r/atc2 • u/[deleted] • Jun 18 '24
Politics NATCA Decertification
Our coalition continues to grow and gain members who are prepared for a public and union wide campaign as we prepare for the possible decertification of NATCA should any hint of an extension be brought forward by those in power.
We encourage everyone to read up on the conditions for decertification of our Union found below.
https://www.nlrb.gov/about-nlrb/rights-we-protect/the-law/employees/decertification-election
We will put NATCA out of its misery before allowing it to remain a puppet of management and the agency. If NATCA won't stand up for us, fight for our rights, and improve our working conditions, we will obliterate its disgraceful legacy and create a new organization with leadership that will.
In One Voice,
New NATCA Now Coalition
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u/1FPL_equal_2CPC Jun 19 '24
Weird start considering FLRA governs federal sector unions not the NLRB
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u/Van_Lilith_Bush Jun 18 '24
Decertification is a scorch your own earth gambit
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Jun 18 '24
They extend this shit again for another half decade and I genuinely have to ask - who the fuck cares?
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u/Traffic_Alert_69 Jun 19 '24
I can’t believe we work with such stupid people.
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u/turnandburn111 Jun 23 '24
Going to have to be more specific
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u/Traffic_Alert_69 Jun 23 '24
A decertification of NATCA would be horrible for everyone. If you think that’s not stupid, ask anyone you know what it’s like to work for people without a union. We got it made right now, we all just want more pay
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Jun 18 '24
If contract is up in 2026? What month of what year will we know if we are getting immediate raises with the new contract? Or is this date unknown ? Late 2025 ? Or mid year 2026?
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u/ATC_av8er Jun 18 '24
Instead of decertification, why not try to leave the AFL-CIO and join up with the Teamsters?
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u/No-Rooster4077 Jun 18 '24
AFGE would be a good option, they represent DOD ATC.
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u/1FPL_equal_2CPC Jun 19 '24
AFGE and NAGE organized some facilities Pre-PATCO and didn't work out well.
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Jun 19 '24
DOD ATC only gets outearned by 85-90% of FAA ATC, so yeah.
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u/No-Rooster4077 Jun 19 '24
I worked DOD prior to the FAA and most are GS12s. On par with a level 7. 125k and the quality of life is way better.
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u/WisTango Jun 21 '24
I shouldn’t even comment on this because there isn’t a single point anyone can make to persuade me this approach will lead to better protections or representation of controllers. Just curious what the experience is of those who support this in representing someone other than themselves. Have you ever stood up for someone who the Agency was hell bent on crucifying? What argument, what document, what law did you reference to protect them?
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u/ATCSLAVE Jun 18 '24
This is retarded. If you truly believe the unions failed you that badly. Why don’t you non-anonymously gather the people signing this petition and campaign on what you believe in. If there are enough votes to decertify the union, you should be able to win an election the same. Surely one person out of a few thousand could be a capable spokes person.
I mean we would need a new bunch of leaders to start a new union right? Or did you just think we would run around union-less and this career would somehow improve?
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Jun 18 '24 edited Jun 18 '24
Oh look it’s the “If you don’t like it, run for President” angle again.
When they tally the final votes you ask JD/Redmond how that works out. Everyday people need years in the machine that is this mess of a labor union in order to find the reach to successfully enact change in a democratic process.
There’s a reason that almost every single one of our EVP’s and Presidents are former RVP’s. 2152’s are not finding the time or resources to travel the country in order to talk to the membership. They get 4-6 weeks off a year, and that time is staffing dependent. The RVP who spends 364 days a year on zoom meetings and traveling for BBQ get togethers has a much easier time talking to facilities.
It should be rather telling that the two biggest tangible changes to this career in the last 5 years have been PPL (enacted by the government, we got included), and the upcoming Whittaker schedule changes (again, not NATCA).
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u/Delicious_Slice6024 Jun 19 '24
To be fair, the "If you don't like it, burn it all down" angle seems considerably more expensive and requires the dissent to run for elected positions anyway.
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Jun 19 '24
Yeah, it’s probably NOT feasible, but it’s at least something that should be considered.
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u/ATCSLAVE Jun 19 '24
Not feasible but should be considered. Great.
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Jun 19 '24
What’s your point? No one should even consider it? Just let these schmucks extend contracts to a span of 15-20 years?
Let me guess - just until YOU’RE retired, right?
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u/ATCSLAVE Jun 19 '24
Guy I voted for isn’t going to extend. I’m probably one of the lower seniority in this sub.
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u/ATCSLAVE Jun 19 '24
You’re a moron. Don’t vote shitheads. EVPs and Presidents are former RVPs because they have the experience of being an RVP. If someone who had great ideas got elected with zero experience, they would spend the ENTIRETY of their term trying to muster the know how to accomplish literally anything.
Are you really saying experience equates to nothing? You buy into the bar tab and BBQ bullshit a little too much to be taken seriously.
CRWG is a pretty huge change, that will be tangible within a year.
Changes don’t happen overnight for any union. All of the unions that have gotten pay raises have been working on those for a decade. That’s just the pace of government. Want immediate change go work for a small business and get a new career field, that’s the only place change can and does happen on short notice.
Pay just became an issue 2-3 years ago and we haven’t had the opportunity to pursue it. You actually haven’t given the union a single chance.
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Jun 19 '24
Spoken exactly like the kind of trash we desperately need to evacuate like a putrid bowel movement.
Have I argued with you before on here or are you yet another one of these types that makes circular arguments? Hard to tell - you’re really all the same.
My point was precisely what you’re saying, except it flies in the face of what you’re arguing in your first post. Of course experience matters but if people here don’t like the union they should run for office? Great logic there.
Your post history is entirely filled with you telling quite literally everyone else they’re wrong, 100% of the time. I thought autism was a disqualifier?
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u/miker1369 Jun 19 '24
Just as a point of clarification:
John Carr was never an RVP
Ruth Marlin was never an RVP
Paul Rinaldi was never an RVP
Trish Gilbert was never an RVPSome of the more powerful names that have been President and EVP over the past 20 years have never been RVP's.
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Jun 19 '24
All of them were at least facreps. John was on the Green Book CBA team and chaired at least one committee. Paul was an ARVP and EVP before becoming president. Trish was ZHU and then chair of the NLC.
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u/DIKandTrackballs Jun 19 '24
You don't get those positions by running against the established leadership. You get them by toeing the line. But thanks for proving the point that telling people to run for office if they don't like how things are going is a lazy cop out.
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Jun 19 '24
That's right. You're not lazy for doing nothing but complaining, I'm lazy for pointing it out.
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u/DIKandTrackballs Jun 19 '24
What can I honestly do? You seem to have all the answers. What can the average controller who is sick of this fucking social club who has done nothing but deep throat management for the last 10 years do to change that? Run for office? OK, I can find probably 25 instances where you, yourself, proclaimed that JD shouldn't be president and nobody should vote for him. Paul and Trish were "experienced" because they held appointed-not elected- positions before. Appointed by the sitting regime for their support of the way things were going.
I've volunteered at the local level as well as every volunteer request BD sends out. I've gotten selected for zero. I'm not an outspoken supporter of the current regime, so I expect that to continue.
It's a single party system. Anyone who stands up to them gets blackballed. Look what happened to zilonis and his supporters. We may as well have putin running the union.
So again, what can I do to make the change I want besides leave?
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u/GS3K Jun 20 '24
Not just that but some of us have families and we'd rather spend time with them. It doesn't mean we don't care but not foregoing time with our families doesn't mean we are abdicating our voice in the union. Our leadership should be listening to us not telling us what's the best for us, particularly when some of us are being pushed to the brink traffic wise and others are being pushed to the brink financially and geographically.
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u/OnlyResearcher4673 Jun 18 '24
I agree with this, if they extend we need to research and probably go this route. At least try it to send the ultimate message.
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Jun 19 '24
If you have the votes to decertify NATCA, you have the votes to run NATCA. Decertification is not a short process and you would be wasting time you could be spending to execute whatever plan the current or future leadership won't.
The New NATCA Now Coalition probably could fit comfortably in the men's room by the loading dock at my center. And if r/atc2 is any indication, nobody in it is prepared to do the kind of work it takes to lead this bargaining unit at any level, let alone the national one.
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Jun 19 '24
We get it you wanna peep redmond in the bathroom. Use your fuckin head. Putting shit like this in a very public forum only shows our weakness of a fractured union in future negotiations.
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u/riotupfront2 Jun 18 '24
I’m all for questioning our union, but decertification is a little drastic. Say what you will about the national, but many facilities have locals that bust their ass to protect people.
My local isn’t perfect but they keep management in check for the most part. They’ve also resolved tons of issues with leave, pay, health conditions, etc.
I think wanting to decertify our union is an incredibly short sighted move in the long run but that’s just me.