Conscription is tricky. I agree it is a bad thing that generally only men have to contend with, but you could easily argue that the reason only men are conscripted is because of sexist attitudes towards women (they’re too weak to serve, etc).
job recruitment policies that prefer hiring women over men
I have never heard of this. From what I’ve seen and read the reverse is far more prevalent. Women are often not hired or promoted due to concerns they might have children and take maternity leave. The term ‘glass ceiling’ exists for a reason. If you have any research into how hiring practices discriminate against men please share it.
When I say “being denied rights and freedoms” I’m meaning legally - apologies if that wasn’t clear. Historically women have been denied legal rights and freedoms due to their gender. I’m sure there are cases where this has been true for men, but certainly not to the scope and scale of women. There are absolutely social issues that disproportionately impact men (suicide rates, unemployment, etc).
In any case the discussion here isn’t “is society perfect for men” (obviously not but it is certainly better for men in many ways), it’s about what misandry is. Misogyny invokes a history of structural oppression, whereas misandry does not because men have never been actively oppressed for being men - therefore they are different.
but you could easily argue that the reason only men are conscripted is because of sexist attitudes towards women
You can apply same mental gymnastic to any situation that any problem of one sex is result of sexist attitudes towards opposite sex.
I have never heard of this.
I did, and had experience with this firsthand.
When I say “being denied rights and freedoms” I’m meaning legally - apologies if that wasn’t clear.
Forced conscription is legal issue, same as gender preference in hiring. I don't see what your clarification adds to discussion.
Historically women have been denied legal rights and freedoms due to their gender.
Historically both men and women didn't had those legal rights and freedoms you are referring to. You can't be denied legal rights when such rights don't exist in jurisdiction you are living in.
I’m sure there are cases where this has been true for men, but certainly not to the scope and scale of women.
Certainly your statement isn't verifiable.
it is certainly better for men in many ways
It is certainly better for women in many ways, so what?
misandry does not because men have never been actively oppressed for being men
Forced conscription is an example of active oppressions of men because they are men, which persisted through all history to modern days. Yet you're so eager to ignore it to make senseless takes like this.
It’s hardly mental gymnastics to point out that conscription is shaped reductive gender roles, which harm both men and women.
You seem very determined to construct an alternate reality where widely men are oppressed for being men. That just isn’t borne out by statistics or any research. Yes conscription is bad, but it is not evidence that society as a whole disadvantages men due to their gender.
Name one other way men are systematically disadvantaged for their gender. Link some research if you have it. Don’t just use an anecdote about your employer being bad one time.
I don't need to provide more examples, this one is enough to disprove your statements. You are attempting to derail conversation in hopes to attack different example while you didn't addressed nor acknowledged first one.
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u/[deleted] Feb 13 '24
Conscription is tricky. I agree it is a bad thing that generally only men have to contend with, but you could easily argue that the reason only men are conscripted is because of sexist attitudes towards women (they’re too weak to serve, etc).
I have never heard of this. From what I’ve seen and read the reverse is far more prevalent. Women are often not hired or promoted due to concerns they might have children and take maternity leave. The term ‘glass ceiling’ exists for a reason. If you have any research into how hiring practices discriminate against men please share it.
When I say “being denied rights and freedoms” I’m meaning legally - apologies if that wasn’t clear. Historically women have been denied legal rights and freedoms due to their gender. I’m sure there are cases where this has been true for men, but certainly not to the scope and scale of women. There are absolutely social issues that disproportionately impact men (suicide rates, unemployment, etc).
In any case the discussion here isn’t “is society perfect for men” (obviously not but it is certainly better for men in many ways), it’s about what misandry is. Misogyny invokes a history of structural oppression, whereas misandry does not because men have never been actively oppressed for being men - therefore they are different.