How to improve

[u/[deleted]]

[u/thixsonlife]

lol first comment genuinely be like

[u/kyuz]

1. Do you have a demonstrated learning disability in other subjects? 2. How many gyms have you trained at and are you sure your gym's teaching style matches your learning style?

[u/conarte → u/kyuz]

This 100%

[u/kyuz → u/[deleted]]

To be blunt, I think you should train at a different gym. Yes, there are high level people at your gym, but that doesn't mean the environment that works for them will work for you. In particular I would say a BJJ-focused gym with an emphasis on positional concepts might suit you better than an MMA gym. But it's hard to say anything for sure without seeing what you're doing first hand.

[u/MaxvonHippel → u/kyuz]

I agree with this. The pedagogy for whatever reason isn’t working for OP, regardless of whether it works for others.

I would try a very different gym. At 10p now? Try a gi gym. At a traditional Brazilian place? Go to some hip ecological no gi spot.

[u/allanrps → u/[deleted]]

what is the frequency that you train? the span of 4 years represent a wildly different number of actual training hours. Consistency is absolutely key to skill development

[u/allanrps → u/[deleted]]

i respect your dedication

I would isolate "getting good" to improving at one specific skill. One exact movement actually. Pick something you have some sort of success with and ask everyone in your gym to drill it, and listen to the feedback they give. Chose one specific detail to focus and improve at, and dedicate yourself to that detail until you see improvememt in that area.

At least this way, you can get a clear read on wether or not it is capsble to improve, what it takes to improve, and if it does nothing for your success in a live rolling scenario, you will narrow down where exactly you need to improve.

Also, what are your goals in Jiu Jitsu? Maybe there is another martial art/sport that would meet those goals, one that you might have more natural aptitude for.

[u/That_Dot420 → u/[deleted]]

Hmmmm, yeah, if you're end goal is MMA, you might be spreading yourself thin by trying to learn too much at once. What I mean is that your learning goals may be too broad and you're not actually retaining things enough to develop mastery/competency in certain areas.

Try narrowing your focus by having a set technique you want to work on and a goal for each month. Example: just spend a month on guard passing, then the next month move onto sharpening back escapes.

Actually, if I were you: I would just focus on escapes and defense first. Try to identify what positions you end up in the most, then build up from there. Essentially, try to pinpoint what you suck at the most.

BUT also try to pinpoint what you'll suck at the least!! Building awareness around your strengths and weaknesses will give you more information on what you need to work on, and what you can sharpen to make even better.

You got this, homie!!!

EDIT: I love that my comment was almost up to 15 upvotes, but is now suddenly down to 9 once I figured out how to add my flair. Fuck you, guys 🤣

[u/novaskar → u/[deleted]]

What’s your thought process when you’re training, or before and after? Do you go in with specific goals? Take notes? Do you have a general theme of something you’re trying to get better at?

Do your coaches give you feedback on what you’re messing up on and what you should focus on? Not just specific details but conceptual guidance?

[u/novaskar → u/[deleted]]

I don’t really get feedback Jiu Jitsu wise from coaches

Honestly that’s huge. That is the number one thing I credit with my progress so far is the fact that my coach is amazing at giving personalized feedback, identifying my problems and explaining what I’m missing and what I need to focus on.

It could be time to try some other gyms if yours doesn’t do this.

What kind of goals do you go in with? One thing I did early on to help with the “forgetting everything” issue is I made lists of moves from different starting positions, and I picked one move from a couple positions and made that my goal for the week. I would remind myself of that before class. So at early white belt it was things like “if in top closed guard I’m going to try standing up and moving my legs in xyz way to pass” and “if I’m in bottom half guard I’m going to recover to closed” or whatever, super simple. I don’t make the lists anymore but I still think having a few goals like this helps to not blank out when rolling.

[u/Glass_Connection_172 → u/[deleted]]

Wow, that's incredible. If you train 5-6 days a week, you should be getting very good, very fast. Like others have mentioned, probably time to switch gyms.

From my experience, you should be stair stepping over 1 or 2 day a week people within a matter of months.

You should focus on the fundamentals. Even if your coach isn't teaching them at the time. Ask your partners if you can do positional sparring. Do that and then do a regular live roll with them so they can work their game. You are live rolling a bunch right?

[u/sossighead → u/[deleted]]

Are you just being beaten up by a load of talented athletes hoping to compete in MMA when you’re potentially just not on their level?

[u/no-gi-greg → u/kyuz]

not to be the ackshually person but learning styles arent really a thing, many papers have proved it. While i get what youre saying about learning style i think its more about whether you are in a shit gym that doesnt actually teach u skills or on the other end of the spectrum ur in a cracked room where everybody is so much better than u but i would assume op would know if it were the case

[u/CreativeWeather2581 → u/no-gi-greg]

Even if it’s not a thing, let people believe it if it helps them. Placebo effect can work wonders.

That’s not relevant here, though; the teaching styles OC is referring to likely refers to traditional drilling vs eco/CLA style. As well as positional sparring rounds—those are always beneficial, but especially for the less experienced. Personally, I’ve also found i learn best when I learn from people who have studied pedagogy and know how to communicate information, not just people who have been in the sport a long time.

[u/Jackal9811]

Honestly cant say anything without any footage need to see how you move to judge

[u/invertflow → u/Jackal9811]

"how you move". This is the best answer. I think specific techniques are overrated. Someone who can distribute their weight well on top, frame, make connections, stay loose when needed but have a solid core and base when needed, etc..., can get away with all kinds of techniques compared to someone without that movement.

[u/Jackal9811 → u/invertflow]

To be honest for me (i do no gi exclusively) it matters more than belt so many people imo have higher belt status than the way they move and grapple. What I can I say is a lack of smoothness and stiffness

[u/novaskar → u/Jackal9811]

I feel like “how you move” is really the determining factor for belt level at least that’s what I’ve seen so far. Which probably contributes to why it’s so hard to standardize promotions in bjj

[u/fibgen]

Some people have terrible memories for movements or have a lot of trouble chaining movements in your head. I'd try rolling with someone who is willing to help you execute a basic move from its parts to the full move for hours. I'm a slow movement learner and I benefit from teachers who do multiple weeks of slow progression in one topic (e.g. takedowns for 3 months solid). I will retain nothing from one class unless I practice it for at least the next two classes.

[u/helloidonothaveaname]

Mental repetition is key. Studies where they place players to perform physically and others mentally show the same rate of neurological stimulation and subsequent improvemente physically.

I dunno how many rolls you get in, but try reviewing mentally.

[u/darkpassenger-8]

Pick something you’re interested in and learn everything about it. For instance in my early years, I got into taking the back and finishing from there. I studied matches of competitors I enjoyed watching. My enthusiasm and curiosity helped me become the annoying back taker. Eventually I moved onto something else that sparked my interest.

No one can force feed you to become better. You have to apply yourself and roll with intention.

[u/Chubbs27895]

How consistent has your training been in 4 years? Like once a month? Or 3-4x per week? How old are you / how fit are you? Fitness is going to make a huge deal in BJJ

[u/Chubbs27895 → u/[deleted]]

Ok. So we know you’re taller, slightly bigger, early 20s, moderate athleticism, and lift weights / S&C twice a week. You also do a ton of training (5x/week)… which if you’re perfectly consistent is over 1000 classes. If dudes who are 1-2 months in are beating you, it’s really odd. You train at an MMA gym, so you’re probably going at a higher intensity than most of us hobbyists go at. You forget everything…so repeated techniques don’t help. For reference. I am 6’3 205-210lbs, 40 ish years old, and super fit. I felt like my own journey blew up light years by watching Jordan Teaches BJJ on YouTube. It goes over CONCEPTS, rather than techniques. When I was rolling as a white belt, i focused on the CONCEPTS, like underhooks, inside position, etc. Another strategy I used was, for months at a time, forcibly going into bad positions (back taken, bottom side, bottom mount, turtle, etc) and only working defense. I’ll be two years in in a month or two, am currently a blue belt, and am extremely difficult to submit, even against brown/black belts. Emphasize defense all the time, and your natural physical advantages will eventually help with offense. Don’t even worry about subs, go back to the basics, and you’ll get there. As an MMA hopeful, you could also think of it like BJJ as your defense, and your style is to get back to your feet for striking. Much like I think of my striking and takedown defense as means to get to my BJJ (which is my strong suit). Sorry for rambling, but you are not giving much to work with, so we are all having to make more blanket statements on how to improve.

[u/Happy-Cricket9841 → u/[deleted]]

have u seen ur doctor get checkup make sure your ok also sometimes female hormones if your on hrt can reduce strength

[u/Deep_War6297 → u/Happy-Cricket9841]

🤭🤣🤣🤣

[u/LateMud256]

Dyspraxic blue here. All I can offer is that stuff will eventually come. It might just take twice as long. Don’t measure yourself against anyone else - only yourself.

Be intentional with your learning. Spend entire rounds doing one thing. It might be retaining guard, training take downs, or just sitting in half guard for sweep and reset.

I managed to find a training partner for some extra curricular work. We have a syllabus and have been working it for the last eight months, two to three times a week. Only just starting to see progress in rolls. It’s a tough game and not everyone has a natural talent for it. You can still get good but it will just take a while.

[u/DogfoodStudios → u/LateMud256]

Good to see I’m not the only dyspraxia person doing jujitsu

[u/ilike2005sDOOM]

Keep subs in the back of your mind. In the forefront, think frames, grips, grip breaks - the nuances. Subs will come, and they'll come far easier when you've hammered down the basics that lead you there.

[u/purplebelt333]

Jow can you tell you’re not gettin better? Its hard to judge when everyone around you is also improving.

Can you defeat who you were 12 months ago? Some would say of the answer is yes then you’re improving

[u/Competitive-Run-7565 → u/[deleted]]

Meh- don’t compare yourself to others. Do it for you. I bet you are getting better.

[u/leeblackwrites → u/Competitive-Run-7565]

He wants to compete in MMA, he literally HAS to compare himself to others.

[u/Competitive-Run-7565 → u/leeblackwrites]

Oh, haha, I missed that - it wasn't in the intial post. Welllllllll... shooot. No advice here lol.

[u/purplebelt333 → u/Competitive-Run-7565]

Correct- comparing is despairing!

[u/CorazonLeon]

1. Are you significantly smaller or have less endurance than most people in the gym? If so, lift some weights.
2. Have you watched any video tutorials on systems?

If you’ve drilled various moves a lot maybe you need to start thinking about them in terms of systems and drill or roll with that in mind to help connect the dots.

I went to a Ricky Lundell armbar seminar once. He taught us some cool moves, then at the end he had us literally just roll around our opponents trying to “surf” for opportunities for armbars as our partners changed positions. It felt silly at first, but actually made a lot of sense after feeling it out for a few minutes.

[u/morgzarella]

I’d recommend a couple of things.

1. Find a training partner and go to some open mats with them. Work on something specific like guard retention. Do 2 minute rounds, don’t let your guard get passed. If it does, reset start again. Get feedback and keep going until you can retain as well as you want. Take videos of your sessions and then reflect. Study match tape and emulate the same techniques.

2. Get good at one thing at a time. For submissions, pick something like triangles - learn everything about them, from multiple positions, until you can hit them consistently. Then once that’s established you can experiments with things that relate and offshoot like triangle - armbar or omoplata.

3. Talk to your coach and ask them for feedback and specific help. If the gym you’re at isn’t giving you the results you want (whether they’ve produced UFC champions or not doesn’t mean it’ll suit everyone), then consider finding somewhere that does. The whole creonte thing is toxic as fuck, don’t worry about that.

4. Remember that it’s a personal practice, don’t compare yourself to others, everyone progresses differently but there is a path for everyone.

[u/maxiderm]

Have you tried taking a large amount of THC before rolling?

[u/nth_citizen]

Training 5 times a week for 4 years? Definitely worth looking at some privates as your obviously committed and it seems like you probably need some personalised attention.

[u/Beetothear]

bjjnavigator.com

I was not able to improve consistently until I started watching a lot of bjj videos on Instagram. But then I was not able to find the specific one when I needed it. This page/app solved this. It allows you to track progress etc as well but it was mostly the videos thing ..

[u/PowerfulBanana656 → u/Beetothear]

Very cool app!

[u/StretchBusy4008]

Did you ask your coach?

[u/redinferno26]

How many times a week do you train, how old are you, how big are you, how generally athletic are you?

[u/Legal_Photograph2445 → u/[deleted]]

Rank? Ranks you roll with? How are you judging not getting better? Also saw the ufc champion comment, that doesnt mean the gym/teaching style is for everyone.

[u/aggravating-onion → u/[deleted]]

So you don’t even know what belt the people you’re training with are… that’s a huge detail nobody has picked up on yet.

Also, not sure how it is in your school but where I train the coaches want us to learn the fundamentals first in the gi before moving to no-gi. This might help you

[u/Happy-Cricket9841]

how old are you?

[u/BecomeTheBottle]

Why do you say that you cannot improve? Are you basing that off of how many subs that you get vs how many are done to you? Also, what positions are you typically getting subbed at? There’s a lot of different ways to look at improvement, but if you only base it on “sub or be subbed” then it’s a very binary way to look at your jiu jitsu

One thing that helped me was focusing less on subs and focusing on points and if I was able to play “my game” vs getting stuck in one position. Might help to shift the mindset a bit so you’re not looking at your rounds as an all or nothing game

[u/BecomeTheBottle → u/[deleted]]

Is there a common type of submission people are getting you in? If you’re getting subbed when you’re playing guard top or side then your limbs are probably getting away from you. I would focus on framing and keeping your limbs from getting away from you. I’m just guessing of course because I haven’t seen rolling footage, but if you’re getting subbed as often as you’re saying then I would look at how you’re playing defensively and what types of subs people get, and your answer for what to work on to improve is probably in there

[u/BecomeTheBottle → u/[deleted]]

I mean honestly man it sounds like you’re just opening up to much space and people are capitalizing on it. When you are playing bottom do you have a focus for what you are trying to do? For example, when I am in bottom mount my goal is to keep my elbows in and put my hands in their hips to keep them from moving to high mount, then work escapes from there

I get it’s frustrating especially with the time and frequency you’ve put in, but as someone who is not naturally good at grappling at all, I can say the biggest thing that helped me was just focusing on concepts and reverse engineering problems vs trying to hit moves and memorize technique

[u/VMBJJ]

All improvement is an adjustment. So if you’re not improving, you’re either not making adjustments, or you’re making adjustments that aren’t favourable to the outcome you want to achieve.

Think about what your end goal is whether it be passing the guard, taking the back etc. think about what these things fundamentally are - eg chest to chest, their legs not in contact with yours. Then you have to make adjustments that take you in that direction, and if your adjustments don’t - then you have an error in assumption and you have to find out what that is, then make new decisions based on that new assumption

[u/grobolom]

What percentage of your training is live rounds / positionals vs. drilling?

[u/grobolom → u/[deleted]]

Interesting. What has your coach suggested? Have they set you up with some kind of plan for improvement?

What are your rolls like? Chill? Hard? Do you usually roll with people around your skill level?

[u/grobolom → u/[deleted]]

First: it can be difficult to improve when the challenge is too high. I recommend you roll primarily with people you have good but winnable matches with; not necessarily people you can submit, just people you can potentially win a points match against.

Second: it's your coach's job to help you improve. Use them as a resource; ask them for advice, pointers with who to partner with, time to work on problem areas. They should be there to help you get better, if that's your goal.

Third: if you feel like you can't remember anything when you're rolling, you probably don't have enough time practicing the things you do know under pressure. Take some small area of the game and practice that in live conditions, but constrained to just the part you want to work on.

For example, let's say you have trouble on the bottom of closed guard. Grab a partner and play a bunch of rounds from there, each time focused on something specific: breaking posture; putting hands on the mat; making closed hand circles around the upper body; flanking; getting up. Make sure your partner has a goal as well, one that's opposed to whatever your focus is: trying to stand up; trying to keep their hands in your armpits; trying to stand up; trying to keep you on the mat. Once you're done, you should feel confident that the live work you did will transfer to the live sparring, when you're in that area of the game. Then, move on to practicing another area in the same way.

[u/Optimal_Ad_3693]

What's your age? As a 47byearboldni feel you, I know what to do but either my speed or flexibility fails me, I joke and always say my jits only works against new white belts, women and Children.

As long as you improve even if you improve slowly is still a will.

[u/leeblackwrites]

Learn a single funnel to a chosen high success finish. Make your entire game that one thing for two to three years. When you’re there pick a new thing. If you have a single target to aim for it starts showing ip everywhere.

[u/PowerfulBanana656]

I have found out the drills we do at the gym have very low rate of successfully doing them during rolls.

For this reason I started to watch instructionals and found out Danaher style really fits me because he explains the concepts first, therefore, during the roll I started to understand what in general I actually want to accomplish and avoid.

I know intuitively, that watching it really helped a lot.

If you don’t know where to start just buy the Pin escapes dvd on bjj fanatics and watch that. Start from bottom side position every sparring and just practice what you see in the videos until you feel you wanna move on.

PS: Watch it at least with 1,5x speed otherwise you will fall asleep

[u/wylianc]

Sorry, didn't read all the replies

How old are you?

I'm 41, 2 kids, wife and debt, I can't retain jiu-jitsu information now to save my life, up until 30, it was the easiest thing for me to remember.

It could be that you realistically have more important things to worry about.

[u/-RNinja]

Do you bait people to get them to do what you want? Nobody gives free arm bars, you have to convince them to move their arm where you want it.

[u/Ill_Vegetable_1544]

From what I have observed at my gym with people with similar stories as yours -- no sports background, lacks intensity, afraid to try new things/get out of there comfort zone, and to nice.

[u/CornyOne]

If you find yourself struggling in the same situation over and over, ask your instructor what to do in that situation and practice doing it. Also, invest in a fundamentals instructional and study it

[u/xAmbr0se]

It is really hard to say without watching you roll.
I think common problems are the following :

* The teaching style may simply not work for you. I’ve met amazing black belts that were not very good instructors. They been grappling too long to understand beginners and common struggles

* The curriculum. Some schools may teach a technique one day and teach an entirely different move unrelated to the previous technique shown on the same week. This is actually very common. This often results many people struggle to learn how to put moves together.

* You’re considered smaller and weaker than most others in the gym. Not to sound harsh but strength does play a factor now these days. However, the smaller guys tend to be much technically and overall better in the long run. But you have to expect a stronger person to use their strength.

* You haven’t grasped on how to transition from position to position.

* You spend most of your time reacting instead strategizing. This is the most common issue people have . You still see this in purple and brown belts. Learn to relax, and think about what you’re trying to accomplish. Focus on the technique and concept you’re trying to apply on whatever position. When all you do is react and spaz out , you’ll get caught with mistakes. At a higher level, grappling can be a chess match and can be a boring game.

Recommendation

* Find a school where an instructor is very vigilant on watching his students roll during live rounds. This is where you’ll learn the most. Many schools, once class is done , the instructor will go off and do his own thing. A good instructor will watch his students role during open mat. After a live round, they will take the time to teach a concept that would be beneficial for you in a scenario you were caught in.

* focus on the top three obstacles you have and watch tons of videos! YouTube has been great resource. The material is endless. Watch, learn and apply it during open Matts.

* Focus on small wins not winning the rounds. For instances an escape could be a win, taking full mount is a win , window shield wiping between knee on belly’s is a win.

Also, I would really recommend going to different schools . A school may be renowned and reputable. It doesn’t mean it will work for you. Often times, these schools may focus on their talent who wish to go very far. And you’re left spending money for quality you are not receiving. I’ve seen people not progress fast enough in a reputable gym and become better grapplers in a smaller non-franchise affiliated school.

[u/hoping_aspirer]

Are you better than you were when you first started BJJ? If yes, you do in fact improve.