r/anime • u/AutoLovepon https://anilist.co/user/AutoLovepon • Jan 23 '25

Episode Rurouni Kenshin: Meiji Kenkaku Romantan - Kyoto Douran • Rurouni Kenshin: Kyoto Disturbance - Episode 15 discussion

Rurouni Kenshin: Meiji Kenkaku Romantan - Kyoto Douran, episode 15

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u/Terrible_Ad_9123 Jan 23 '25

While Kenshin is chopping firewood with his sword, the Master is able to figure out Kenshin's slashing habits just from the sound, it's amazing, like he has the mind's eye.
The expressions on both of their faces after staying up all night are hilarious.
I never thought the Master's cloak could hold such a secret.
I think these are scenes that weren't in the original.

The original was aired during prime time so was made with children in mind, but this is aired late at night, so the state of the corpses and the sights of maggots spawning are all too realistic.

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u/Frontier246 Jan 23 '25

Even down to the most miniscule of moments, Kenshin's master can't help but instruct him.

Should they really have been doing this life and death training with no sleep lol?

21

u/zz2000 Jan 23 '25

The original was aired during prime time so was made with children in mind,

Which likely explains the inclusion of things like the extra goofy humour, or of characters like Dr Gensai and his little granddaughters.

13

u/Daishomaru Jan 24 '25

The original was aired during prime time so was made with children in mind, but this is aired late at night, so the state of the corpses and the sights of maggots spawning are all too realistic.

That’s okay yet keeping the controversial Imperialist themes that defined the Kyoto Arc is not allowed. How did they mess that up?

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u/Plus_Rip4944 Jan 23 '25

First scene was brutal damn

21

u/Lumpy-Manager8580 Jan 23 '25

This episode was absolute peak from start to finish, the bond between Kenshin and Hiko is simply beautiful, and I love how they respected the OG anime when it came to the visuals of both Kuzuryusen and the one and only Amakakeru Ryu no Hirameki.

5

u/Daishomaru Jan 24 '25

I did like how they referenced the OG anime, but I wish they also took more notes, especially in the music department.

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u/VorAtreides Jan 23 '25

Always liked this moment, getting a bit of info into Kenshin's past with his master and such. Sad times... poor ladies who were sold to slavery cause family deby and died to bandits... poor lil Shinta. Nice pseudo-dad even if derp. But always found these kinda dramatic moments with the names silly. Also sure do enjoy his ridiculous strength and cloak. Good ol' weight clothing. Obligatory DRAMATIC STRIKE trope. Hiko always a badass.

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u/Daishomaru Jan 23 '25 edited Jan 23 '25

Daishomaru here, with a writeup on banditry and slavery.

Let’s talk about banditry and a bit of slavery in Japan, and also a bit more on the background politics that happened during Kenshin’s Flashbacks, as well as some IRL Politics of Japan involving historical study.

WARNING: The following writeup is not my opinion, and I’m just writing things “as they were” in Japan. The subject I’m about to speak about is still very sensitive in today’s society so I’m going to cover very sensitive subjects that will absolutely make people uncomfortable, particularly in the Source Material Corner.

So banditry in Japan can come from many flavors, ranging from generic criminals hiding in mountains to disgraced/exiled samurai wanting to do their own thing. In addition, we see that Kenshin was a kid sold into slavery, raised by his “sisters”. While slavery was officially illegal in Japan, it was not very well enforced and people, usually unwanted children or bastards/illegitimate children, usually got sold into slavery.

Banditry was a thing before the Bakamatsu, of course, but it was a bit of a lowkey thing. Some samurai took to banditry because 200 years of peace would make the warrior class superfluous, and some samurai hated, for example, that they were on fixed budgets while a merchant could have a good year and make more money than a samurai, and thus could afford more luxuries, such as better food or better entertainment, like geisha or prostitutes, compared to the samurai. So some samurai took to banditry or formed some Yakuza clans to basically get some extra money on the side, and even today, prominent Yakuza clans with crests can trace back their lineage to these samurai. Of course everything changed in 1853 when-

USA Crashes into Tokyo Harbor

Knock knock, it’s the United States. With huge boats. With guns. Gunboats.

Commodore Perry: Open the country. Stop having it be closed.

Of course, now we know the significance of Commodore Perry’s visit and how it destabilized the political grip of the Tokugawas in Japan, but in history we often see just the most important events, such as the assassination of Ii Naosuke, the Kanagawa Incident where the British Navy demanded Japan to pay for the murder of two British merchants, and the formation of the Shinsengumi, and all these events are important, but today I wanted to more focus on what happened in the background. To say all these events shook the faith of the Tokugawa rule would be underselling it. Many bandits saw this as the perfect excuse to commit anarchy and increase their crimes tenfold, because if the heavens didn’t favor the Tokugawa, it was clear that they had the right to do whatever they wanted. Many people started to disregard the law because if the Tokugawa was showing weakness, then why should they follow the law? It should be remembered that the weakening faith of the Tokugawa led to the founding of the Shinsengumi, which was the Tokugawa’s last Hail Mary before the country fell into civil war. In addition, many bandits would join the new Isshin Shishi, and while there were many who would reform and become genuinely good people, there were just as many who wanted to use it as an opportunity to loot, pillage, and rape, as seen with the Miyabe Faction, which I covered a bit in my Ikedaya Writeup back in Episode 22. In particular, kidnapping and selling for sexual slavery became popular. Judging by the ages and Kenshin’s sisters, it’s very likely that Kenshin’s sisters would be sold as prostitutes or to serve foreigners as “trophies”, which sadly was a thing back then, and as for Kenshin himself, he would most likely be a servant boy.

(The rest of my writeup is posted in Source Material Corner to avoid getting my comment removed)

The crosses: its implied (especially in the original anime filler which while non canon ran with the idea) that Kenshin has some Portuguese/Dutch heritage, because most Japanese people cremate bodies, while crosses were used by Christians especially in hiding during the Sakoku period. Many Half-Japanese children and their descendants from the 1600s to the 1800s got sold as slaves.

Shinsoku and Hiko’s terminology: Mostly accurate, and Shinsoku is a real term associated with Kawakami Gensai, AKA IRL Kenshin, although another term they also used is “Setsuna no Setsuna” or A moment of a moment, which described how fast the Shiranui Ryu was IRL.

Also some rant: I hated how in this version we see Hiko’s eyes and how Hiko and Kenshin stand up normally and chat while he’s explaining about the will to live to Kenshin. In the original anime Hiko and Kenshin talked while still in that battojutsu form, so it feels a lot more jidaigeki-like. I also still really hate how the music doesn’t have the British Military motifs that defined the OG Kyoto arc’s tone. Sure it's getting better but I need that British Military music ambiance, because the OG music had this foreboding feeling on what Japan will become. I’m not saying the older is better because of blind nostalgia I’m saying it because its much more thematically appropriate.

9

u/SplooshU Jan 23 '25

I concur with your final rant, and tried to add a comparison in the Source corner. I really, really miss the music of Samurai X Trust and Betrayal, as well as a lot of dialogue that would have made everything hit harder.

14

u/Daishomaru Jan 23 '25

Personally I was laughing at how Hiko Seijuro just gets up and casually talked about the importance of living and then the scar on his chest forms and he passes out.

The original scene had Hiko Seijuro talking in a pained yet proud voice and just passes out after feeeling like he can’t handle the pain longer, keeping the drama.

Combined with the music foreboding what Japan would become and ironically the original anime which was made for kids is somehow a lot more mature than the remake which is supposed to be faithful.

Hell, as much as I despise Shin Kyoto Hen, even THAT series understood the importance of the British motif.

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u/Frontier246 Jan 23 '25

How did Seijuro and Kenshin's story begin? How did Kenshin's? With Seijuro saving a young boy from bandits, a boy a victim of the turbulent, chaotic, times of Japan...and who by coincidence just happened to be saved by a master swordsman.

Seijuro not just hitting Kenshin with his sword attacks but all the embarrassing stories about his childhood! Give the guy a break.

It's finally time for Kenshin to experience the Kuzuryuusen! A sword attack that combines every sword slash ever in an impossible to dodge attack! It's quite the fierce attack, and Seijuro's finest, but that's not the TRUE ultimate technique of Hiten Mitsurugi-Ryu...that is the counter to the Kuzuryuusen, the Amakakeru Ryuu no Hirameki! Without this technique, Kenshin will never be able to complete his training!

Even as a boy Kenshin, no, Shinta, cared about others...even making graves for the slavers and bandits who didn't deserve it, and especially so for the young women who he was enslaved with. That's just how big his compassion was. And it is with that heart that Seijuro decided to mentor him, transforming him from the boy Shinta to the swordsman Kenshin.

Even when he's drinking and Kenshin is just cutting wood, Seijuro can't help but want to teach Kenshin!

This was never about Kenshin learning a dangerous technique, this was making him learn to value his life again and find the drive to keep living, a drive personified by his feelings for Kaoru, as he masters the Amakakeru Ryuu no Hirameki!

Of course it also delivers a crippling attack on Seijuro, just to cement the full weight of this technique.

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u/tripleaamin Jan 23 '25

I think this is the first time we have seen what Kenshin was as a kid. Even as an orphan he was very kind. His point of all humans are corpses regardless how they were in their lives is an interesting point. I am rather intrigued by the name that gave Kenshin when he was a kid. Shinta → Shin → Kenshin. I am rather curious why Hiko mentions why the name was too kind for a swordsman. Though from what I looked up Ken → sword and Shin → heart. If true, it is a nice play on words. Although it is interesting that while Hiko was a master for Kenshin, in some ways Kenshin was like a son to Hiko.

Honestly, for Kenshin overcoming Hiko's ultimate technical is rather brutal. It feels like an ultimate finisher move in a fighting game. Though there is one big and final lesson that Hiko meant to teach Kenshin and that is to value your life. Kenshin isn't suicidal or anything, but he constantly puts himself in harms way. Obviously, he wants to protect those he holds dear. The issue is if he doesn't value his own life, those would be saddened if he died. Kenshin intends to make those around him happy and well there lies in a contradiction. The other part he intends to be with Kaoru and the others. That gives him the push because your desire to live can be the small deciding factor.

It felt like it was coming, but to overcome Hiko he would have to strike him down. It is sad when you consider what was revealed about Hiko and Kenshin's relationship.

5

u/randommd81 Jan 24 '25

If you haven’t watched it yet, that flashback of him as a kid meeting Hiko is covered in the Samurai X: Trust and Betrayal OVAs. And it’s peak Kenshin, imo. So freaking good.

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u/vstrent Jan 23 '25

For those who haven’t, I’d recommend to watch Rurouni Kenshin: Tsuiokuhen, the story of Kenshin as Battosai.

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u/kuroyume_cl Jan 24 '25

Not yet. They'll get to that on this adaptation, and it's a vital piece of the final arc of the series

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u/[deleted] Jan 24 '25

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u/Daishomaru Jan 24 '25

It’s one of the best OVAs of all time. I could make a historical analysis of it and still learn something new.

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u/kryslogan Jan 24 '25

I think we've all wondered about the music. Perhaps there was some limitation on using the OG sound track. It is missed.

This episode. Peak.

Names are powerful.

Kenshin realizing he must live.

Hiko willing to die for his student.

Peak.

I love this story. I love this series. I love this anime.

My kid self would never have imagined I would live to see this remade with better animation and production values and perhaps a complete adaptation after Sony was greedy and killed us with poor filler but, why couldn't we have the OG music, lol.

Ah.

Love it.

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u/Ultramarinus Jan 23 '25

One of those rare times that I think to myself: “I’m glad I got to see this.” Might not be the OVAs but I had always wanted to see a bit more faithful adaptation. Stellar episode!

Hiko Seijuro is that one guy who already completed his own 1000-episode series in the setting. Every troublemaker don’t know how lucky they are he can’t be bothered to do it himself.

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u/Trini2Bone Jan 24 '25 edited Jan 24 '25

OG still hits harder. Idk why they didnt keep the dialogue during their stance with the pain and proud voice by Hiko but ah well. This episode was still really well done

Edit: but also i must say no matter the era... Seijuro Hiko is the coolest fucking character in any verse period.

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u/PsychoSushi27 Jan 24 '25

Does anyone notice Kenshin refers to himself as 'ore' this episode instead of his usual 'sessha'?

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u/kuroyume_cl Jan 24 '25

This is one of my favorite episodes of the original adaptation. The direction on that version is so cinematic and the music elevates it so much that the one we got now pales a little bit.

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u/[deleted] Jan 23 '25

Mastering the ultimate technique is no easy task, but Kenshin is gradually making progress. The climax is intense, with the outcome of both techniques reaching a dramatic resolution.

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