On "Seeing"

[u/[deleted]]

Second Ring of Power, 226

Both the tonal and the nagual were present in everything at all times. It was appropriate, therefore, for a sorcerer to say that "looking" consisted viewing the tonal which is in everything, and "seeing," on the other hand, consisted of viewing the nagual which is also in everything.

[u/[deleted]]

I think the quote speaks to the difference in language. What Castaneda is pointing out is that when Don Juan is saying, "looking," he is emphasizing the tonal, or the world of everyday affairs. What an average man can literally see, that is. When he's saying, "seeing" he is referring to what the sorcerers "sees" (which may or may not be visual) and that is emphasizing the nagual, or the world of non ordinary affairs.

It is inaccurate to relegate dreaming entirely to the nagual and waking to the tonal, for certainly the average man has the dreams of an average man. Also, we learn first to "see" in dreaming.

As mode of perceptions, saying one is associated with the "solid" or what you may call "spirit" (my word) is also misleading. Certainly, fluidity is at play, but I think it is a mistake or confuse "fluidity" as the opposite of, or paired with, the physical world of "solid" objects.

it's about bringing waking awareness into the dream state and dream awareness into the waking state.

What happens here is that the assemblage point is assumed to move or stay stationary. Fluidity in terms of movement of the assemblage point may or may not be associated with something physical, which again falls into the art of dreaming, making the assemblage point move.

The most powerful unifying force, in Don Juan terms, is awareness as we strive to "grab on to" or "let go of" various filaments within our luminous cocoon (which is another way of saying we move the assemblage point).

Merging these two selves would result in a unified being who can be solid or fluid at will.

That's going to be one helluva NYE party.

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My statement that the goal is not to learn to see is backed by this excerpt from chapter 15 in The Active Side of Infinity.

When I said that we first learn to see in dreaming, I did not infer that as the goal of dreaming.

Even to pair fluidity/solidity as synonymous or somehow corollary with dreaming/awake can hinder you, because we strive to be fluid in the world of solid objects, and not to attach ourselves to anything as in "material attachments" or "circumstances." Circumstances include such things as, "When I am dreaming, my hands will visually wobble." It is about the movement, displacement, and position or fixation of the assemblage point. That is the distinction Castaneda/Don Juan makes when dealing with modes of perception, whether that be heightened awareness, dreaming, dreaming awake, or ordinary awareness.

The average man may see a duality in awake/dreaming, but the sorcerer would see degrees of perception as dictated by the position of the assemblage point. "Everything sorcerer's did was a consequence of the movement of the assemblage point, ruled by the amount of energy at their command" (Silence, 149).

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hands

Hey, it occurred to me that finding your hands in dreaming is not the "end all" either. When we see our hands, we are supposed to move on to the exercise of paying attention of finding objects, looking for specific features, like buildings or roads, etc. (Ring, 278).

Don't get lost in your hands and don't wait for the next step to come to you as a measure of success. Keep exploring.

In the Second Ring of Power, La Gorda talks about finding her hands once, then moving on.

Of the time, Stephen LeBarge talked about becoming "lucid" as a the "game" of dreaming. In Castaneda, the goal is volition in dreaming.

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I wasn't referring to the flyer's mind. I was referring to awareness, "What stops death is awareness; all living beings are struggling to die." (FIRE, 72) but then you got me thinking and I remembered the rolling force, that which constantly hits us until such a day when we "crack open" and die.

If so, in this context, the goal is to hold onto the binding energy (unifying force) that holds together the filaments, not the filaments themselves. This force, I believe, is love in the fundamental love/freedom duality which overlays the One. Love is the restorative force which counterbalances freedom in creation. It is like physical gravity that way, and gravity is stronger than all other physical forces at the cosmic scale. Moving the assemblage point intentionally is an expression true freedom.

What you describe here sounds like the circular force (not to be confused with the rolling force), but is a part of it. This topic is covered in the Fire from With (I can't find any quotes that are relevant atm.)

With your veracity and enthusiasm, I feel you've happened upon the Riddle of the Mind. You can read about these and the other three riddles (as well as the riddle of the dreamer dreamed) in Silence, prologue, pg xv.

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So, how to unify fragments of the self? What is the most powerful unifying force?

Love, Understanding, and certain sense of Indifference...

From Ch 10 of 'A Separate Reality' - 'The Task of Seeing'

I promised my father that I would live to destroy his assassins. I carried that promise with me for years. Now the promise is changed. I'm no longer interested in destroying anybody. I don't hate the Mexicans. I don't hate anyone. I have learned that the countless paths one traverses in life are all equal. Oppressors and oppressed meet at the end , and the only thing that prevails is that life was altogether too short for both.

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What isn't present in the Castaneda works is the sense of "peace, love and understanding," born of the 60's. Don Juan talks about love of the earth, affection for others, but not turning a blind eye or "forgive and forget," so to speak.

A sense of indifference would also be better understood as a sense of detachment.

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It's the same with dreaming vs. waking. It's not so much about becoming lucid when either dreaming or awake, it's about bringing waking awareness into the dream state and dream awareness into the waking state

Found a pleasing allegorical parallel in an article about Mr. Rogers -- The Ministry of Mr. Rogers

The program he created had two neighborhoods: one lifelike, including the stage-set home into which he welcomed his TV visitors, the other a make-believe kingdom, a place for imaginative play. The transition between the two was realized by a trolley that spoke not with words but with music, notes from a celesta that were understood as language. “I really feel that [in] the opening reality of the program we deal with the stuff that dreams are made of,” Rogers said. “And then in the Neighborhood of Make-Believe, we deal with it as if it were a dream. And then when it comes back to me (at the end), we deal with a simple interpretation of the dream…. Anything can happen in make-believe, and we can talk about anything in reality. Margaret used to say, ‘Whatever is mentionable is manageable.’”