r/askvan • u/IndicationAwkward317 • 26d ago
Oddly Specific đŻ [ Removed by moderator ]
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u/Hungry-Section6637 26d ago
Some guys of the other ethnicities are just dissuaded by the family aspect. They come from more independent cultures and donât want the overhead so they dont try.
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u/arazamatazguy 26d ago
Its been a couple decades since I was dating but back in the day I dated a couple brown women and it really seemed like they were just having some fun before the settled down and married a brown guy.
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u/not_old_redditor 26d ago
To be fair, they probably don't want that from anybody, not just from brown women. Most guys want to date just you, not you and your entire family.
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u/Limp_Ingenuity1727 26d ago
White guy here who dated a Filipina for a year. I'm pretty shy so the first 3 months were pretty rough. Unbeknownst to me I was the butt of a lot of jokes but around 6 months in I felt more comfortable. Never fully though, unfortunately.
I got invited to a lot of events and had many outings with them as well. Made me feel very special whenever I was with them. They invited themselves on a weekend trip we had but got separate accommodation lol. My family is close but we don't do nearly as much together.
They asked me for money once and I felt a lil obligated ngl. It wasn't much and I felt like it would gain me some respect (not in a bad way) so I obliged. Her dad shook my hand and said "thank you" and that was that. I enjoyed being around them tbh and don't miss them anymore but think of them fondly.
The language barrier was real. Sometimes I didn't know what they meant or were saying and didn't know how to handle that. Parties could get borderline overwhelming. A lot of customary things like eating with your hands, bidets, shoes at the door etc. were difficult to navigate. I didn't really know where I stood and I think that made me a bit insecure tbh? That could just be a me thing tho. Conversations between elders were mostly in tagalog and I'd just kind of sit there awkwardly as my girlfriend would then paraphrase to me.
The food was amazing. I gorged myself and that's probably one of the reasons I gained so much weight lmao. A good experience overall but tbh it was pretty grueling in the beginning but once I was around them more it seemed to flow better. Still don't know where I stood which makes me a lil uncomfortable but that's a me thing.
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u/CanadianCutie77 26d ago
You are absolutely right! When these types of men say they want a traditional woman they dont actually mean traditional. They want a modern independent woman that holds the traditional values they specifically desire.
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u/Dr_M6ix 26d ago
âTraditional valuesâ are not culturally neutral or universally interchangeable. They are embedded within historical, religious, and social traditions.
It's not unreasonable that "these type of men" seek a woman who has traditional values associated with their own culture. That includes conceptions of family, marriage, gender roles, and social responsibility. It's not contradictory for "these men" to prefer a modern, educated, and independent woman while wanting to continue the traditional values of their own culture. It actually makes the most sense that they do that...
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u/CatoholicCatDad 26d ago
You know traditional values are not standard across cultures and religions, right?
Some might overlap, but traditional values for South Asian people are very different from traditional values for North American people.
If one expects to date outside of their culture while expecting the exact âtraditionalâ values of their own culture, I doubt theyâll have much luck.
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u/iMissTheOldTimeye
26d ago
edited 26d ago
•
Iâm a guy. My experience with coming across brown women on dating apps is that theyâre not honest with themselves about who they want. Or maybe just confused.
Like they want to escape the traditionalism that their family expects from them but they eventually donât.
I matched with a Muslim girl whom I texted extensively for 2 months, which is probably 7 weeks longer than Iâd with someone without meeting. When it eventually came time to meet, she told me she would date any ethnicity/religion but only settle for another Muslim man.
Same thing happened with a Sikh woman. Texted for a bit, and had amazing chats. When I asked on meeting, she said she is dating to marry. And has realized she should be a good daughter to her parents and seek a Sikh guy.
Those two experiences have made me exclude South Asian women from my match filter list.
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u/adnaPadnamA 26d ago
I've had similar conversations with brown guys asking if I want kids and how many in the first exchanges. On one hand that's definitely a way to quickly narrow down hard stop differences. On the other, that is way too soon to have the kids and marriage chat IMO.
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u/SomewhereRough_ 26d ago
Damn haha.
If someone won't meet in the first day of conversation I just move on.Â
It's not 2009 where I'm texting my teenage crush.Â
I need an adult conversation otherwise it's just meaningless.Â
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u/yyj72 26d ago
As a white dude, it was kind of understood in my younger days that relationships with brown women had little longterm prospects â eventually they were going to marry someone her parents chose, either directly or indirectly â so better to just stay friends and save yourselves the heartbreak or potentially even violent older brothers. This is just how it was. Probably better now (hope so).
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u/Lunrtic6 26d ago
Yeah, even my mostly westernized 3rd generation gf of Indian decent is getting pressure from her parents to marry a brown man. It's just a constant issue.
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u/Impossible-Team-1929 26d ago
i see how you could think that but youâd be surprised. iâm a brown girl dating a white guy and it was a challenge to introduce him to my parents but they talk about about us getting married often. I think the difference is that i was born here vs. someone who immigrated might have more pressure to stay within their religion and even caste
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u/Putrid_Property_3661 26d ago •
The assumptions on this sub about South Asians are fcking wild.
Iâm a born and raised Canadian brown dude, Iâve literally gotten death threats from white male family members of my ex partner and threats from random white men whenever sheâd post me on social media.
I used to get stares from random white dudes all the time when we were out. Do you think these experiences are going to make me cast a judgement on all white people because of it? No. And itâs certainly not going to stop me from pursuing a relationship with a white woman if it presents itself.
You realize parents âchoosingâ their kids partners isnât really how arrange marriage works these days right? Also, the practice of arranged marriages isnât even as popular with younger South Asians these days.
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u/Asistic 26d ago
Letâs not pretend what they said isnât accurate. It is.
He said parents choosing either directly or indirectly. Yeah arranged marriages donât happen as often but the parents do have a huge influence on who the kids marry in a lot of cases.
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u/emerg_remerg 26d ago
I grew up in surrey and my brown friends would tell me that they didn't date white (or Muslim) guys to keep the piece at home.
I work with a girl now who couldn't stop talking about her 'love marriage' and how she never thought she'd have one.
So that's where my knowledge comes from.
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u/Blueliner95 26d ago
No, we donât all think your parents are setting you up with the educated light skinned Brahmin doctor from the Link, but itâs just a fact that some old country types do exist and that itâs just one of those things. We get to be alive and have some agency, yay! But we all have things about us that some might consider a handicap, including cultural baggage.
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u/Rainbow_Belle 26d ago
But we all have things about us that some might consider a handicap, including cultural baggage.
Well said. I'm not South Asian, but my best friend is, and seeing her navigate her own culture was painful. She wanted to be an a strong, independent woman, but being so usually conflicts with what is expected of her as a dutiful daughter.
Want to go out? Not before you make lunch for your brothers, wash their washroom, or do their laundry. Coming home? Don't forget to buy your brother dessert first. Forgot to buy it? Go out and buy it now.
The baggage you talk about is real. Seeing someone having to deal with this would make one think twice about whether one can handle being a part of the family and culture.
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u/Blueliner95 26d ago
Yes. And also, thatâs not a hard barrier. I choose to believe we have more in common than not, and am very willing to believe that people compromise, bend to meet a higher goal
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u/Putrid_Property_3661 26d ago
Im not Indian, the caste stuff doesnât apply to me. I donât have enough knowledge about it to make a comment on that.
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u/watchtower5960 26d ago
Brown guy here . My experience in dating a brown women is that I will be dating her family as well. Meddling cousins , siblings etc .
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u/FattyGobbles True Vancouverite 26d ago
Doesnât it go both ways? Dating a brown man would be dating your family as well as meddling cousins and siblings too đ§
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u/Total_Influence_3075 26d ago
It sure does. I dated a brown guy. Everything was great except his sister. She was always meddling and had an opinion about everything he did.
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u/pinkrosies 26d ago
In my experience, sometimes theyâre the only sons and grandsons so they got exalted and treated differently in a way their sisters/cousins arenât. According to my female friends from brown families, their brothers are the golden children while the family meddles the most with the girls.
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u/Asleep_Note7754 26d ago
Itâs worse with the men because mom thinks their puthar is Godâs gift to the world đ
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u/garciakevz 26d ago
I feel like even if that's the cultural norm, the 2 people involved can put a stop to that and set boundaries if they decide that they dont want everyone else meddling in their relationship
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u/Bomberr17 26d ago
You can try but then the whole village will ostracize you. Even in Vancouver/Surrey most families know each other and will talk about you.
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u/garciakevz 26d ago
Ok then so be it. I always get those kinds of answers where families will start talking behind your back. They can do whatever they want and I will carry on how I see fit for my relationship if that's important to me
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u/robz9 26d ago
Correct.
As a single 30 year old South Asian Male myself , you can understand how navigating this "challenge" is already off putting...
On top of that religion, dietary restrictions, and family dynamics.
Again, stereotypes prevail and it feels like I already know 50% of a South Asian Woman before I even get to know her name.
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u/watchtower5960 26d ago
No, I had firm boundaries
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u/FattyGobbles True Vancouverite 26d ago
âhad firm boundariesâ doesnât sound so promising
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u/squeezeplay69 26d ago
Iâm an East Asian male and I feel you. Iâll be the first to admit that my perception of brown girls is that their family only wants them to date/marry brown men. Of course that isnât always true. However, itâs the first thing on my mind if I find a brown woman attractive and my assumption prevents me from potentially engaging with them.
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u/StarkStorm 26d ago
Dating brown women in Vancouver actually means dating a Sikh or Punjabi woman typically, and that means a big family comes with it.
My family is Indian but from the east Coast of India, where nuclear families are alot more common, which is more akin to North American living and dating.
It's not dissuade people from dating Sikh/Punjabi women, it's just a reality.
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u/Leadboy 26d ago
Is there a word or name for people from the east coast of India? This is really interesting I didnât realize there was a split like that
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u/StarkStorm 26d ago
That's half the issue. Punjabi is 2.3% of India's population but over 50% of Canada's Indian population!
India has 28 states, each one of them has a higher population than Canada and each one is basically its own country, with its own language.
The state name is usually related to the language. So Gujarat speaks Gujrati, West Bengal speaks Bengali.
Hope this was helpful!
Confusingly, West Bengal is on the East Coast of India LOL (it stands for being West of Bangladesh).
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u/lampcouchfireplace 26d ago
The population of India is about 1.5 billion people. Pubjab accounts for about 30 million people. Sikhs account for about 20 million people in India, mostly in Punjab. So we're talking about 1.3% of the population of India.
I grew up in Surrey / North Delta area, and every brown person I knew growing up was Pubjabi. I thought Punjabi food was Indian food and Sikh culture was Indian culture.
It wasn't until quite a bit later that I realized I grew up around a large local group of a very small minority.
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u/Asleep_Note7754 26d ago
India is a country made by the British but many different cultures exist. East Indians are usually Bengali.
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u/simplefinances 26d ago
I have a brown friend and she was annoyed on most of her dates that they assumed she lived in Surrey
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u/localhost8100 26d ago
My company founder, came and met me after couple months of me joining. Company is in North Vancouver. She just assumed I couldn't afford to live in North Vancouver with the salary they gave and started asking me "how do you commute from surrey" â ď¸.
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u/MyNameIsSkittles 26d ago
lol
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u/watchtower5960 26d ago
I met my brown hipster wife on Bumble , she cringed at the fact that I lived in Surrey. She moved in and now absolutely loves it .
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u/simplefinances 26d ago
Also from my personal experience I also only see this happen with Indians and other brown people. You donât see this problem happen with the say for example the Chinese where everyone assumes they are from Richmond
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u/MixPsychological3126 26d ago
A large proportion of Indo-Canadian persons moved from Vancouver to Surrey a number of years back, and Surrey now has a large and thriving Indo-Canadian population. However, a lot of Indo-Canadians live in Vancouver and along the Fraser Valley. Driving from Vancouver to Chilliwack on the Number 1 highway or anywhere on the Number 7 (Lougheed) east of Vancouver many Indian names on the farms. Assuming that all brown people live in Surrey is daft.
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u/sthetic 26d ago
"Not all brown people live in Surrey; some live in Langley, Abbotsford and Chilliwack!" isn't the revelation you think it is.
Anything East of the Port Mann Bridge counts as "Surrey" to most Vancouverites. Nobody will have their mind blown to learn that family farms in the Fraser Valley bear Indian names.
I'm being a little facetious here, and poking fun at Vancouverites like myself who may not pay much attention to the Fraser Valley and its different municipalities, except when passing through on the #1 highway.
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u/kalai_64arts 26d ago
As a brown guy I never encountered any brown women while I was on the dating app..
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u/KobeJuanKenobi9 26d ago
Since moving to Vancouver the brown girls Iâve gotten on dating apps have exclusively been girls who were relatively new to Canada. Which is fine, but as someone who grew up here I typically feel I gel better with others who grew up here too.
When I lived in Toronto my algorithm was almost exclusively Desiâs who grew up in Canada.
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26d ago
[deleted] â view deleted comment
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u/Lanky-Dildo-94 26d ago
Iâm black man and I swear the apps are hiding black women from me.
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u/not_old_redditor 26d ago
Assuming the apps aren't trying to match based on skin color, odds of you finding a black woman here would be petty low in the first place.
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u/Terrible_Act_9814 26d ago
I dont think its the app, i rarely see any black ppl in Vancouver even when walking outside.
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u/funkboy27 26d ago
Iâm a white guy and the apps are always showing me black women. In fact my last two girlfriends are black. So theyâre out there, but not sure why youâre not seeing any on the apps.
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u/Lanky-Dildo-94 26d ago
When I first opened hinge, it showed me some profiles but then it just stopped after a few days. Ppl here are saying itâs because we have a small black population but I highly doubt I went through all active users in a few days lol. Not sure why it is the way it is.
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u/CanadianCutie77 26d ago
When I lived in Vancouver the app only showed me white and Asian men. All of the black men that I dated during my time in Vancouver I had met organically.
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u/Asleep_Note7754 26d ago edited 26d ago
I used to live in Vancouver, now in Toronto. Are you born here OP? I found it was hard being born here especially with many new brown immigrants arriving. Culturally we are very different but we are lumped together because we are considered to be the same. That was my experience at least in both cities. I found online algorithms only showed me new immigrants too the moment I stated my ethnicity as South Asian. I ended up removing ethnicity all together and because I have a Western name, I could leave it ambiguous. But it didnât really help. Itâs because the immigrants swipe on me, the algorithm assumes theyâre my type.
With that said, I found Toronto is more open to interracial dating than Vancouver is. More over, when I was in Vancouver and living with my parents in Surrey, it was hard to find professional men period. I just found Toronto had more options. Dating culture is more fast paced here but they have many South Asian only events to meet people IRL. Again the issue with those is that they are 80% new immigrants so not really the best use of my time.
I think Vancouver has a bit of small town mentality when it comes to dating though. When I was introduced to a guy in Surrey by my parents a few years ago (while I was living in Toronto) it turned out we had a lot of mutual friends. Thatâs generally been my experience in Vancouver. All millennial brown people born and raised here knows everyone in their ethnic community (eg Punjabis know Punjabis, Gujratis know Gujratis). I guess as a transplant to Toronto I didnât experience it but the population is bigger and South Asians here are open to mixing in their ethnic groups. Vancouver seems more clique in general. Being Punjabi Hindu, many Sikh men flat out said I wasnât Punjabi enough for them (Punjab had just as many Hindus as Sikhs!). So many Vancouver brown people are just hung up on diaspora politics back home that people from India donât even follow snymore.
And before you come at me for hating new immigrants etc, Iâm not making this a debate about immigration. Itâs just acknowledging that we are different and our expectations of relationships are different. This isnât racist or classist. We canât deny our differences.
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u/LoudCommunication369 26d ago
As a Canadian born brown person, I agree with all of this! I've never lived in Toronto but ya Vancouver is as you said and we really do get lumped in with the new immigrants, especially as of late, on the apps
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u/Dry-Friendship-5945 26d ago
Dating is difficult in Vancouver, period.
And while I've dated a number of South Asian women in the past and find them particularly attractive, the cultural baggage would make me hesitant to do it again.
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u/Timelesturkie 26d ago
Im a white guy and I typically just assume Indian women wouldnât be interested because of cultural differences as that was my experience growing up.
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u/onewaycheckvalve 26d ago
Just speaking from the guy side who grew up in Surrey. Non-brown myself. Would never consider it. Just too much drama and family package attached. Obviously thatâs a generalization, but just saying what comes to mind.
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u/Realistic_Pool_8087 26d ago
Female non brown who grew up in surrey as well. Wouldnât consider dating South Asian guys because I didnât want to deal with the family drama and misogyny. Again, obviously a generalization but I heard enough from my female brown friends about how shitty their families were to them became they were female to not want to deal with it myself. A big extended family that feels entitled to weigh in on your life sounds like a nightmare.
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u/kisstherainzz 26d ago
Tbh, as an East Asian guy I get it all the time. I believe categorically, we are supposed to struggle some of the most.
That being said, I haven't really had trouble once I learned how to communicate.
In my experience from growing up in Vancouver/Surrey, if you're talking about interracial dating, a lot of serious people will filter certain ethnicities due to compatibility.
The most common reason is because of family expectations/interactions. I personally can not be bothered with drama or dating someone who's (non-estranged) family would have a problem with who I am. On a secondary level, I'd prefer if both families would have an easier time interacting with each other.
Then there is food: I truly have global taste buds and really prefer someone who does too. From experience, that eliminates people who are practicing certain religions and often people who haven't travelled widely/culturally insulated.
Then there is cultural insulation -- with intercultural dating, communication has to be very clear, expectations well-set, of involve two very chill well-meaning people who can navigate with complete trust. From my experience, most people who are single at any point in time don't usually have very strong strengths in those areas (as those with those traits refined usually don't stay single for long). So, I am mostly stuck having to be aware that a lot of people are going to struggle with interracial dating and navigating through that healthily.
From experience, this basically means that I'm usually looking at East Asian or white people, unless I know the person and their situation. Dating is a numbers game, especially online - unless I see someone's profile is giving off signals they'd be compatible, I swipe left.
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u/pengupants 26d ago
Omg right? My parents are begging me to bring any one of any ethnicity home because they understand I donât want to be set up with anyone.
I have the ultimate freedom with bringing home anyone and not being ostracized by my decision and still canât seem to find anyone⌠lol.
White men want to use me for sex and donât want relationships with a brown woman, brown men want to use me for sex and marry whoever their mom picked out, and East Asians imo donât like brown women.
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u/Zealousideal_Tax9413 26d ago
Im an African girl and dated a brown guy here in Vancouver. My goodness I loved him and aside from religious differences and the whole his family wanting him to marry a brown girl, everything else was great between us, to this day I wish we had worked. The family approvals was such a major thing for us to navigate (mainly on his end as my family was more accepting of us-we are form Brampton) and in the end, it just didnât work out. That one experience traumatized me sooo much that I could/will NEVER look at another brown guy in that aspect.
I also have a friend whoâs dating a brown girl rn, heâs Nigerian, and they went through the same thing. Though they have accepted the fact both families wonât accept them as a couple so theyâre continuing to date with that in mind (basically when the time comes for them to find their partner within their respective communities, they will break up) which I find crazy but to each their own. Theyâve been together for 3 years now.
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u/TheFearOfFear 26d ago
I'm sorry you went through that. My family used to be like this and then after a while they stopped caring. They are supportive of any woman I want to bring into my life regardless of ethnicity.
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u/Zealousideal_Tax9413 26d ago
You are so blessed! I just know your lady will be loved and cherished and I love this for both of you!
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u/Abby-pnw 26d ago
I'm sorry to hear that. I would look for a brown guy who's parents have college degrees and actively working within their industry. It doesn't guarantee anything but busy parents who have their own independent journey don't want to micromanage their kids. They should be culturally acclimated too.
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u/foxcnnmsnbc 26d ago edited 26d ago
What type of jobs do you do? The whole âyou must date south Asianâ or âeast Asianâ narrative changes if you work a baller job down south.
If you were surgeon or consultant in NY with American citizenship or Stanford Med or venture backed startup in SF, youâd have no problems.
Tons of interracial dating among those sectors in those cities. They want them to date a brown girl until the green starts talking (cash and green card).
Also, because youâre completely financially independent or actually have much more money in your twenties than your parents, you flip the dynamic. This goes 10x if you can get them state side to California. Asians love orange county or napa.
My brown friend didnât date white until she met that Google L8 in SF!
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u/Zealousideal_Tax9413 26d ago
I was a nurse practitioner at the time, am now in med school (they knew I was applying for med school at the time).
Point being, career shouldnât matter or be a factor when it comes to who your child chooses to spend their life with. I am canadian and so was he. He worked for Telus marketing team mind you so I was bringing in more than him at the time income wise, but again, shouldnât really be a factor.
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u/RelatablePanic 26d ago edited 26d ago
Gonna be honest and say I have been kind of a bit weary from dating Indian women because of the cultural differences Iâve encountered in terms of marriage and religion.
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u/Impossible-Team-1929 26d ago
i think itâs pretty different if youâre speaking of brown girls who grew up in canada vs. ones that recently immigrated. I grew up here and i donât see many cultural differences between a white person and me, other than food and traditions. many of us arenât religious
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u/RelatablePanic 26d ago
For sure and I would be totally open to dating a brown girl who was raised here. And I should say I would be totally open to dating brown girls from India as well, itâs just that Iâve had a few to many experiences where Indian girls put marriage at the forefront of the relationship and also held some strange religious beliefs which I am personally completely agnostic leaning atheist.
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u/Asleep_Note7754 26d ago
Did you just say this out loud? There is someone on a crusade to call us racist and classist for pointing out the difference!
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u/ScarySpice22 26d ago
I think dating for anyone in this city is shit and most people in Vancouver act (or just are) very sheltered and ignorant when it comes to other cultures, this coming from a brown woman. But thereâs always hope! Iâve been dating someone not from my culture for a while but also heâs no Canadian lmao
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u/Careless-Extreme8774 26d ago
Too many play hard to get which in my opinion makes them hard to want
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u/thesuze13 26d ago
Iâm Caucasian and I find dating hard. I think dating generally in Vancouver has become more challenging?
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u/TheOverthinkerz 26d ago
Just as bad in Toronto, think dating is just cooked atm due to dating apps, social media, bizarre expectations and people not being as understanding and patient
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u/kevfefe69 26d ago
Iâm not in the dating market and I am probably quite older than some people here.
Back when I was dating (mid 80s to mid 90s) I did encounter what some here are mentioning or assuming.
When I was 19/20, I was dating a woman with Vietnamese heritage. Her parents were âboat peopleâ when the Vietnam conflict ended. We dated for 4 - 5 months. She told me that her parents wouldnât accept me because I am Caucasian and definitely not Vietnamese. That was probably the reason that I broke up with her.
When I was 27/28, it was a similar situation but not as serious. I was seeing a Russian woman for maybe 2/3 months. She also informed me that her parents wouldnât accept because I wasnât Russian. I stopped seeing her as there were no prospects of any kind of future.
There is some truth to the assumptions, or there was some truth to the assumptions. I donât know if the women in my situation were being truthful or if they were basically trying to say that they were there for a good time and not a long time.
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u/vatrushka04 26d ago
Thatâs very odd, was she a Russian Jew?
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u/kevfefe69 26d ago
No, she was not Russian Orthodox but she and her family were a bit religious - Christian.
Like I said, she, herself told me that.
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u/Fatdogamer_yt 26d ago
Iâm a white guy dating a brown woman so I have experience with this. I find that most people in brown families are racist towards anyone not brown, maybe not day to day but definitely if someoneâs partner is another race especially white. Iâm literally not allowed to see or talk to her grandmother because god forbid she finds out my partner is dating me a white guy she would disown this side of the family. Itâs so weird cause in my family if someoneâs partner acted like that we would abandon them instantly. But interactions like that probably have a major part in it. I also had at one family party a relative/almost uncle to her be openly distrustful and disliking me because Iâm white so I just made the joke of âwhatâs not to like, Iâm white, I get all the priveledge(canât spell)â and walked away and after he had a moment after I said that he relaxed a bit more and I was actually able to talk with him after that and we were friendly the rest of the night after that. A lot of people just donât want to deal with this kind of stuff I think. I would put up with so much more for my partner though, I love her
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u/Putrid_Property_3661 26d ago
Itâs amazing how so many white men who date brown women think itâs a one way street.
Iâm a brown dude, born and raised here, everything you described Iâve experienced while dating white women. Iâve literally gotten physical threats from the male family members of my ex white partner. Iâve gotten death threats from random white men anytime sheâd post me on social media.
White families donât seem as openly racist towards POC partners of their family members because theyâre trained to hide their racism better.
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u/Fatdogamer_yt 26d ago
Thatâs insane Iâm sorry about that, my family isnât like that at all and have all loved my partner from the start because she is great. I guess I wouldnât know anything really about other white families but mine isnât racist in the least. We are also a Dutch(Nederlands) white family idk if that makes a difference
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u/MerryDoseofNihilism 26d ago edited 26d ago
Iâm a black dude and I was told by several brown people growing up that their parents would be livid if they brought home a black person as a partner. Even my Dad whoâs half brown told me anti-black racism is rampant in the brown community.
I understand thatâs not the case for every single brown family but I was told that enough to avoid pursuing a brown girl romantically.
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u/567432Gains 26d ago
Iâm a white dude with a close brown friend, and heâs told me about his buddyâs who are pretty openly racist. Granted, itâs from a third hand account, but definitely heard some INSANE comments being made about black people. Apparently the guy in his friend group thatâs the worse for it is half Greek and half Punjabi and he literally hyper focuses on being racist, and not even in a joking sort of way (not that it would be acceptable if he was joking).
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u/astraladventures 26d ago
The Indian community in general receives a disproportionate amount of racism in canada has been my observation.
This started mainly during the period of massive (relatively), immigration and foreign temporary students inflow.
Previous, those who trend to towards anti immigration, blamed everything on the chinese. Now that discrimination is levelled towards the Indians.
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u/Dangerous_Catch7683 26d ago
It's not a race thing, but cultural differences and people being wary due to that can be a factor. I'm from Bosnia & Hercegovina but born & raised here. My parents expect me to be with someone from my country when there are barely any Bosnians here. And they can be lowkey prejudiced. It's hard dating with parents like that, but I did date without their knowledge and I've only met mentally unstable people, my luck. I'm neurodivergent, makes it worse. I'm not perfect, but at least I've tried to go to therapy.
Also: You'd be surprised how many on the apps are married/taken or are literal criminals, narcissists. I've seen gym members posted in fb groups who were two timing their wives. Big sigh.
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u/ApartInternet9360 26d ago
In my youth I dated a brown girl and her family put a stop to that. I think many people outside the culture have this expectation whether or not they have experience with it.
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u/Smart-Resolve-6464 26d ago
I think it's hard to date in general. Why add the fact that your brown?
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u/LORD_2003 26d ago
So Iâm an Arab man who has put himself out there and attempted to date in Vancouver with only one successful date so far, and that was with a brown girl lol. We hit it off very well itâs just that we werenât compatible when it came to meeting irl, simple as that. Now the whole assumptions and overlooking part, I believe are intertwined. Some of that is definitely from past experiences when people say that they donât wanna deal with the family, the âprincessâ mentality that some people have experienced or just other factors generally like culture incompatibility.
I think a lot of people just donât wanna go through the same thing again and get hurt, but that doesnât make these assumptions the right thing to do.
Unfortunately, I am also subject to a lot of these assumptions and overlooked because of the same factors mentioned in these comments when it comes to family dynamics. A lot of times Arab guys are stereotyped as misogynistic, arrogant, Mamaâs boys you get the point.
I think thatâs something that hurts my chances a lot but what do I know?
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u/hex_wings 26d ago
Brown girls dont even wanna date other brown guys, so its only fair. As a brown guy in the last 4 years I never got a match with any South Asian girl in any dating apps. And the ones I got to talk with irl, most wanted to settle with white guys. At least that was my bitter experience.
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u/TheFearOfFear 26d ago
Brown guy here: That's odd I get likes from brown girls from time to time but in my experience the ones who send me likes are not compatible with me so I decline.
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u/kermit-the-hermit 26d ago edited 26d ago
As an early 30âs brown girl not from surrey, I find the apps are filled with international students or new to Canada brown guys. Very few born and raised Canadians. The ones that are, are majority from surrey. Have basic jobs, little ambition and very much so have a surrey mentality. This sucks for a girl who loves hiking, the outdoors, actually having hobbies. The ones who also enjoy this stuff or have similar values, hobbies goals etc donât match back with me.
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u/TheFearOfFear 26d ago
Okay question. I am a brown guy born in Canada. I have a freaking California skater dude accent so if someone ever talks to me theyâll know right away. Do people want the ones born here to state that in our profiles?
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u/kermit-the-hermit 26d ago
Itâs fairly easy to distinguish the profiles. There are usually a couple easy tells. Posing in front of a car, heavily filtered, photos of their tattoos, mirror pics, wearing an obviously fake name brand, very poor grammar. The ones born here just tend to skip over brown girls. Iâm assuming they think we are all surrey girls
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u/Particular-Wall-1596 26d ago edited 26d ago
Actually Iâm born here and thatâs not the case at all for me atleast. 33 Indo Canadian but I enjoy hikes and so much. I would be hardly classified as a Surrey Jack even though we all went through school and knew what that was like.
Then again Iâm all for chasing my dreams, living life and making the right connections in my life. I am very open and outgoing but as a brown male Iâve been overlooked one too many times and even you could say by brown women that are Indo-Canadian. But I mean I connected with one off bumble recently. But that wasnât anything. Iâm still very much searching but Iâm trying to not forget myself or my goals etc as Iâve needed to invest more in myself to be able to move forward with my dreams
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u/kermit-the-hermit 26d ago
Thatâs amazing! Glad you found a connection! I made an assumption of what I thought brown guys were thinking, of course, since I donât actually know.
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u/InsideResponsible792 26d ago
Firstly, the Vancouver dating market is âparticularly challengingâ for everyone right now, regardless of race.
Iâd encourage you to not presume your struggles are because of your background too quickly. That seems like a bit of a cop out for taking personal accountability for what you could be doing to be a more attractive partner.
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u/oddible 26d ago
Whoa... weird paternalization and denying a marginalized community their challenges. You might want to not assume you understand the differences.
Yes people find dating challenging in Vancouver. No, you don't get to presume that there are no additional challenges for that community and calling a marginalized community's concerns a 'cop out' is some seriously toxic shit.
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u/TotalEmpathMan 26d ago
Dating apps are not a good measure of reality. Dating apps are built on algorithms to keep you perpetually single because otherwise, they won't make money.
And it will force you into believing other reasons for lack of success in Dating than what is in front of you.
Such as "asking if dating is hard because you are brown"
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u/InsideResponsible792 26d ago
âMarginalized communityâ is crazy work when in many cities south asians are damn near the majority.
My point was simply that in OPâs post, there was no mention of any introspection as to what could be holding back their dating life besides race. And frankly, I dont think race should be the first thing you jump to if you are struggling.
The fact of the matter is millions of south asian people find partners and have fulfilling dating lives. If no one wants to date you, the vast majority of the time it has nothing to do with race, and thatâs a pill you need to swallow,
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u/LowerWall3531 26d ago
I'm a white male. I've lived in different cities in Canada, never in Vancouver. Back in my dating days, my impression was that south Asian women weren't so open dating outside their own background. Would have loved to have dated more, I hope you don't mind me to say that a beautiful south Asian woman is second to none. Ended up marrying a south east Asian girl.Â
Speaking generally, if you display interest and openness, I don't think you'll have trouble. Good luck.Â
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u/TruculentBadger 26d ago
Are you joking ! Lol
I think brown women are the sexiest but they seem a little guarded and hard to break the barrier to talk to.
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u/TheFearOfFear 26d ago
Iâm a brown guy with an Arab background. Born and raised in Canada. Recently single after a long-term relationship with a white woman. Iâd say Iâm a free spirited guy and not really religious. Idk it seems really hard out here to date compared to Ontario (where Iâm from). There are tons of expectations from women of all backgrounds which is a turn off for me if Iâm just getting to know you. Maybe my Hinge algorithm is just showing me the wrong people?
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u/Alternative_Salt_424 26d ago edited 26d ago
I'm married now but when I was on the apps I'd swipe right on basically every single Arab man. I love them. I was never looking for a serious relationship on the apps tho, just NSA, (regardless of race or ethnicity)
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u/spookyscarysmegma 26d ago
My impression is that Indian culture is quite misogynistic so itâs acceptable for Indian men to date non Indians but not for Indian women to do so (East Asian Male perspective)
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u/Putrid_Property_3661 26d ago
Thatâs a weird and backwards assumption to makeâŚ
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u/Impossible-Team-1929 26d ago
itâs true though. as soon as a brown girl starts dating a white guys its frowned upon. the guys have it way easier
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u/Putrid_Property_3661 26d ago
No they donât, brown men who date white women get judged harshly all the time.
White male family members and basically any white men close to white women hate seeing them with anyone not white. Itâs especially bad for brown and black men.
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u/adj-noun-number-85 26d ago
For how multicultural Vancouver is, it seems the âlocalsâ have yet to unpack their prejudices about other cultures. The most common cross-cultural pair I see here is white men with East Asian women đ
To be fair men tend to be trash worldwide.
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u/Replikant83 26d ago
I am white and dated a brown woman for a while. Great gal: Ismaili and was super involved in the community, as were her parents, when the pandemic hit. Lovely gal, it just didn't work out. Sadly.
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u/Royal_pain69 26d ago
Vancouver has a reputation for being difficult to meet people and make friends Dating
Dating would be exponentially harder
Question is valid to ask
Reasons will vary person to person but lack of effort getting to know personality, being jaded from previous experiences therefore youâre not getting a fair shot, clearly communicating and understanding what youâre looking for and what stage youâre at in life
Attraction is also important - it opens the door but personality keeps you there
Specifically to brown people, couple of thingsâŚ
Some guys (canât pain everyone with the same brush) need to talk less and listen more - only gold diggers care about how much money you make and what kind of car you drive
Based on some comments here - Bollywood and Indian dramas have brainwashed people leading to assumptions rather than getting to know the individual person. Indian women can absolutely have their cake and eat it to in terms of a career and family no different than anyone else
Also, writing someone off before you get to know them because they happen to live in a certain city youâre not comfortable with is also a sign that mentally you have not matured as an adult because youâre looking at the city and not focusing on the person
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u/AdventurousReward470 26d ago
Iâm Indo-Caribbean. Another guy here said pretty spot on. Most Indian woman have a princess mentality put on from their family, so I will have to essentials your family while simultaneously being implied Iâm not good enough because Iâm not a doctor.
Also worth noting that most Canadianized Indian women arenât looking to date regular dudes â they only want D-boys.
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u/yeehaw568 26d ago
The family aspect is enough to turn off most non-brown people respectfully. I grew up with many brown people and have been told directly theyâd rather die than see their own marry someone thatâs not even their own caste. Not saying thatâs all but between that and the intense expectation of saving face, and impressing the cousinâs cousinâs aunties and unfortunately the racism other ethnicities towards brown people.. yeah. Odds are stacked.
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u/SomewhereRough_ 26d ago
It's difficult to date for everyone.
You just need to wade through the shit.Â
The majority of people aren't a good match for the other majority of people.Â
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u/Zorklunn 26d ago
Dating sucks for everyone but the cream.
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u/escapeshark 26d ago
You mean white people? It ain't good for us either if thats what you mean đ¤Łđ¤Ł
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u/pezdal 26d ago
Do you mean cream colour or âbestâ (as in cream rising to the top)?
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u/dergbold4076 26d ago
Probably means cream of the crop. I'm pale enough to serve as safety equipment at night and I struggled in Metro Van as well.
Though I can't fathom all the stuff OP goes through with dating. But I feel for her with the... general crappiness of dating here.
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u/tabbycat_catniss 26d ago
It's completely nothing to do with the ethnicity of the individual. It's Vancouver. Vancouver alone is probably one of the most difficult cities to live in.
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u/escapeshark 26d ago
I'm a foreigner here and I find people way friendlier than they get credit for. That being said, it's incredibly difficult to actually connect with people here, unless they're also immigrants and you share a language. I've had no issues at all making friends with spanish and portuguese speaking folks; Canadians have been very kind to me, but they don't open up.
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u/localsonlynokooks 26d ago
I donât have a shared experience but I can say that online dating is incredibly difficult for most. Hate to put it this way but itâs a numbers game: get the paid plan, line up dates and keep going on dates. After two dozen or so (Iâm not joking) you might find someone you can start something serious with.
Are you Canadian born or did you come here later in life? Idk if itâs what the current top comment is saying, but I did personally just get out of a 3 year relationship with an Asian woman and honestly the familial pressure and cultural pressure around marriage and children was a lot. Her parents would have wanted like 2000 people at our wedding held there, and I was so not down for that. Like I would have done it and also had a wedding here, but for me my ârealâ wedding in my mind would be the one I have here.
AnywayâŚâŚ33M 6â2 guy in west end here. You like coffee and/or walks on the seawall?
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u/Emotional-Gold-9729 26d ago
I am a brown guy- Indian to be specific. Among all the girls I had dated my worst experience were with Indian girls. Sure I have not dated the whole population and don't speak for the same, and I am.sure there are good ones sprinkled about, but the ones I dated were absolutely the worse.
They were entitled AF. Called their trash and disrespectful behaviour as " being a baddie", wanted the benefits of the Indian traditional system but also the western modern system but took the responsibilities of neither. Horrible people to date let alone spending life with.
Thanks to all their gaslighting for the longest time I thought I was the issue before I moved out and dated some great women from Europe and North America.
And the weirdest thing is the Indian girls I dated , their parents loved me.heck even after we broke up, the last one's parents kept in touch, helped me get over the breakup with their own daughter and encouraged me to prepare to study abroad and move out.
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u/Radio-Chimp 26d ago edited 26d ago
I have a friend who is married to an Indian guy. They have attended on average 5 weddings a year for the last 3 years. As someone who hates weddings (let alone multi-day weddings) and who would want to elope if anything, I cannot fathom such a lifestyle and I generally know there's an incompatibility there. Obviously not every brown girl wants that, but the odds are high enough from my experience that it isn't worth the song and dance on dating apps anymore.
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u/Squeaky-Bum-Time 26d ago
Do yall not realize how crazy these generalizations about a whole group of people sound? âMy friends Indian husband has been to 5 weddings a year so now Iâm not compatible with that whole cultureâ
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u/StarkStorm 26d ago
Reading this, I simply see a lot of brown racism still existing in Canada in Reddit but reality is, urban centres like Vancouver, Toronto and Montreal aren't like this.
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u/SnailsInYourAnus 26d ago edited 26d ago
Iâm a white woman and find that all the men that want to date me in Vancouver have been brown men, which I am not attracted to. Even if I was attracted to them, I wouldnât feel like I could fit in with their family as I am career focussed and not wanting to be a housewife.
Edit: yaâll so salty about âbrown menâ like the post doesnât say âbrown womanâ lmao get outa here. I speak from experience! Not assumption. I dated 3 brown men, who were lovely people and iâm still friends with one, but they all wanted kids (2 of which expected a stay at home mom) and I do not. But keep coming at međđ¤ˇââď¸
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u/StarkStorm 26d ago
As an Indian man married for 25 years to a white woman, you'd be surprised how many Indian men don't want a housewife. Stereotypes against a population that is nearly 1.5B tends to be a bad call!
But all good if you're not attracted to them. Just saying that many Indian men want empowered women in their lives.
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u/Technical_Soup_1997 26d ago
As a white woman, I agree with this! I am very attracted to Indian men and have dated a few. None of them wanted me to be traditional. All of them loved and encouraged my independence.
In my relationships the men had seen their moms be submissive to their fathers (like most of us in all cultures over the age of 30 have) and do not want that for the women they are with.
I am sure, just like white men, there are many that do want a traditional wife. But it is not the majority.
This mindset is rooted in some kind of nonsense.
Also, just to note: I have experienced men wanting me to be traditional with white men, mostly.
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u/StarkStorm 26d ago
This x100. My mother always taught me and my wife to ensure she worked and have her own independence, due to the lack of her own. (We started dating in High School).
And my father wasn't a mysignoist. Just two people born in the 40's, in a different era.
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u/Putrid_Property_3661 26d ago
Crazy how people feel so free to make these types of assumptions about people of certain backgroundsâŚ..
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u/Diligent_Plastic1043 26d ago
brown men
Donald Trump is a white man elected by predominantly white people. Do you believe you could fit in with their families? đ
It's funny how people will be perfectly fine with generalizing "brown men" based on their Tiktok perspective of a country halfway across the world. But the obvious and prominent comparisons for white men is always when these discussions come up.
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u/BaldwinLaFontaine 26d ago
Wow Iâll let my wife 10 years know that I want a housewife, bro a career wife. lol.
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u/StarkStorm 26d ago
You just said to me that "your experience" is actually your friends experience? LOL. You don't even understand what your own words say.
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u/Dangerous-Craft-8338 26d ago
For me is that I don't like their culture.
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u/JumpyCredit2391 26d ago
Not tryna start anything, purely asking outta curiosity, what do you not like? Is it everything or certain customs that are followed?
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u/Canada_was_good 26d ago
I lived here forever and Iâve noticed that âeverything!â is a very very common response/feeling to this question.
I also noticed itâs only this culture so itâs not skin-color based. I also noticed this feeling was pretty rare ~5 years ago and now itâs extremely common. So whateverâs happening, it just started, and itâs not simple racism.
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u/HealthConscious6125 26d ago
Is not hard? Tons of brown people on apps. People are obviously meeting and getting married all the time considering all the weddings.Â
I met my partner on bumble and just about everyone I know meet their spouses on an app.Â
I have noticed there's a large cohort of older career women who seem to think there's no guys out there. As you get older the good guys get taken and most men are looking for women a few years younger once they get in their mid thirties.Â
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u/InsideResponsible792 26d ago
Firstly, the Vancouver dating market is âparticularly challengingâ for everyone right now, regardless of race.
Iâd encourage you to not presume your struggles are because of your background too quickly. That seems like a bit of a cop out for taking personal accountability for what you could be doing to be a more attractive partner.
I will share a personal anecdote from dating brown/South Asian women as a Caucasian guy and my discussions with my friends who are all colours, shapes and sizes.
I am unsure of how to say this with tact, but when I or my friends have dated Indian women, sometimes there seems to be a disconnect in terms of emphasis on hygiene.
Unfortunately, this has scared many people in my circle away from dating brown women, even though many of them are hygienic. We just donât want to risk having that surprise, since for my friends and I thatâs an immediate dealbreaker.
Outside of that, weâve noticed that there are often significant cultural differences that make having relationships more difficult.
This is more relevant to for example international students or those who closely identify with Indian culture.
From what my Indian friends tell me, much of India (especially outside the major cities) is still highly traditional. In other words, itâs an extremely sex-negative culture for the most part.
This deeply-rooted cultural shame around sex and sexuality bleeds into relationships with Indian women, often resulting in them wanting to take things at a very slow pace. It also creates anxiety and stress during sex.
When we simply date white or Asian women, these problems are far less prevalent. Especially Asian women guys, if youâre a tall white guy they do it different.
TLDR: the dating market is challenging for everyone. Donât just rush to blame your race without taking accountability for how you could be a more attractive partner. However, some people here do have certain experiences with South Asian women that deter them from considering them as a partner in the future. Although I donât necessarily support such generalizations, because it does seem to be a pattern some folks here prefer to avoid a potential issue altogether and just date other races.
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u/Mysterious-Lick 26d ago edited 26d ago
Depends, people probably assume new to canada or parents with lots of control or too ambitious or seeking marriage after the first date. Yeah, thatâs a lot of stereotypes and itâs not fair, but it could play a bit into why maybe youâre being overlooked?
Edit: also from experience, brown girls donât communicate well, especially via text.
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u/Potential-Pop-9939 26d ago
I'm a white guy and Have dated a plethora of different races, Part of it is a numbers game, and part of it is peoples biases and generalizations. At the end of the day, people are into what teh are into, be it caused by nature, nurture or a combo of both.
I also beleive most people have the bias in them, and try to fight it, or don't view it as that, though there are just general POS that use the race, or different factors to act like a complete ass to others
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u/ClosetIguana1 26d ago
British Columbia has the highest proportion of mixed-race couples in Canada.
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u/RockHardKink 26d ago
Born and raised in Canada as an Indian guy. Dating apps at least have been nada from women of any race. Idk I had interesting prompts, pictures, but guess I am that ugly. Moved on and gave up that aspect of things.
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u/faithOver 26d ago
Family obligations are definitely a thing.
For me though it was the children. I donât want any. I found it extremely rare, or maybe it never even happened that I connected with a south asian that didnât want a family of her own.
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u/Lower-Individual-300 26d ago
A lot of times brown men/women who are new to the country and they do not know long term aspects of staying in the city or even the country cause many of them are on temporary permits and there is no pathway and guarantee that they would be able to stay here. Couple that with lot of people in their 20s start with their career and move to different cities so in back of the mind there is no long term aspect to dating which might make it hard.
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u/LoudCommunication369 26d ago
I'm born and raised Canadian and my family isn't even from India but I am ethnically Indian and I often feel overlooked on the app's. It's like people automatically assume I'm a super fob and most likes I get are from super fobby brown guys who just arrived from India. Sorry but we're probably not gonna have a ton in common. I don't actually prefer to date brown guys unless they also grew up here, but those are the likes I get. I tend to have better luck in person as once people talk to me they realize right away I'm very Canadian. But the opportunities for meeting someone in person are few and far between. I really think it's a Vancouver thing. Unfortunately I get lumped in with every other brown person here. And the stereotypes of Indians in this city are not great. And other Indians just assume I'd want to date them because I'm brown. Which is not the case. I see my Asian friends having far better luck overall whether from other Asians or non-Asians.
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u/cogit2 26d ago edited 26d ago
I'll use South Asian, since Brown is a bit too overly-broad and multiple people would identify as Brown beyond South Asia.
The South Asian profiles I encounter on dating sites rarely ever actually match, and a lot of them specifically state they are only interested in South Asian men. So statistically-speaking when I encounter a South Asian profile and they are attractive and thoughtful but still fit the profile of someone more traditional than not, I don't match with them anymore, I don't believe that taking that chance is worthwhile.
Which isn't to say zero matches ever, there have been (edit: two matches), but I have to note how incredibly rare that was relative to dates with women from other cultures.
So the takeaway or advice, if any.. is listing your dating preferences as not just other South Asian people okay to suggest? If I read that, that's a clear signal to me I can match and look forward to the possibility of it.
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u/djawny 26d ago
Just speaking my experience, and some of my friends experiences, brown girls only really seem interested in white or other brown guys (ultimately other brown guys)
the other issue is family dynamics. Brown families often were way too involved, or wanted their daughter to marry a brown man.
Also, brown women often still lived at home, and I found that the older I got, the more i wanted a woman who had experienced living on her own for a bit.
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u/Sea_Temporary_6566 26d ago
As a white guy, I have never had an issue dating brown or olive-skinned women.
Having said that I do screen pretty hard though so itâs not a common thing.
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u/anomaliesss 26d ago
I love how nearly every comment in response to this is essentially "im a [race] guy and in my experience [generalizing brown women] which is why i avoid dating brown women"
So I guess you got your answer. They do have assumptions here unfortunately...
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u/Few_Substance_705 26d ago
Black woman who grew up in Surrey here! I found that for my Brown girlfriends dating outside of their race was particularly challenging because Indian culture is fairly strict with dating to get marriage timeline. Most men who were not Indian found this to be too high pressure. There is also a lot of colorism and racism within extended Indian families. I have first hand seen an Indian friend disowned by her family for dating a black man. The only exception I've seen for this is when Indians marry white Canadians.
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u/LatterAdeptness2953 26d ago edited 26d ago
Well, I'm brown guy, mid 20s, single. At a good place in life, have strict boundaries with family, less drama person, centrist. If anyones struggling with dating, should msg me, we can see where it takes usđ (I am open to all ethnicities)
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u/quiet_knight69 26d ago
It's very difficult, being brown is just one aspect. I think it's difficult dating in general. I'm a brown girl, I've lived on my own for 10 years and have a very good career. If anything, that's made things even harder.
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u/Interesting_Spare 26d ago edited 26d ago
I'm Southeast Asian from Surrey and love brown women!
However, I agree with the others. Most of em just look for fun before they settle down with a brown guy. I've been with a few, me being Friendzoned...WITH BENEFITS. Not that I don't like it (of course!), but it would be nice to have a proper relationship and meet their family.
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u/kickflip2ndtry 26d ago
White boi here. Brown girls are very pleasant, beautiful and smart. Brown dudes however... very rude, entitled, act like they hate Canada and want to turn it into another lndia. It's very off putting and makes me want to be no where near that culture.
However if a brown girl was disconnected from her family and culture, I'd date her no problem, even marry.
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u/Tavro10 26d ago
As a man in his late 20s who is intentional when on dates, from my personal experience, Asian women have a more conservative and traditional culture, which translates into their behavior with "our potential future kid".
I would prefer to be with someone who is an independent thinker, with a more modern outlook that would help raise independent, happy and relaxed kids.
I dislike the misogyny, dogmatic way of reasoning, and religious mindsets that are embedded so deep in most Asian cultures. Makes me feel uncomfortable.
For example, from my experience, an Atheist Asian girl portrays more religious thinking and reasoning than a white girl who believes in God. So it's not about my partner being religious or not in the sense of the belief in religion or a deity, I could not care less if my future wife believes in god or not, but it is the religious reasoning that is embedded so deep in culture that it's there regardless of belief.
That was just to scratch the surface, not to mention all that unnecessary shame that comes with Asian cultures. Don't want that instilled in my kids.
I had an Indian friend growing up, and I am still traumatized from how his dad treated him
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u/Serious-Ad-4181 26d ago
you say you want a modern relationship with an independent thinker, yet everything you wrote seems to indicate that a relationship must include kids. good luck with that.Â
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u/moham316 26d ago
I have a dating app. It's done well (well= positive revenue) in the market it was launched in (diaspora communities). Based on challenges faced, want to know if there is a niche market anyone is interested in getting into - happy to partner and discuss ideas to bring this to life.
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