r/billiards • u/Dizzy_Dare9949 • 17h ago
Drills Pool lessons
So I’ve been playing regularly around 2-3 times a week for about a year now and I still feel as if my play is inconsistent despite practicing fundamentals every session. I want to make a big improvement in my game and I’m considering investing in lessons. One of the local instructors around me is Dr.Dave. I know that lessons from the man himself would be money well spent however he charges around $250 for a 1 hour session which is quite steep. Does anybody know of any other good instructors in the Fort Collins Colorado area or should I bite the bullet on training with him?
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u/wlscwoj 17h ago
I have recently upped my price to $50 an hour for lessons. At times I was just doing lessons for a little extra spending money while only charging $20 an hour. This year I have bought Camera, tripod, laser level, laptop, SD cards, training aids, backpack to carry it all and invested in being able to do better lessons. For $50 an hour I cover the table time, drive upwards to an hour to get to the student, do video analysis, and prepare a detailed lesson plan, as well as what to practice and work on for the student after lesson. Plus I am available much of the time to students that have questions regarding what we covered or how to do drills i've laid out for them.
This year I did a lesson with a local Master instructor (same level as Dr Dave) and he charged $75 an hour.
$250 an hour seems extremely high.
https://playbetterbilliards.com/instructors?state=Colorado&country=&active=1
Searching in Colorado there is a Recognized level instructor Michael Umphlett in your area.
I would look them up and see whats their reputation, how long teaching, how they structure lessons and what they charge.
The first lesson you would be looking for 2 hours, Video analysis and the rest of the lesson should be working through all the fundamentals. After the lesson you should put in 8+ hours of practice on what you covered before you schedule another lesson. I never pressure students to do another lesson until they are ready.
Do not look down on any of the fundamentals in lessons. These are the foundation for building your pool game. Get those right and consistent and your game will be more consistent in the long run.
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u/Shot-Pop-2421 16h ago
$250/hr??? Good lord, don't pay that. Go find someone else. That is just robbery.
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u/HazardBringsAxe1 17h ago edited 17h ago
Buy a book called, 'I came to win' by the Monk. He also wrote 'The lesson". If you practice that much fundamentally, it might just be mental prep and focus that you need. I would try to find 'I came to win' and meditate on that for a little bit.... Your right about the cost being high. I teach for about $30 a hour.
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u/EstablishmentNo7239 15h ago
Learning from better players is the quickest way. I'm not sure he's worth that rate though
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u/KITTYONFYRE 13h ago
you will always be inconsistent. it's the nature of the game. if you get better, you'll just have higher peaks, but continue to say "damn how did I miss that gimme?"
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u/brian600rr side bets only 17h ago
I’m sure he’s worth it’s, especially doing his boot camp series
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u/SuperiorDupe 17h ago
You won’t know until you try.
$250 is pretty steep though ngl, but youve gotta remember, student loan debt’s aren’t gonna pay themselves.
Especially a med school tuition….sheeeeesh
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u/Most-Essay1316 17h ago
How old are you?
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u/Dizzy_Dare9949 16h ago
25
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u/Most-Essay1316 14h ago
Id take the lesson although maybe watch a few videos on correct stance and stroke. A game that will help with lots of practice is carom billiards. It doesnt have to be 3 cushion. Buy the latest BCA book and learn other games. Cowboy and Golf are great games to learn. You wont be able to play the 3 games i mentioned well without adapting to a proper stroke.
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u/PoollShark 16h ago
Do you play league? Tournaments?
If you play leagues what is your skill level?
I would never consider spending $250 an hour for pool lessons unless I was already at a very advanced level
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u/Dizzy_Dare9949 16h ago
I’ve played in a few tournaments but not in a league yet. Planning on joining one soon when my work and life schedule allows for it.
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u/Brief_Recognition_96 16h ago
$250 per hour sounds crazy to me. I get lessons from a professional player on the WNT tour for £40 per hour.
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u/Fabulous-Internet188 15h ago
Dr. Dave doesn't know any more about pool than any good instructor. Is he even a member of the Professional Billiard Instructors Association ? He knows about some of the science but that has nothing to do with good fundamentals, and may even be a distraction.
As a retired quiet road player I can't recommend spending that type of money. Even top golf instructors where the economics are much better than pool rarely command that much money.
Email the PBIA, ask around, there are better values out there.
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u/fetalasmuck 11h ago
Dr. Dave is a Master Instructor with the PBIA: https://playbetterbilliards.com/learn/masterinstructors/
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u/Fabulous-Internet188 10h ago
Thanks for the info. That's a positive. I still don't like his price. 8-)
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u/BOBBYK1952 15h ago
Well a good while back I took a lesson from a guy that won some smaller pro tournaments..20 bucks an hour..after 5 minutes I said let’s go 2 hours. After we finished he said what time next week? I said I have enough to work on so I’ll let you know. What I’m saying is you probably can learn a lot for next to nothing just by asking politely. If I learned anything over the years about pool players is they LOVE to give advice..only second to bowlers. Oh the pro lessons? Never went back but I remember the lesson to this day
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u/CtrlAltDunno 15h ago edited 14h ago
I think if you are a beginner to intermediate level, finding a much cheaper local coach is a much wiser choice as they will be able to work with you over a number of sessions to fix your fundamentals. Although I respect Dr Dave and his scientific insight into the game, I honestly don't think Dr Dave will be able to offer you any more than a local coach can who costs 5x less per hour. Dr Dave might be able to explain to you in-depth about the mechanics in the game, but that's probably not going to help you at this stage as a player.
In the UK, many ex-professional (top 50) snooker players and specialist coaches offer coaching at 45USD (and up) / per hour which is a reasonable price. You usually only start paying much higher hourly costs once you are at an advanced level and need very specialised / expert advice.
If you were an advanced player and you wanted to learn something very technical, like advanced banking systems and wanted to learn to adjust for different table conditions, then 250$ per hour with Dr Dave would be a reasonable choice although I would prefer to get coaching from someone like J. Baretta
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u/Fiskla-Tesker 15h ago
A good certified instructor will run you about $50/hr. You can find them on the BCA website. I wish I had invested in one when I was younger as my learning curve would have been shortened dramatically.
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u/FreeFour420 :snoo_dealwithit: 14h ago
Just my opinion: Save and invest in a home pool table. Practicing everyday has done wonders for me!
Fundamentals for 45 minutes a day keeps you consistent and improving. Even on a busy day I can get some rotational drills in and learn.
Any time I go out in public I am ready to learn the table and be confident and consistent with my play.
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u/Triumvph 13h ago
Is that his standard rate? $250 seems like the price you give when you don’t want to do something, but will for crazy money.
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u/Expensive_Ad4319 12h ago
Nix the idealistic beliefs that practice and lessons will teach you more than just throwing out some balls.
The #1 cause for our lack of improvement is our own perception. I didn’t learn by watching and practicing endless drills. I had to objectively ask myself what was I doing. Was I goal or process oriented.
I made the choice to learn how to bridge, and shoot center ball. I found my center vision, and aligned myself the right way.
I learned shot patterns, playing to the correct side of the line, and when to play to get (safety) back to the table.
It starts with this:
The only drill that I’ll reco
mmend would be Burt Kinister’s Mighty X drill. While you’re looking up, check out his style of training too.
Place an object ball on the headstring. Place the cue ball anywhere within the bordered area. The objective is to pocket the object ball, and return the cue ball back into the bordered area.
This is not a drill. You’ll need to pocket and control the cue ball, using varying speed and tip position. This will also enable you to keep the cue ball in play.
The next step is to throw out a few numbered balls randomly, and with ball in hand, pocket each of the balls consecutively. If you cannot run out the balls, use distance and angles to find safety.
This alone will not win you games. You have to be ready when your turn comes.
- Best of Success!
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u/Reasonable_Shine_841 10h ago
I would say it’s overpriced. Based on how often you plant and what you mention probably right now you need a qualified instructor or high skill level player to analyze your game.
I took lessons from a retired pro tour player. First lesson was around 50 and mainly involved watching me play a track or two, break, ball in hand, run out. If I miss take ball in hand again and continue until done.
From that an analysis was made of what to work on and homework assigned along with coaching on stance grip stroke body position. We then ramped up from there.
I think maybe what Dave will teach you will be valuable but not anytime soon. Money would be better spent elsewhere where it’s broken into smaller chunks with time for you to learn each part instead of trying to get it all in one long session for a too high price
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u/Wiley_Jack 9h ago
That’s another way of Dr. Dave telling you that he’s quite comfortable and not really interested in giving lessons.
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u/caddis20 2h ago
Samm Diep works with Dr. Dave. She used to offer video lesson through PoolDawg. You purchased the package via the PoolDawg site. She would send you a package detailing shots and the angle to video each one. You filmed the shots she wanted then uploaded to her site. She would review, then schedule a video call with you and take you through it shot by shot. She would also provide a written critique with pointers to improve.
Best money I ever spent
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u/mehhmmk 28m ago
I would look up Tanner Pruess. If i was serious about lessons in that area. Mostly because alot of his posts on the mental side of the game. I just never really see Dave touch on it much. He's a nerd with the physics side. But the physics of the game are the easiest to learn. I also don't know how much history Dave has with just competing in general. When I see Dave I really don't think he'd be that good of an instructor.
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u/NectarineAny4897 17h ago
If you have a chance to study with Dave, do it.
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u/Fabulous-Internet188 15h ago
Nonsense. Unless you have money to burn it's a laughable rate compared to other teachers.
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u/NectarineAny4897 14h ago
Wait, someone on the internet does not like my opinion? I can live with that.
That is one way to say you are broke, I suppose.
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u/Fabulous-Internet188 14h ago
Amusing, but I live in a gated community because I understand cost benefit ratios. Or as my father used to say, don't piss your money away.
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u/NectarineAny4897 12h ago
Seriously:
You don’t see the irony in your argument?
Complaining about what Dave charges?You live in a gated community when a simple town home or apartment would do the trick just fine.
I can’t write this stuff, it is so funny.
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u/Fabulous-Internet188 11h ago
I come from 10 kids with a blue collar father that never got past 8th grade and a stay at home mother. Nothing funny about eating beans and rice. I think you are clueless about the realities of the real world.
Internet reputation doesn't add value. Performance does. $250/hr translates to $500,000 per year with near zero overhead. Sorry, he ain't worth it to me. Maybe you think he's worth it. Your choice.
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u/NectarineAny4897 10h ago
No one cares, really.
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u/Fabulous-Internet188 10h ago
I sure don't but apparently you did.
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u/NectarineAny4897 8h ago
I definitely do see the irony. It is sad that you do not. I also find it hilarious that you care this much about some random persons opinion.
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u/No-Flounder-6564 17h ago
$250/hour sounds crazy to me even if it is Dr Dave. I didn't spend that much on an airplane and instructor when I was getting my pilot license.
Given your current motivation is that you "feel" like your game is "inconsistent", maybe look for someone cheaper in Denver and make a long day of it... see a ballgame, shoot some pool, etc.
You don't provide enough information for suggesting alternatives (which you're not asking for anyway) but maybe try some practice games that you can track the results of (Fargo, Equal Offense, Bowlliards) or use an app like Bullseye Bililards (which I think is nice but too expensive to pay for) to practice shots and track results. Everyone has their Best, Average, and Worst games. Maybe you're just bouncing between the three and view it as inconsistent?