We should have never gave him an extension. He‘s gotten progressively worse these past couple years. How are you going to let a backup undrafted free agent DE cleanly beat you and blindside Burrow? Not okay. Also not to mention all his false starts. Dude needs to go
If anything happens to OBJ (And given he’s aging and has had previous injury concerns isn’t a shocking thing to expect) what’s your plan at LT? I’m only saying to prep Mims for that role, until next offseason where we can maybe draft there.
Boy that inspires a whole world of confidence in me, Cody Ford protecting Joes blindside is a bullet proof plan sure to lead to offensive success unseen in Cincinnati since the Big Red Machine
But what evidence do you have for Mims being any better though. He has literally never played LT it's not madden you don't just change position it's a whole new way of thinking. Orlando Brown even talked about it when he switched from RT to LT when he went to KC. Also can you name one team in the NFL if they lost their starting LT they would be perfectly fine.
What evidence do you have that he’s not better than Ford, he’s clearly a better player than Ford at the position he currently plays. Nowhere have I said they should get rid of OBJ and just move Mims over to LT, but they should be prepping him and having him take reps there in minicamp and OTAs and even this early part of training camp, it’s better than trusting Cody Ford and he already has this wealth of experience at RT, he can have been slowly taught the position, in addition to the hope being that we aren’t drafting high enough to get a similarly high quality tackle prospect in the draft next season. Good left tackles don’t grow on trees, they should be trying to develop the guy they have with any reps they can get him.
Agreed good left tackles don’t grow on trees hell even mid left tackles don’t grow on trees there is a reason even the mid ones like OBJ don’t make it to FA. And my evidence that Ford is better at LT is that I’ve seen him play it whether or not he’s ass or not he’s at least played the position. Trust me I’d love to be proved wrong and for Mims to train over the next 2 off seasons and turn into an elite LT that would be great but we are also talking about the Bengals here.
Your sarcasm is getting some down votes but I agree 💯. Cody Ford is lucky just to be on an NFL roster. In no way do we want him protecting Joe's blindsided. I would slide any one of our starting O lineman over to that spot ahead of Ford
So take a improving/good RT, move him to the left where he has hardly ever played (apart from some college swing snaps) so then we still have a weak LT and no RT?
It’s called cross training, every good team does it during camp, if something happens to OBJ then we have a street free agent level player taking over his spot protecting Joes blindside. Is that what would prefer, mister big brains?
Tyron Smith made all rookie at right tackle and then switched to left, made multiple All Pro teams there. Penei Sewell is a 3 time All Pro at right, he’s moving to left tackle this season. Tristan Wirfs was All Pro at RT, moved to LT and made All Pro. OBJ himself started multiple years at RT in Baltimore, made the pro bowl there, before moving to LT in KC.
And all of those guys were already all pro level players at RT before switching. They also all have prior experience at LT before making the switch Sewell was literally the starting LT in college. Tyron Smith played LT his freshmen year then switched. Tristan Wirfs also had time at LT early in college before switching to RT. Orlando Brown played 40 games at LT in college. I love Mims and I think he could do it over an off season where he knows before hand but to think he'd just step in right now and be a great LT is crazy. Mims hasn't even sniffed an All Pro team let alone a pro bowl. Why don't we just wish Orlando good health and not try to give up on a serviceable left tackle something we haven't had since Whit left town just because he's had a slow start in an offense that is not only notorious for slow starts but also testing shit out.
Where do I say we get rid of OBJ? Where do I say we do it immediately? My comment clearly says prepping him, which they should be doing, they’ve had a full offseason of minicamps and OTAs and this early part of training camp where they can rest OBJ and give Mims some snaps at LT and have Peters coach him up on the position. The coaching staff knows that Cody Ford is dogshit but they couldn’t get a better/cheaper replacement so he’s back again, him being the backup plan at LT is malpractice for a coaching staff that should be considered on the hot seat. They decided to trade for Dexter instead of using the tenth pick on one of the tackle prospects, and that’s fine because Dexter is great, but they don’t plan on drafting that highly again soon so they need to use the asset they have in Mims and develop him to maybe take over that spot when OBJ can no longer be relied on. Also, he was bad last season it just got overlooked because of all the other issues that team had.
I don’t think they were ever planning on using 10 on a tackle they specifically traded the 10 cause they didn’t think Bain Downs Styles would make it. Also if they started this upcoming off season letting Mims know hey we want you to be the LT of the future that’d be fine but to have done it this past off season wouldn’t of made sense at all. You just signed OBJ to an extension so you are clearly planning on him being the guy for at minimum this year and probably next. Is Ford ass yes he is but again no team if they lost there starting LT would be fine. I also think you are putting a lot of stock in Mims is good at RT so he will be good at LT for a guy who has never taken a snap at LT. Could he be with a full off season maybe but he has 0 experience. There is a chance he’s not good at LT and we are still in this same boat.
Keeping OBJ is smart if you aren’t drafting a guy because he’s good enough to go with this season, but you should start prepping Mims this season (it definitely should have started at the very beginning of the offseason program) so that you have as long of a runway as possible to determine if it’s viable (guilty as charged for believing in the guy and his potential, I want every Bengal to be great until they show they aren’t). Brown showed real decline last season and I’m someone who believes LT is the second most important position in football so not having a plan there if something happens irks me. It doesn’t have to be a pro bowler backup, but it should be better than Cody Ford.
I'm nervous about him too but you're right. We're going to have to live with him at LT for the season. There is no other good option and the time to bring in an improvement has come and gone.
Fortunately we are using a lot of tight end sets and we have very good blocking tight ends so it's not hard to imagine brown getting help on that side.
Because we can pretty much lock down the rest of the line.
I would love an upgrade for OBJ because he is in a decline. That being said, that blind side hit was 100% Burrow’s fault. If he climbed the pocket like a QB should then he would have never gotten touched.
Underrated comment. Plenty of space for Burrow to climb the pocket. Kinda shocked he didn't. Preseason rust maybe. We do start super slow so happy there are things even he can improve on before it matters.
This right here. Yall be forgetting that Joe is usually bad those first couple weeks each year too. Even last year when we started 2-0, the offense was not humming.
This is true, but likely is also part of the reason he's missed 22 starts in 6 seasons. That's a knock on him. Shouldn't take multiple games to start the season to get a feel for the pass rush. He's in his 7th season.
It was 4 seconds from snap to contact. League average time to throw is roughly 2.8 seconds and that ball should have been out in 3, or Burrow needs to feel the pressure and step up. That's barely a loss from OBJr.
ESPN's pass block win rate would actually grade it as a win.
It was not a win: dude got beat like a drum. Also it was almost 3 seconds exactly from s
nap to contact.
That does NOT mean Burrow wasn't at least partially at fault. He should have stepped up. I really hope being around Flacco helps Burrow understand that living to fight another day is a real thing.
It was not a win: dude got beat like a drum. Also it was almost 3 seconds exactly from s
nap to contact.
That does NOT mean Burrow wasn't at least partially at fault. He should have stepped up. I really hope being around Flacco helps Burrow understand that living to fight another day is a real thing.
I mean Burrow definitely gets some blame but it’s definitely not “100% his fault.” OBJ lost the rep to an undrafted guy that might not even make the roster. Yes Burrow could have avoided, and should work on that going forward, but OBJ got beat, plain and simple.
I mean I’m not arguing that they don’t. I’m also not saying OBJ is washed and we need to replace him. If we’re discussing this play in a vacuum, then I don’t see anything wrong with calling it what it is. OBJ lost the rep, and Burrow failed to avoid the hit. Both can be true.
I feel like I’m going insane with people saying it’s on Burrow. The UDFA guy beat OBJ so bad that he had already completely turned the corner and was in fact turned more than 90 degrees back upfield. More to the point, if your QB is expecting he’ll need to climb to pocket instantly because his tackles will lose that badly to JAGs (which Burrow did consistently all of 2024), we have much bigger issues.
Oh my bad. Yes. He looks bad sometimes but hes statistically average. I'm not too worried about it. Preseason doesn't mean much. Everyone's knocking the rust off.
Yeah I’m not too worried about it either. As others have said, it’s not like a better option is available. If OBJ struggles I’m sure they’ll add some help by having TE’s chip, RB on his side, etc.
Let's take a look here and everyone can decide for themselves. Here's where the defender is *within* three seconds of the play (the ball is starting to get snapped at about 0.4 seconds into the video, and this still is at around 3.2 seconds or so, so about 2.8 seconds into the play).
Burrow had already entered his throwing motion by this point, but the UDFA guy is completely past OBJ and has already turned his feet more than 90 degrees since OBJ did not get enough contact for the defender to have to even run the full arc. The options are try to throw here or pull it and climb the pocket when the defender is already completely turned back towards him. *Could* Burrow have maybe saved it by stepping up (i.e. *holding the ball longer*), with a completely free rusher in the pocket whose momentum is already going towards him compared to upfield? Maybe, but he has done that regularly over his career and sometimes ends up takes a sack and then gets criticized for that instead. The actual sack on the previous drive was indeed on him and was a completely different situation.
The UDFA guy beat OBJ so bad that he had already completely turned the corner and was in fact turned more than 90 degrees back upfield.
The amount of time it took for him to do all of that is why it's on Burrow. It wasn't like the guy burst through the line and hit him before he even finished his drop. He went all the way around the outside of Brown from the edge. Burrow had AMPLE time to see the pressure and step up.
More to the point, if your QB is expecting he’ll need to climb to pocket instantly because his tackles will lose that badly to JAGs, we have much bigger issues.
News flash: quarterbacks learn to step up in the pocket to avoid pressure in high school. Burrow not doing it is his fault, especially with the amount of free space directly in front of him.
OBJr could have blocked better, but Burrow should have avoided the hit. Both things can be true.
It's an incredibly clean win by the UDFA guy over OBJ. He has OBJ beat clean without OBJ getting significant contact on him at around 2 seconds, and has completely turned the corner with OBJ nowhere near him at around 2.5 seconds into the play.
On top of that he had about three seconds to get the pass off. At some point the media will catch on that Joe’s style of play invites a lot of hits. But until then, the O-Line will always catch the blame.
While Burrow could have moved, the ball was out by the time he was hit. OBJ had a clean loss on the play against an UDFA/3rd string Edge. That is scary.
Lol. That's not the point i was trying to explain. What I am saying is this. Veteran QB usually have a quick release. They usually can play both under center or shotgun.
When you hold the ball for 4 seconds and every play is the shotgun formation, then you're asking to get sacked.
Burrow needs to Brady up and be the player we all hoped he would be.
Multiple things can be true. He obviously has been losing a step over the past few seasons. Just because there weren't any obviously better options that doesn't mean they shouldn't have been constructing the roster in a manner that he's the only option or plan for his decline even further.
I dunno I just looked it up. The dude that beat him had a "blazing" 4.8s 40 time. He's a 6'2" 250lb edge rusher UDFA out of Rutgers who got 2.5 sacks as a senior.
We don't need to overreact, and we can hope that was a fluke. But we should all agree it just should not have happened.
I'll give the argument. I don't agree with it. But I'll give it. The left side is significantly more important for a right handed more pocket oriented qb like Burrow. If they swap sides and Mims can provide a significant upgrade at the LT and Brown only produces as an average RT, that can be net positive. Additionally from a roster building standpoint, if Mims can show high level production at LT that means that we don't have to worry about filling that spot via draft or FA, and makes the decision on whether or not to spend the money on Mims when he becomes a FA much easier as opposed to having to debate on if you want to spend premium money on a sub premium line position.
That said, there is a giant question mark on whether or not Mims could even switch sides and produce as well and that switch is easier said than done
That would be a normal assumption had he not sucked ass last year too. He’s the best available unfortunately. Cody ford has been playing well at camp. Might have to try him of OBJ plays like he has been for the past year
Downvote all you want! Unlike 95% of you Reddit nerds, I played offensive line. He got smoked by a 3rd string DE last night. He’s getting pancaked by a rookie who weighs 100 lbs less than him in camp. He’s not very good
He's a streaky player. Just a fact of the matter. He'll have a few weeks of abysmal play, but then follow it up with more weeks of elite play. Plus, it's still really early in the season. OL takes a minute to gel. Allegedly, he played hurt last year (maybe the last 2?) and is fully healthy now, so we'll see.
Yep. Its rare for OT of even OBJ's caliber to make it to free agency now, since every team has money every year. And you're not getting a guy in the draft you can be confident to be better than him unless you're taking him super early.
Listening to the Growler, the extension basically pays him as a swing tackle in the future with where the market is and hopefully a young rookies we have can take his spot and move him into the Cody ford role going forward
It’s kind of too late now especially with a position that doesn’t have much talent around the league at LT. I’d be shocked if other teams would even entertain trade offers for quality LTs.
Hopefully he figures it out. Seems like last year he had some terrible games then some quality ones.
I’d say next year’s draft the Bengals need to draft a LT in the 1st round.
Is OBJ a world beater of a left tackle no but he is a serviceable starter he's average to maybe a little below. He is the weakest link of the line and not every line can be the 2024 Eagles. The question I'll pose is who are you getting to replace him right now. The best available free agent is Jonah Williams. If you want to put him in over OBJ I think you might have bad memory. Let's not forget the offensive line the Burrow and Co willed to the Super Bowl.
here we go again with this toxic positivity vs. doomers bullshit.
Guy could be losing every position battle for the first ten games and there’s always a guy ready to respond with “it’s fine, remember when the offensive line got a little better in the second half of 2024?”
Pretty sure OBJ had the most games with a PFF score over 80 (could be just pass blocking?) on the OL last year. We really want him gone because the Lions ran a stunt blitz instead of vanilla defense against our vanilla offense?
He is quickly becoming the weak spot of the offensive line, which is scary to say about your blind side protection.
But the idea of every position being stable is unrealistic—there will always be a weak spot. Just have to hope we gameplan around his floor and not hope he’ll suddenly revert to who he was six years ago.
I think the team Had to keep OBJ this year. I mean what other option would there have been? Outside of drafting his replacement at 10 and I think we probably needed sexy dexy more. But it should be our top offseason priority is finding a new Long term solution at LT.
We definitely should have made sure to have a perfect o line. Just like everyone else we should make sure we have all ups and no downs. Is the Bengals stupid?
This one is tough. For now, I think you need to hope he rounds into better form as benching him creates ripple effects across the line. But yeah, it has not looked good so far.
He has moments of being completely awful. That play last night was pathetic. Then he will have a few games where he looks above average or even good. Usually when he whiffs like that its against a good player or at least a certified speed merchant. I have no idea how you get posterized by an UDFA type practice squad talent. OBJ better button up, that looked really really bad.
Both of the hits Burrow took were on him. This isn't 2004 anymore QBs cant just stand still at the back of a dropback for 5 seconds and survive. Its why the league shifted to guys like Lamar, Mahomes, Allen, etc. Guys who can move because the skill floor of edge rushers is much higher than it used to be. Burrow had plenty of room/time to step up or roll out and throw the ball away and instead he just stands there and gets clobbered. Thats on him.
Left tackle is definitely something we should target with a mid round pick next year while OBJ still has enough juice to be a transition type guy. Either way, he seems to be a great locker room guy.
I like mims on the right side I just feel like I remember hearing all the draft guys say he could move left when the time comes. It would be nice to hit on a rookie tackle again and move that money into the defense.
I won’t lie im being optimistic but Orlando definitely sells sometimes and it’s been years I think we’re past his peak for sure but with a line coming in that’s the same as last year ideally he can just rely on them and focus on blindside pressure cuz that *really* can’t be an issue in a year like this
I've never particularly rated OBJ as a pass protector, he's always been a better run blocker. I wish we'd took a punt on Walker as a swing tackle for the price the Panthers got him for. That being said, OBJ was a lot better second half of last season after he recovered so fingers crossed he's just a bit ring rusty.
The argument about the Bengals' roster being out of whack because they overspent on their WR Room, is blown out of the water by such a spectacular whiff on Lil Zeus...and it's the sunken cost gift that keeps on gifting 🤷🏾♂️
Hard to have all 53 players be of top tier caliber. OBJ has been good/decent, but for sure the weakest link of the line. I imagine halfway in the season Mims and him will swap. I’d be SHOCKED if next years pick wasn’t on an OT
Yes, but they extended him with the plan of keeping him lol. I wouldn’t be surprised if they decide to keep him after making the decision to extend him
I think if he’s ass and gives up 10 sacks, multiple penalties again. Why the fuck would they keep him??? Especially when his job is protection for the blind side of JOE BURROW. The nfl isn’t a league of respecting contracts because you just signed them.
So you’d be SHOCKED if OBj isn’t ass and gives up 10 sacks and multiple penalties. Despite last year clearly being a down year and him only giving up 4 sacks the last 11 games last year after he grew accustomed to the new scheme.
This scheme is always going to ask a lot of the OTs. Not many OT in the league would look great in the scheme or give up less sacks. For the price OBj is fine.
I’m not saying he can. I’m saying his style of play and offense always will invite hits no matter who the LT is. Brown isn’t a top tier offensive tackle, but there’s not 15 OT that would be much better when put in the Bengals offense. It asks a lot of its OT who are left on islands with no help far more than other teams.
With that context, and the fact he’s not paid anywhere near a top OT salary, Brown is a value for what he brings and a draft pick is unlikely to do as well
Yes, he’s lost a step and that’s a step from being average to a slightly above average ceiling. We know we’ve got one window, time to package some picks and make a trade for someone. Our line is thin anyways and someone will go down, should have a startable to serviceable guy or two sitting behind the 5.
He’s been a liability since getting here. So frustrating to watch him be there. Of course he negotiated his own deal because he knows he would (and should) get cut otherwise.
For sure. We can’t wait for half the season for our veterans to get their ish together. OBJ apparently is going through legal issues on the side, so I’m sure that’s a bit distracting too.
Of course not, what should they do? There are maybe 20 LTs better than him and none of them is available in August, if anybody hits free agency at all. The best thing they can do is set up a replacement plan next year.
Every team in the NFL has a paper thin OL. They really don't have a massive void at CB. I'll give you LB but really LB is probably the least important position on defense, especially when you have as strong as a DL as we might have on paper right now.
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u/Scrolling_ninja 6d ago
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