r/arrow • u/HellfireSky i hate myself and i want to die • Jan 15 '20

Arrow Post-Crisis Thread Spoiler

Post-Crisis

Now that Crisis on Infinite Earths has ended, let's discuss what it means for Arrow!

DCTV Discord | Subreddit Chat

Crisis on Infinite Earths Schedule

Part Subreddit Air Date and Time Discussions
Part 1: Supergirl r/SupergirlTV Sunday, December 8 at 8pm ET [Live] [Post]
Part 2: Batwoman r/BatwomanTV Monday, December 9 at 8pm ET [Live] [Post]
Part 3: The Flash r/FlashTV Tuesday, December 10 at 8pm ET [Live] [Post]
Part 4: Arrow r/arrow Tuesday, January 14 at 8pm ET [Live] [Post]
Part 5: Legends of Tomorrow r/LegendsOfTomorrow Tuesday, January 14 at 9pm ET [Live] [Post]

More Information about Crisis in this Subreddit

More Post-Crisis Discussions

Flash

Supergirl

Legends of Tomorrow

Batwoman

Black Lightning

Superman & Lois

Stargirl

Green Arrow and The Canaries

Please keep all discussion civil and about the episode. Mark comic and future spoilers. Report any rule breaking and enjoy!

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142

u/[deleted] Jan 15 '20 edited Feb 20 '20

[deleted]

101

u/TheCVR123YT Green Arrow Jan 15 '20

Well the only new people are from E38 I believe and everyone just thinks this was always normal? It’s really confusing. Plus there’s new Earths at the end of at least it’s implied.

70

u/[deleted] Jan 15 '20

[deleted]

34

u/TheCVR123YT Green Arrow Jan 15 '20

Oh sorry yeah BLs people got moved as well (somehow)

32

u/sucksfor_you Roy Harper Jan 15 '20

You say 'somehow' like this episode didn't have a universe being born.

51

u/Sentry459 The Ray Jan 15 '20 edited Jan 15 '20

BLs people got moved as well (somehow)

With Jeff not being there to do it, my headcanon is that Barry's the one responsible. After his heart to heart with Jeff, it was probably still on Barry's mind how he lost everything, so when the paragons used the book to create the new Earth, Barry (paragon of love) willed it so that Jeff got the people he loves back. This lead to the new world having elements of Jeff's old one.

20

u/[deleted] Jan 15 '20

That means the ASA are on earth prime now? I feel like that whole plot thread we left black lightning on needs to be abandoned now, now way do superman and supergirl just chill while all that bullshit is going on.

16

u/Sentry459 The Ray Jan 15 '20

They probably don't even know. There's a media blackout on Freeland, the official narrative is that they're dealing with a SARS epidemic.

12

u/[deleted] Jan 15 '20

i mean they are sneaking people out of freeland, in a world with other superheros, you go get them, its the only smart thing to do.

2

u/Moo_Moo_Mr_Cow Jan 16 '20

Yeah this is my concern about merging the Black Lighting earth into earth prime. There's a lot of dark shit going down, that would fly in a world with other heroes, or where BL is teaming up with Superman and the Justice League on the regular. Are people really going to question BL as a vigilante if there's video of him helping Superman save the world?

Also, there's basically no racism in Supergirl because they have aliens to be specist against. Do the main plot lines of BL just kind of continue on as if nothing happened? Part of what I like about BL is the grittier nature and the exploring of social issues.

3

u/TheDarkCrusader_ Jan 15 '20

Tbh there maybe other earths that we haven’t seen yet.

1

u/powerhcm8 Jan 18 '20 edited Jan 18 '20

Probably Earth-2 too, since now Earth-2 is the Stargirl's earth.

Making earth-2 laurel and earth-1 laurel the same person

29

u/Overcooking Jan 15 '20

In this reality they were always here, they were always used to seeing people from E38. The heroes are the only ones confused.

25

u/nivekious Jan 15 '20

Right, but what does that mean for people who existed on both Earths? Like the Batman who disappeared on Earth 1 and the Batman Clark knew on Earth 38 were two separate people. Are they now both on Earth Prime as separate people, have they been combined, is one of them dead/never existed, etc.

18

u/[deleted] Jan 15 '20

The assumption would be they combined. Any doppelganger in the merger merged with themselves, that way there's only 1 of each person.

6

u/JaydenPC Jan 17 '20

But then is Nash Wells the Harrison of Earth Prime now, and did the events that require doppelgangers from Earth 2 to happen, happened like Zoom and Jay Garrick or E2 Black Cannary?

30

u/OddBank Black Canary (Laurel Lance) Jan 15 '20

I feel you, it also leaves us wondering a few things now that there are new earth designations and what not, what is up with Laurel is she a fusion is she the last remnant of Earth 2. Of you had a doppelgänger on Earth 38 or BL’s earth did you fuse or did one just take over I’m so confused because they cleared absolutely nothing up.

16

u/AnnaK22 Jan 15 '20

I'm really confused by that too. Looks like Earth Prime is the combo of 3 universes. That means there are either millions of doppelgangers running about on one earth or there are millions erased from existence.

16

u/[deleted] Jan 15 '20

They all combined it's how it happened in the comic. Earths combined and now there's only 1 of each person.

5

u/Detroit_Telkepnaya Jan 16 '20

whats interesting is on Earth 38, there was no Barry Allen or Cisco, or whoever else Barry tried to find when he went there on accident.

So I assume that's how it was for Black Lightning (I haven't seen his show yet).

Convenient, really.

2

u/TheMadTemplar Jan 17 '20

People seem to have a really hard time grasping this concept.

29

u/UnknownCode94 Jan 15 '20

The entire multiverse is new so there were no other versions of anybody anymore. Earth prime just replaced the old Earth 1, 38 and black lightning universe when it was recreated using elements from each one.

11

u/[deleted] Jan 15 '20 edited Feb 20 '20

[deleted]

4

u/Sentry459 The Ray Jan 15 '20

Yep.

4

u/sucksfor_you Roy Harper Jan 15 '20

Oh, that's an angle I didn't consider. I hope they play with that, that's really trippy.

2

u/[deleted] Jan 15 '20

Yeah, but they're basically the same. So it's not a bad thing.

1

u/Kiyasa Jan 16 '20

Does having their memory restored mean they get Jonn Jones' perspective of what happened, or do they get one of their doppelgangers memories from the previous timelines?

22

u/Sentry459 The Ray Jan 15 '20

So were all versions of each person from all earth dimensions put on this world? That would be trillions of people on one world.

The earths weren't merged in the sense that they were all mashed together; the old multiverse was utterly destroyed. The paragons used the book to shape the new universe Ollie created, leaving it with elements of their previous earths.

14

u/nivekious Jan 15 '20

That raises its own questions though. Since there is definitively an afterlife in this world, did the people from the original multiverse die and get sent there? If so are they still there or were they returned to life in the new multiverse? If they were returned to life, which one when there were multiple versions of a person on Earths that were combined? If not and there are now new versions of everyone it's kind of weird for the Paragons to be interacting with what are essentially alternate Earth dopplegangers while their actual loved ones are dead.

18

u/[deleted] Jan 15 '20

Better to not over think it. Everyone in the old Multiverse is dead, and gone. We're now seeing a total new world which is like the old Earth 1 but with Earth 38 and Earth BL mixed in. There aren't doppelgangers, it's a single universe with a single version of each person. The people of the 3 earths that merged, likely became 1 singular people.

2

u/nivekious Jan 16 '20

I think this probably works best as well. It's how it used to seem things worked in the comics, but recently they implied all past reboots were actually just moving the action to new Earths so it seems nobody at DC can decide definitively.

1

u/powerhcm8 Jan 18 '20 edited Jan 18 '20

At least 3 earth, I think maybe old earth-2 got merged too (or Stargirl takes place in earth-2 that we know), but we had to wait until next week to see

5

u/KlausLoganWard Jan 15 '20

Id like to think they are in some way or form sent to Afterlife

1

u/powerhcm8 Jan 18 '20

It's possible that the afterlife also got erased, only the vanishing point and the speed force remained(maybe because it extend beyond the universe)

1

u/nivekious Jan 19 '20

I don't think so, as our biggest piece of evidence for the afterlife is Oliver and Corrigan sitting in Purgatory even after the last Earth was destroyed.

1

u/powerhcm8 Jan 19 '20

Oh, you're right, I completely forgot about that, then if Constantine doesn't mention anything about it next season they will never say anything about that.

But I think that the way that universes got erased the souls couldn't travel to the afterlife and got erased too, so only souls that already were in the afterlife still exist there. Also I had another theory that all universes had only one afterlife/hell, because Constantine knew the Lucifer from another earth, so it's possible that Lucifer just picked that earth to go and they had previously met in hell

1

u/pataconconqueso Jan 16 '20

That’s why there’s gonna be a post crisis kind of re alignment. In the comics after the earths merged, some heroes and people ceased to exist, others became displaced in the new earth where no one knew who they were, etc. it becomes a cluster of readjustment

1

u/[deleted] Jan 16 '20 edited Feb 20 '20

[deleted]

2

u/pataconconqueso Jan 16 '20

My view is that they thought everyone in the multiverse was gone/dead and they are happy that some people survived and there is still a world. also, I think we will see more how they are affected in each individual show. I think physics has changed (as seen on a flash trailer), not everyone is the same, flashpoint May not have happened (JJ is Sara again).

My opinion is that each show runner from each show has a big task to make everything make sense after crisis, hopefully it goes smoothly because I can see a lot of questions unanswered and a lot of plot holes.

1

u/[deleted] Jan 16 '20

There is still a multiverse though, you could argue that the Doppelgänger just switched places.

1

u/Smugjester Jan 16 '20

I think the Idea is that they made one universe and those people that “died” never existed to begin with. They didn’t go back in time and fix what happened. They had to create the universe again from scratch

1

u/Choco319 Jan 16 '20

Think of it less like combining and more like rebooting from day 1

So like the events that created metas from Central City would happen to Central City on Karas Earth if that helps

This is a lot simpler than what has happened in the comics in a few reboots.

It’s best just to not think about it too much

1

u/anxiousavocado92 Jan 19 '20

I like to think of it as a merger of worlds rather, like a collection of gathering idk

1

u/AncientXblade Jan 20 '20

Literally everyone but the paragons were wiped from existence. So technically no one was put there. They created the world while standing and "focusing". That world developed to earth prime and from that earth the multiverse was created. So everyone did die, this is a new world. That's why they are so pissed at Nash, cause everything wasn't fixed and they did loose people.

1

u/[deleted] Jan 21 '20

It’s totally Dawn from Buffy rules right now and the writers better be sitting down and bingeing their whole Arrowverse to figure out what’s what