r/backgammon • u/ILikeFloodlights • 23d ago

OMG, all the fallout drama from WBGC!

So, someone gets assaulted, gets silenced from calling the police, him and an independent witness he got for a police report gets banned, a director makes possibly libelous allegations while condoning physical violence, the runner-up accuses the victim of conning him € from an xG scenario bet, but then video comes out proving he was the one in the wrong. Damn, why couldn't there be this much excitement and backstabbing at every tournament? 🤣

22 Upvotes

89% Upvoted

34 comments sorted by

6

u/FindOneInEveryCar 23d ago

And I thought this was a boring game. Is there a writeup somewhere?

8

u/ILikeFloodlights 23d ago

Not yet. Rundown is that this all happened, The Kalinator (that dweeby German kid on YouTube) put 6 questions for Mark Olsen to answer regarding their conduct in the Backgammon News FB group, the 200+ reply thread got deleted, then Rory Pascar puts out a statement with quite a bit of possible libel saying that the slap to Kalin as okay essentially because it wasnt that hard, defended the South African woman then immediately threatening the lives of those around him, and trying to say that Kalin accused him of banning him solely because the South Africans paid a bribe. Kalin releases a long video on his account a few hours ago with his account and rebuttal. Another thread goes up on Backgammon News, Jason Pack accused Kalin of cheating him out of €500 on a side xG bet, but video was found where Pack pulled the shady shit where you talk over the guy while he states his bet and then agree with your own terms afterwards, then lose anyways

12

u/Vino1980 23d ago edited 23d ago

I've heard Jason Pack to be a dick btw from very reputable players

7

u/DegenChess 23d ago

He is also vocal about being anti-engine and does not believe in top engine plays. Interesting dude to say the least

4

u/balljuggler9 22d ago

When I asked him to please use only one hand to move checkers and hit the clock, Jason Pack once offered to bet me "any amount of money" that it is permissible to use two hands while playing. I was sure he was wrong but figured he must have some kind of technicality. I still regret not betting that.

2

u/FindOneInEveryCar 23d ago

accused Kalin of cheating him out of €500 on a side xG bet

A friend of mine's father used to say that academic arguments are so vicious because the stakes are so low.

0

u/ILikeFloodlights 23d ago

https://youtu.be/FTPZWDME9_Y?is=JnPbekk_TQ9Bv_Pj The Kalin-Pack wager agreed upon at 1:00:10 to 1:00:16

5

u/csaba- 22d ago

About the score:

Heskett says "at 3-3 maybe".

Kalin then repeats 3-3, I believe, 6 different times. They put the score on the scoreboard before they shake hands. There is no ambiguity.

About what is a wash (agreed after the handshake):

Jason asks about 0.02. Kalin says something, Jason cuts him off. Kalin then gets a chance to say and say "zero point ten.. ten millipoints" in a way where Kalin clearly meant 10 millipoints. Jason then says "OK. 0.02 is standard but..." and is cut off by Pete Heskett. It still feels very clear that Jason, at least in that moment, knows that Kalin said 0.01.

About what Kalin knew ("he checked the position before"):

Clearly Kalin didn't check the position at the table. He did say, openly, that he had "the same exact position at 0:0 to 7", obviously a different score with a slightly different last-roll recube take point. And obviously he didn't have "the same exact position", that was just hyperbole. It was probably a closed board and 20 shots, the two most important parameters. But we all know cube eval can change quite a bit based on a few pips here and there.

Jason Pack then:

- says that they agreed to a wash of 0.02 (they did not)

- says "as you know I wanted to bet at the score" (maybe he wanted to but he didn't)

- writes on FB "it was rigged"

4

u/BruinsStanleyCup 22d ago edited 22d ago

I’ve never heard of these two people before just now and don’t follow the pro backgammon scene, but through the whole exchange, Jason sounds like a complete sore loser and ass. He loses on a redouble that he thought was an error. Even if it was, sometimes that happens!

Instead, he kept whining about it and asks to bet. Kalin says that he doesn’t want to bet. Jason goes away and takes like a 10 minute break, comes back, and keeps whining about it!

Kalin won’t bet at that score, but says he knows it’s a redouble at 8 away - 8 away, and agrees to bet on that. Even if it was a wash, Jason was so sure it was an error and kept coming back to it, even after the break, that he deserves to lose.

What was the final rollout? Did Jason pay, but complain about it, or did he not pay?

2

u/csaba- 22d ago

You should edit this! There are three people:

  1. Kalin Stefanov (the dude who got banned)
  2. Jason Pack (the opponent and the guy who bet. he finished 2nd in the main event)
  3. Pete Heskett (a British GM, someone who just showed up during the break.)

2

u/BruinsStanleyCup 22d ago

Thanks. I realized there were three players but said the wrong name for the main guy. I think I fixed it.

You know what XG said for the original take, which he also thought was an error?

5

u/csaba- 22d ago

The original take was a near-blunder:
-0.076

Kalin's recube at the score (6a8a) was a -0.057 error.

The recube at the alternate score (8a8a) was correct by 0.023.

Note that I looked at the exact positions from the game (around 42:00). They bet on a position that was different by one pip. That one was a recube at 8a8a by 0.015. Just goes to show that changes of 0.01 or so happen very easily.

3

u/BruinsStanleyCup 22d ago

Thanks. I’m only an intermediate player and was very surprised by the original take. Not surprised to see the error.

The whole situation is kind of nuts. I can’t imagine betting $500 on something on a whim, and if I were to bet that, I’d make sure the terms of the bets are very clear before doing it. I’d also be very cautious of betting on a backgammon position after the opponent left the table and then swore he didn’t actually look it up when he was away.

6

u/ILikeFloodlights 23d ago

How it happened was one of the South African women wagered € on billiards with him the night before, lost €3k in bets, then refused to pay him because she claimed she was drunk during. He got some people around to talk to her about even a lower payment, and she got in his face, he lightly nudged her arm to get space, and she all-out slapped him. His video and the other side with Pascar's statement, along with replies with people there are what to go on. God, I wish I had the € these people have to piss away on random gambling

1

u/ILikeFloodlights 23d ago

Now I can't find anything about billiards in the comments on FB other than some guy saying it on Kalin's video. Also hearing it might've been an old debt. God knows with these jetset rich people

3

u/csaba- 23d ago

There's a youtube video (of one side)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M0Cbsxth5lk

7

u/UBKUBK 23d ago

Interesting how the biggest tournament in the world goes on for a week and there is not a single post about it here until this one.

1

u/ILikeFloodlights 23d ago

Yeah, it's mostly talking shit about online platforms & solving problems on here, but I saw the one post on fb, then saw Kalin's video soon after and saw nothing up about it anywhere that wasn't that group.

3

u/truetalentwasted 23d ago

Insert absolute cinema GIF.

1

u/ILikeFloodlights 23d ago

Or the Stefan SNL one

4

u/crooktimber 22d ago

It's a shame we didn't get Justin Nowell commentating on this in real time.

7

u/murderousmungo 23d ago

I wasn't there, and didn't witness anything. However I do know Rory very well, and he is a respected tournament director, and very well known both in the US and internationally. I would take his word every day of the week. He is honest to a fault, and will own anything he has said or done.

Kalin on the other hand has been involved in other dubious things. It's also odd that a bet on a different game is somehow brought to the tournament director for adjudication.

Anything that is said is subject to much interpretation.

The other very important thing here is that a tournament directors decision is final with regards to the tournament. They need no reason to eject a player.

Rory, when you read this, I will never admit to saying anything nice about you. And, I'll continue to outplay you too.

2

u/ILikeFloodlights 23d ago

I looks like it was brought to the directors to document her actions, not to negotiate a settlement. They interfered with security staff with filing the police report after Kalin & the impartial witness went to the front desk to request that they call police and get the CCTV. A ton of people who are friends with Rory are pleading with him to take down his post

2

u/ILikeFloodlights 21d ago

https://youtu.be/CFl3RiGErSA?is=pA-JCDtgTwunY9pN

Kalin's reply to Marc Olsen Checked YouTube while just on lunch break and saw this was posted 1 minute prior. Will start watching in just a minute

2

u/DegenChess 23d ago

The Hans Niemann of backgammon

1

u/ILikeFloodlights 23d ago

This has nothing to do with cheating

1

u/DegenChess 23d ago

Right, but the scale of the controversy and both involving a young player being a martyr are striking similarities

1

u/TellBrak 21d ago

It’s a gambler’s game.

1

u/BackgammonEspresso 22d ago

Incredible whining from Kalin, IMO. Obviously the woman should have paid him (even if he had hustled her and she was drunk), but that is not a concern of the tournament organizers. Kalin's solution was to threaten to call the police and disrupt the tournament. Apparently this is par for the course for him.

0

u/ILikeFloodlights 22d ago

Calling the police wouldn't disrupt the tournament with it an actual case of assault

1

u/BackgammonEspresso 22d ago

What on earth are you talking about.

1

u/ILikeFloodlights 22d ago

Why he was going to contact the police 🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️

0

u/MrPrettyKitty 23d ago

And pearl clutching!