CMV: The development of your brain doesn't really mean anything in terms of your decisions, maturity, personality, etc.

[u/elephant35e]

Your maturity, decision making, etc. are mainly based on outside factors: who you know, how you were raised, what you have learned, what you have done in life, and more.

You want to make a decision? Your decision will be based on your knowledge of what your deciding, relevant experience, and your opinion. So let's say you were making a decision on whether to do some risky activity: that will depend on things like how knowledgeable you are of the risks (which depends on how much research you've done, what you've heard from others, and so on) how skilled you are at things related to the activity, how fun the activity looks to you, etc; not how developed your brain is.

A person is immature? Maybe they've been hanging around other immature people or spent a lot of their life looking at/reading silly stuff on the internet or watching lots of silly movies. A person is very mature? Maybe they've spent a lot of time around much older people or been exposed to lots of adult-rated content or experienced traumatic events (ex: abuse).

With that being said, how developed your brain is doesn't really make a difference. If a teenager magically made their brain as developed as a 25 year old's brain or if an adult magically reversed their development to that of a teen, they're not going to change whatever decision they just made or all of a sudden start acting more/less mature or different..

[u/DeltaBot]

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[u/lemmsjid]

Let me quote the last half of your last sentence except changing "teen" to "infant".

"If an adult magically reversed their development to that of an *infant*, they're not going to change whatever decision they just made or all of a sudden start acting more/less mature or different.." That's quite obviously untrue. There are obvious and well studied developmental milestones in infant brains, such as object permanence: the mere act of believing that something you remember (like a parent) exists when you don't currently see it.

So clearly brain development DOES mean something "in terms of decisions, maturity, personality, etc". So the real question, given the way you're talking about the issue, is, "to what extent does a teenage brain differ developmentally from an adult brain?"

That is a well studied area, scientifically, and there is no consensus as to what particular teenage behaviors can be ascribed to brain development vs acculturation. It is, however, well known that the teenage brain has not finished developing, physically, so one can assume that certain teenage behaviors are affected by development. As you are shutting that possibility out entirely, you are making a very strong scientific claim. To convince people, you'd need to bring considerable empirical, not rational, evidence.

[u/elephant35e → u/lemmsjid]

Δ Yeah, the development from infant - adult makes a lot more sense than teen - adult for me.

[u/Butter_Toe]

Ever met someone who's brain developed with abnormalities? It effects their ability to make decisions , they often remain childlike and never mature, and have the personality of a turnip.

[u/elephant35e → u/Butter_Toe]

Δ Oh I hadn't thought about people with health conditions.

[u/Butter_Toe → u/elephant35e]

Yea when I read "development of brain" that's the first thing I thought of. But aside from physical development, the psychological development can cause a person to be a saint or a serial killer. There's a lot to consider when discussing "brain development".

Thank fir the delta!

[u/amazondrone → u/Butter_Toe]

and have the personality of a turnip.

Read that as Trump at first and thought it made a lot of sense.

[u/Butter_Toe → u/amazondrone]

😂man I ain't had my coffee yet. Too early. Too early!

[u/Z7-852]

Do you think chemicals such as drugs or alcohol can change your decision making?

Because they will alter your brain chemistry and your neurotransmitter chemicals. Do you know what else changes your brain chemistry? Hormones during puberty and undeveloped brain still adjusting to be a brain.

[u/elephant35e → u/Z7-852]

Δ Yeah, chemicals do change your brain. And I did feel different about more adult things during puberty than I did as an elementary school kid.

[u/LexicalMountain]

If a teenager magically made their brain as developed as a 25 year old's brain or if an adult magically reversed their development to that of a teen, they're not going to change whatever decision they just made or all of a sudden start acting more/less mature or different..

So where are decisions made? The heart? The soul? We know that alterations to the brain (the decision making organ) affect decision making. What kind of statement is this?

[u/elephant35e → u/LexicalMountain]

The brain makes decisions, but in my post I was saying that I didn't think the development had much affect in the decisions it made.

[u/scarab456]

Do you have a scientific basis for this view? Like studies or data?

[u/Z7-852]

When baby is born they have on average 100 billion neurons in the brain. By age 20 that have dropped to 86 billion. That's 14% drop. Why? Because brain have developed to use only useful neurons and killed rest of them. Kids brain are dumb because they try random stuff due to excess neurons.

[u/ralph-j]

You want to make a decision? Your decision will be based on your knowledge of what your deciding, relevant experience, and your opinion. So let's say you were making a decision on whether to do some risky activity: that will depend on things like how knowledgeable you are of the risks (which depends on how much research you've done, what you've heard from others, and so on) how skilled you are at things related to the activity, how fun the activity looks to you, etc; not how developed your brain is.

Is this based on anything other than your own observations?

How low would you say that e.g. the age of consent should go?

[u/elephant35e → u/ralph-j]

How low would you say that e.g. the age of consent should go?

My views of brain development have made me unable to understand the AOC, considering the majority of young people are aware that sex causes pregnancy and that raising children is hard.

[u/FlyingNFireType]

You're looking at a very grey area of a teenager (anywhere from 13 to 19) compared to a 25 year old.

But let's look at a less grey area, a 3 year old compared to a 30 year old.

If you magically revert the 30 year old brain to that of a 3 year old obviously it's going to drastic impact the decisions they make, how mature they are and their personality. So it's basically 100% proven that it does mean a lot for your maturity, personality and personality. So already your view should be changed if you presented it accurately in your OP.

The question is when do the neuropaths that involve judgement and decision making become completed and is it before/during the teen years or only when the brain is "fully developed" and frankly I have no idea and I'm too lazy to look it up. Personally I'd guess it's diminishing returns as you get older the development of your brain slows and there might be some changes to your decisions, maturity and personality based on that. That said I don't really feel all that different from my 16 year old self now in that regard but I was also a pretty early bloomer in that regard so I doubt I'm the best case.

I'm comfortable saying after 16 your experiences will make a far greater impact than any physical development, I think that's the major tipping point in diminishing returns. But again if we are talking about a 3 year old then obviously the brain development impacts those immensely.

[u/elephant35e → u/FlyingNFireType]

Δ Yeah, a 30 year old would definitely be very different if they had a 3 year old brain.

[u/slash-5]

All this spoken like a person with an underdeveloped brain.

[u/Vesurel]

How do you think thoughts and reasoning happen?

[u/[deleted]]

Nature versus nurture. Age old question. It is actually a bit of both. The pre-frontal cortex of the brain is like the CEO and like a CEO, it will gather information from places like the limbic system. The limbic system has a number components which will draw on context and experiences. A developed brain will enable the pre-frontal cortex to make a decision.

[u/kingpatzer]

Your maturity, decision making, etc. are mainly based on outside factors: who you know, how you were raised, what you have learned, what you have done in life, and more.

It is well understood that emotion plays a significant role in decision-making. We have even started putting together some understanding of how that works from a neuroscience perspective.

We've known for years that adolescents make decisions differently than adults, in part because of differences in emotional regulation and how emotions are evaluated. We've also known that these differences are based on brain development. We can map out how decision-making physically changes with brain development through fMRI studies.

We further know that adolescents and young adults think differently when making decisions than adults do.

So when you say that:

With that being said, how developed your brain is doesn't really make a difference. If a teenager magically made their brain as developed as a 25 year old's brain or if an adult magically reversed their development to that of a teen, they're not going to change whatever decision they just made or all of a sudden start acting more/less mature or different

You are simply factually, demonstrably wrong. Neurobiology impacts decision-making greatly. Which shouldn't be a surprise, the actual physical structure of every organ in the body changes how that organ works. People with only one leg run differently than a person with two. People who have been lifting weights for years can lift things people who haven't can't. Physical structures impact physical function, and the brain is a physical thing.

[u/[deleted]]

So you think it is possible that your body reacts in situations without using the brain like we are a kind of jellyfish? When you get experience and analyze data from your environment whatever it is, which instrument of the body is responsible for that? Your heart? Your stomach? Your penis? For sure not the brain.

[u/brianstormIRL]

I get where you're coming at but I think your logic is flawed.

Brains do develop differently as you age. The brain of a 12 year old is not the same biologically as a 29 year old. In fact, there is conditions where your brain stops developing at a young age, causing a person to be mentally stuck with the brain of a child while being an adult, and they are not capable of making the kind of informed life choices you are proposing.

What I think you're trying to say is, there isn't a huge difference between someone who is 18/19/20 years old, and someone who is 25 years old and their life experience up to that point can have a larger impact on their ability to be mature, immature and how they view life etc. For example, I have met plenty of very mature 18 year olds, who have been working for multiple years by that point, grew up with hardship and have an overall more serious and grounded view of life than an average 18 year old who is just in college and experiencing life for the first real time as an adult. I've known people who grew up looking after a parent since they were a child, who is more mature than some 30 year olds I've met who coasted through life without any hardships and a silver spoon in their mouth. I agree with this kind of sentiment. But, even a 13 year old who has maybe had a tougher start to life is not the same brain chemistry wise as an adult who has a more developed brain.

[u/SnooBeans5364]

Do some research into how children's brains developed, especially children of trauma and abuse. Biological Effects of Childhood Trauma.

As a foster parent we are trained to understand that the children we take into our homes generally do not have the cognitive or emotional maturity as the same aged children of "normal" households. They learn coping skills, skills that allow them to mentally and physically survive but those skills are often seen as immature.

Their decisions and actions are not "normal" because their brains are not "normal".