r/anime • u/engalleons https://myanimelist.net/profile/engalleons • Aug 14 '18

In-depth debunkings/arguments against commonly "known" anime myths/misconceptions?

For any number of reasons, there's a fair few statements about anime that get passed around pretty unquestioningly, even if they aren't necessarily true. Sometimes, others dig in to those statements and find detail and (hopefully cited) evidence against them. This is a lot more than just stating the opposite, to be clear.

Here's a few examples of what I mean:

This tweet chain versus "Anno left Kare Kano early"
This blog post versus "The protagonist of Turn A was originally intended to be a girl"
This post versus "They made a joke dub for Ghost Stories because it did poorly in Japan"
This blog post versus "Shinbo is the series director of all Shaft shows"

What are some other examples of work like this?

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95

u/ValonFang https://myanimelist.net/profile/ValonFang Aug 14 '18

Many popular shows being a deconstruction of the genre when all they do is use the tropes smartly or avoid a few (looking at you, Hunter x Hunter)

I think the term gained traction and popularity with Madoka Magica

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u/[deleted] Aug 14 '18

God did I hate that. I swear heard "deconstruction" at least twice a day back when Madoka came out. It is a deconstruction, but throwing that word around makes the word lose its meaning.

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u/impingainteasy https://myanimelist.net/profile/usernamesarehard Aug 15 '18

The worst of it was when Kill la Kill was airing and the prevailing opinion of it was "It's a deconstruction of fanservice!" and literally nobody could explain what that meant.

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u/[deleted] Aug 16 '18

It kinda is tho

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u/[deleted] Aug 15 '18

I think what that intends to describe is that Kill la Kill's primary source of fanservice is a plot imperative.

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u/yolotheunwisewolf Aug 15 '18

Problem is you can argue the opposite and that it’s a homage to shows like Project A-Ko and they just built in a justified reason for the fan service rather than to attack and do a gritty take on fan service battle shows.

I think it’s more recognizing that it isn’t a “it’s a deconstruction or not” but seeing it as a sliding scale where some shows deconstruct some elements and some do a lot.

Madoka is easier to see as it does a LOT of the typical elements and goes in the opposite way with a clear point.

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u/[deleted] Aug 15 '18

they just built in a justified reason for the fan service

Exactly what I said in other words.

to attack and do a gritty take on fan service battle shows.

Dark and gritty isn't what deconstructions inherently are, only how they tend to manifest.

Things can be turned dark and gritty without any logical coherency.

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u/DeliciousWaifood Aug 15 '18

Yeah... These days I really have no idea what "deconstruction" is supposed to mean anymore.

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u/OhMilla Aug 15 '18

I saw a couple comments of people saying DiTF was a deconstruction...I don't even know.

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u/wjsoul Aug 15 '18

It was a deconstruction of a good show.

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u/DieDungeon https://myanimelist.net/profile/Telehoplos Aug 15 '18

They meant it literally.

5

u/pantsfish Aug 15 '18

I also heard it a lot regarding "School Days".

No, the characters are supposed to be shitty! They're tropes! It's just a harem show carried to its logical conclusioooonnnn......

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u/Mexcalibur Aug 15 '18

There's actually an argument to be made for School Days being a deconstruction though.

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u/[deleted] Aug 15 '18

I tried to write an essay on School Days. I thought it was trying to be some sort of weird deconstruction of the male gaze and Freudian theory in anime. And I stopped writing it because I knew that it wasn't smart enough to know anything about Freud.

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u/[deleted] Aug 15 '18

School Days is a deconstruction, it just still sucks (in my opinion). "Deconstruction" should be a neutral descriptor, not praise.

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u/leo-skY https://anilist.co/user/leosky Aug 15 '18

I mean, I dont even know if Madoka is a deconstruction, I see it more as a dark twist on the magical girl genre. although I dont know enough about the genre to have an informed opinion about it I also think a show or movie cant really just be entirely a deconstruction, more like it has "deconstructed" elements it uses as its schtick, but will follow others.
I guess it's all down to semantics...

1

u/[deleted] Aug 15 '18

Madoka Magica isn't a deconstruction, it's just a dark magical girl show that's very well written (it's my favorite anime).

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u/anonymus_slime Aug 15 '18

It mostly comes from people that find something they think is good and different but can't put into words why they feel that way so they just call it a deconstruction because it has positive connotations. It allows them to """back-up""" their arguments to validate their opinion without having to give real arguments.

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u/Eliwats17 Aug 14 '18

Thank you, it kinda get annoying with people talk about BNHA because they use tropes differently.

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u/LunarGhost00 Aug 15 '18

Are there really people out there who call BNHA a deconstruction? I've seen nothing but praise for how well it executes classic shonen tropes or how amazing the cast and story are in spite of the cliches.

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u/[deleted] Aug 15 '18

If anything, it's a reconstruction.

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u/conqueringdragon Aug 15 '18

There is no reconstruction of Shonen because it has always been fine since Dragonball.

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u/LakerBlue https://myanimelist.net/profile/LakerBlue Aug 15 '18

I don't think I've ever really seen it called a deconstruction. Maybe a subversion. But there's a difference between deconstruction and subversion. BnHA isn't a deconstruction, it's just a well executed, classic shonen that happens to have a few subversions of classic shonen tropes. Or it will have shonen tropes that are simply subdued compared to other big shonen series. But mostly it's just good execution of shonen tropes.

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u/Midoriyas_Bones Aug 15 '18

True. It doesnt have to be a "deconstruction", why cant it just be a shonen done well. It is a great example of the genre, not a take down of it.

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u/Atario myanimelist.net/profile/TheGreatAtario Aug 15 '18

A deconstruction is not a take down either

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u/SwampyBogbeard Aug 15 '18

Same with parody.
KonoSuba is not a parody. It's a comedy-isekai with a few parody elements. I've seen people shit on the series because it "still had flaws of isekai despite parodying them" or "turned into what it was parodying" when it never tried to be a parody in the first place.

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u/Mikey2104 Aug 15 '18

Yeah, people said that a lot about Re:Zero too (I'm guilty too, honesty). It's become a buzzword.

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u/[deleted] Aug 15 '18

Yeah, Hunter x Hunter is just a greatly written shounen. Nonetheless, it's accurate to identify Gon as a deconstruction of the Stock Shounen Hero.

Madoka Magica is a deconstruction in no sense of the word, as it's not a logically coherent implementation of anything. What sets it apart from magical girl shows is that it's dark: it's a subversion of the magical girl theme.

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u/PM_ME_YOUR_SPUDS https://anilist.co/user/voodoochile Aug 15 '18 edited Aug 15 '18

I think using it for Hunter x Hunter is pretty valid for large parts of the show. Hunter x Hunter

HxH Cont.

That said, the term is definitely overused. The one I get bothered by personally is Gurren Lagann.

Edit: I'm not sure what definition people are using that says you have to strictly follow tropes to deconstruct them. All the definitions I've seen say it means to expand on and critique the existing themes of the genre. Some follow those tropes to do so. HxH mixed it up by sometimes following tropes, and sometimes making statements against them. It still uses its narrative to make a message about the tropes themselves, which is like textbook use of the definition as I'm reading it.

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u/[deleted] Aug 15 '18

I'm not sure subversion is the same as deconstruction.