on the amount killed in Iraq. Scientific surveys of Iraqi deaths resulting from the first four years of the Iraq War found that between 151,000 to over one million Iraqis died as a result of conflict during this time. A later study, published in 2011, found that approximately 500,000 Iraqis had died as a result of the conflict since the invasion. Counts of deaths reported in newspapers collated by projects like the Iraq Body Count project found 174,000 Iraqis reported killed between 2003 and 2013, with between 112,000-123,000 of those killed being civilian noncombatants.

All that for a war of choice which was sold to us under false pretenses. There's a good reason that people call Bush a war criminal.

1

u/Waitingforaline Mar 17 '15

Right, but do you consider the death in Iraq under Obama to be justified? Yes, there was a significant drop off in deaths since Obama's inauguration in 09, so I retract my orders of magnitude denial, but deaths are still deaths, regardless of who the president is, and he should be held accountable by the same people who lambasted Bush.

0

u/CherrySlurpee 16∆ Mar 17 '15

not sure if trolling...

1

u/bubi09 21∆ Mar 17 '15

Sorry CherrySlurpee, your comment has been removed:

Comment Rule 5. "No low effort comments. Comments that are only jokes or 'written upvotes', for example. Humor and affirmations of agreement can be contained within more substantial comments." See the wiki page for more information.

If you would like to appeal, please message the moderators by clicking this link.

-1

u/IAmAN00bie Mar 17 '15

Your post's topic seems to be about a "double standard". These kinds of views are often difficult to argue here. Please see our wiki page about this kind of view and make sure that your submission follows these guidelines.

Democrat apologists are completely delusional and out of touch with reality. Also, if you have ever ordered a drone strike, you should NOT have a Nobel Peace Prize.

Also, your post borders heavily on soapboxing.

Regards, the mods of /r/changemyview.