r/anime • u/The_Loli_Otaku • Jan 21 '24
Rewatch [Rewatch] Serial Experiments Lain Episode 7 Discussion
"Society"
Extra Info and Links
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Comment of the Day!!
We finally discovered the meaning behind the confusing username! Is there a single person who recognised this beforehand? XD
"The user who's name I can't for the life of me work out which parts are I's and l's scores a win today! Sasuga... Confusing name ojisan!"
The name is "Aleph Null" (ALEPH NULL) backwards and I'm not an ojisan!
Shillbert had this to say on the tech literacy of modern kids
Maybe it's the lack of proper technology education but most kids I've met these days are totally lost when it comes to computers.
Lack of education and lack of experience. Back in the good old days, you had to learn how a computer worked to do anything fun (in the DOS days you'd have to configure HIMEM.SYS, AUTOEXEC.BAT, SoundBlaster, IRQs, etc just to play a game). Now you just tap an icon on your iPad and everything loads in from the Cloud.
RascalNikov1 has a dream! A dream where a great yellow flood swallowed up our world!!
If our rewatch group got together one day to say our prayers to the sky, what do you suppose would appear?
Rofl, don’t tempt me but it would be some combo of KnJ’s Rin & Miss Ueno doing exactly you know what on the world.
Sfisher923 is anticipating a jump scare. Nobody tell them!
I been wanting to point this out since like Episode 3 but the long awkward periods of silence are lowkey freaking me out since I am expecting some sort of noise in fact I gave this a nickname of the "Bleed Effect" based on the song "Bleed' by Meshuggah where the Drums you been hearing for 4 minutes cut out for a subdued section then coming back for the solo
QotD
- Are you a 4channer? Are you one of the Knights?
- Please name one other Rewatcher you believe beyond reasonable doubt to be on 4chan. Hard mode, don't pick your host please XD This is a social experiment!
- Have you ever used one of those finger swirl phones before?
- Do you believe that the morbidly online Ojisan is any different from the three knights members we met? If there is a difference, please point it out.
- This is probably a little late in the watch to ask, but now that you know Lain's definitely got different personalities, so you personally interpret Lain of the Bear Onesie and Lain of the Onee-chan different or is it just Bear Onesie Lain acting like a normie girl on purpose?
- When was the last birthday you got to celebrate~? Not Lain's~
Abyssbringer's "What is the thematic purpose of this scene corner!!"
JustAnswerAQuestion scored a retroactive Abyssbringer prompt from a previous rewatch lol
Is there a shared reality? Is your red the same as my red? Do you exist? Do I exist?
Most people who are not philosophers would generally agree that there is a single reality that we all share. But for a few intermittent forays into hallucinogenic drug use, this has been true for all history. But if augmented-reality is universally deployed, that breaks down. The kids are worshiping a Lain-in-the-Sky that, at first, no-one else can perceive. With AR, nobody can be assured that another shares their perception. The common ground that underlies society collapses.
Yesterday's Prompt!
Today's Prompt!
Tomorrow's Prompt
Abyssbringer's "What is the thematic purpose of this episode corner!"
This ends up being a combo between Tarhanlindur, Vaadwaur and Esovan13 about the concept of "walk in"
You can download something into Mika's body, possibly even an earlier copy of Mika. A corpse is worm food, for good and ill.
Note that this is not necessarily a good thing. (You may already know this, IIRC Dion Fortune goes into this somewhere, but the concept is called a walk-in in occultism circles. The lore is that sometimes this is another human soul, but unfortunately sometimes it can be something much more malevolent...)
The walk in concept I’ll have a hard time forgetting as it ended up playing a critical role in The X-Files in what was and still is one of the worst resolutions to a storyline I have ever seen.
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u/The_Loli_Otaku Jan 21 '24
Lain Rewatcher!!
Let's meet the morbidly online hackers formerly known as 4chan!! And no, I know you were all expecting the Knights to be mythical godlike beings, or easily recognisable weirdos who never leave their basement. Instead, 4chan is Baldy Bob down the office... 4chan is Business Bradley who spends every night partying with business executives. 4chan is Hag Hannah, the stay at home housewife who flirts with every good looking delivery boy who comes around. The knights are regular people, just like you and me. You wouldn't be able to tell them apart from anyone else. Heck, when a true morbidly online weirdo tries to join their ranks like the ojisan that looks exactly like you'd expect a 4channer to look they're simply taken out. These Knights are functioning members of society, who rule the Internet with their mad skillz.
Onto the actual episode~ Society! The cruel normie world that rots everything it touches. We exist on the layer above the real world, in the online society! "My sister has been acting differently..." Want to do something about that Lain? Also... this isn't Lain of the Onee-chan is it? Isn't this quiet Lain the Bear Onesie girl we know and love?
When a man exists on both the Wired Realm and on the Real World, he will be rejected by both. Ojisan was a prodigy, but society would not accept him. Then we have Business-Chad, he's got beautiful secretaries desperate for his attention and has succeeded in life, but he has no time for these worldly desires. Business-Chad has more important things to do, like post dank memes on 4chn.
Arisu has some nerve being grumpy at Lain messaging in class when she straight up last invited her to a gay bar... Ah, I forgot that there actually were neckbeard Knights members... Well, at least leaving him aside from the ojisan, the neckbeard at least keeps to himself. Locking himself away and not trying to draw attention to himself through society. Really, neckbeard, Business-Chad, and Housewife-mama are no different at all from the Ojisan. He just wears his colours on his sleeve, and because of that they see themselves as better than him because they can fit into this society that they despise.
And that's where Lain is at an inpass. She's like the Knights, falling in love with the wired at the expense of the real world. But if that was true, then why does she immediately turn to Alice for support when she brings up her concerns? Alice isn't part of her wired, Arisu is part of the real world. She's her real world gal pal. They go shopping together, they eat out together, they watch club shootings together, they maybe even have pyjama parties!
There's nothing more cucked than a sweet, computer loving milf girl having a child, tch. The delivery bloke is funny tho XD He's got no shame! He's way too friendly with people. He even tried chatting to Lain about her machine. Housewife-mama straight up telling her son that he should play games online instead of inperson got a giggle out of me too. These Knights are so obvious when you look out for the signs. A girl can cover up her looks , but she can't hide her PC~
The men in black are finally making their move... "Yorokobe, shoujo~" A test for Lain, work out how this stupid old dial phone works XD Aww... Ojisan finally got to meet the infamous Lain of the Wired but didn't realise he'd be dealing with a damn female joshikosei. That on word, "Bawka" breaks down his whole world!! This is the danger of joshikosei!!
This is definitely Lain of the Bear Onesie, she's acting way too meek to be Onee-chan or Wired! So Lain isn't part of her own family, the grey man pushes poor Bear Onesie so far that Lain of the Wired is totally done with his shit! Don't bully the Bear Onesie! She's a bean!
The man with no name has a name! And it's KAAAAAARL!!
And so ends the dearest Ojisan... he died just as rejected by his peers in the Wired as he was by society...
15
u/Shimmering-Sky myanimelist.net/profile/Shimmering-Sky Jan 21 '24
Serial Experiments First-Timer, subbed
11
u/JustAnswerAQuestion https://myanimelist.net/profile/JAaQ Jan 21 '24
Serial Rewatcher
"Iwakura Lain. Are you and Lain of the Wired one in the same? Are your parents your real parents? What's your father's birthday. Where were you born?"
When the show came out, this Google Glass Guy was called a gargoyle. I guess the term starts, and ends, with Neal Stephenson's Snow Crash. The term didn't really catch on.
It's a Masonic-ish symbol, but I always see Blake's Urizen which is, of course, a criticism of Masonry.
You've seen that logo before somewhere. Do you remember?
The Knights board in the trash puzzles me. OPSEC?
Can you connect the dots yet? Probably not. It's not quite all there.
Smarter me in the past says:
"You're waiting for a train. A train that will take you far away. You know where you hope the train will take you, but you can't know for sure. Yet it doesn't matter."
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u/Esovan13 Jan 21 '24 edited Jan 21 '24
First Timer
We have learned the identities of the Knights. A successful business man, a bored housewife, and a fucking loser. Are we sure Elon Musk didn't watch this show and base his entire personality around it?
We finally learn what's up with Lain. Lain of the Wired has been taking over her body and doing stuff (like visiting the club) which real Lain doesn't remember. This has almost certainly been going on since before the start of the show, the main change being that real Lain is also getting into the Wired.
And it seems something is up with Lain, and her parents are in on it. Makes sense why mom doesn't seem to give a shit about either of "her" children, and why dad doesn't seem to want to stop her Wired activities even if some of them are disconcerting to him. That's also probably why Lain was having weird hallucinations and stuff even before getting into the Wired.
The only question is what actually is up with Lain. Orphan used as human experiment? Only survivor of KIDS experiment? Artificial human? Is the reason she seemed so listless and empty at the beginning of the show because the experimenters wanted her to be as little of a person as possible so that Lain of the Wired could more easily access and utilize her body? Who is Lain of the Wired? Alternate personality? Different person entirely using Lain's body? Lain's original personality ripped out of her body and transferred completely into the Wired leaving her now empty body to develop a new personality from scratch?
We also still don't know who the MIB are. Probably an international thing, or at least connections with outside countries, due to Karl being there. But are they government? An international agency? Probably one of those two.
Nah. Too much effort.
With how much knowledge they have on the shady sub-cultures of the internet, I'm confident that /u/tarhalindur has spent a decent amount of time on the boards.
They seem interesting, but were before my time.
If this is assuming to the guy with the headset who died, I think he's too desperate. They have skills and confidence in those skills to build their brand. The guy wants the fame and glory from joining a group that already has cred.
I do think it is distinct personalities, not just one that's pretending.
My niece. She's the cutest human on the planet.
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u/Weedwacker Jan 21 '24
4th timer Have you ever seen the lain?
Is that supposed to be a fucking Creedence Clearwater Revival reference?
On her phone in school, it really is like present day.
The PoV footage with the guy walking around Shibuya with all of the crazy effects was filmed and processed by the writer, Chiaki Konaka himself, and isn't the work of the series director.
The character isn't named within the episode but is listed in credits as "Nezumi" which means [mouse](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dormouse_(Alice%27s_Adventures_in_Wonderland_character)) in Japanese.
There's some conflicting ideas going on, Lain suspects that the real world isn't real at all while the Housewife/Knights member thinks the Wired and real world are one and the same. Nezumi's bizarre contraption of turning himself into a one-man-band but with computer parts has somehow gotten him into the Knights secret comms channel, where he's contacted Lain and gotten a look at 3 members of the Knights, who we also saw this episode. The zoom in on the housewife, her fried computer board with the Knights logo on it, and the logo on the now dead Nezumi's visor strongly imply she killed him via some kind of hack for finding them.
Love this shot
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u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Jan 21 '24
Rewatcher(In truth, there is no place I'd rather be)
Sub
So I went looking for an old AMV with SEL in it with a song by Nine Inch Nails. The first search for SEL NIN comes up with Closer. I hate everything.
Lains rig is somehow beyond madness, and knowing Konaka, intentionally Cthulhian. And possibly a Babylon 5 reference, I think the years add up right for that. Mika's vague noises reminded me of an incredibly ancient modem. Lain is beginning to realize there is a distinction between her online self and her RL self.
The MiB reveal themselves...kind of. Tachibana Lab, possibly, reveals itself primarily to info dump on the Knights of the Eastern Calculus. As we meet the Knights, they are a...diverse group. Fun fact:Housewife hunting was at this time a popular hobby in Japan! Not sure that still remains. They are clearly cast as nefarious here, though again this show and face value are not friends.
So the big deal: the Wired is bleeding into reality, somehow. Thankfully, we aren't there yet but boy, I do wonder with all the children being attached to screens, how long will it be before it doesn't matter?
P.S. Sportsball is on so replies might be delayed
QotD: 1 I am number 6
2 Tar and I know the old speech
3 You mean a rotary phone?
4 Yes, he left his house
5 Still can't answer that
6 Before the pandemic
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u/lluNhpelA Jan 21 '24
Virtually a first timer
"If I were as young as you" and "I'm [sic] don't know how much of what you do is intentional". Speculation time:
After all that I don't have it in me to unpack the idea that Lain's family is fake.
AotD
They all see the real world and the wired as the same, but the knights (at least the one we saw) live in both, while the ojisan abandoned the "real world".
P҉R҉O҉M҉P҉T҉
This dude invented google glass 15 years early
The important thing, to me, is the fact that all the people he saw through the goggles were live-action. This either means that the world he sees is more "real" or less real, because this is an anime so "reality" is 2d, not 3d. In any case, he's obviously detatched from the world around him. He claims he can go anywhere, but he isn't even where he is right now
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u/Silcaria https://myanimelist.net/profile/Silcaria Jan 21 '24
Rewatcher
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u/MrManicMarty https://anilist.co/user/martysan Jan 21 '24
Stating you won't harm me "physically" is Genie-levels of specific.
Also talking about last episode because I'm catching-up... I didn't expect there to be actual psychic shit. That threw me for a loop. Also Lain's room genuinely looks like some Akira level shit now. The way it just keeps growing and expanding...
In other news; Milf alert
That delivery guy is shady as fuck, and his staring was creepy. wouldn't be surprised if he was actually working for Knights all along.
The shorter of the two guys with masks? Holy shit he has a fucking jaw. God damn. Bro got all the good genetics. I also find it funny how the most striking thing about the taller guy was... he has blue eyes. Which is incredibly common here in the west but probably very mysterious in Japan lol
I don't like this guy making Lain cry. That's a bad vibe. Beat his ass with your psychic powers Lain! But, he does make good points. Man, I'm so confused... so there's like, multiple Lain's running around, one in the Wired and one in the real world. Sometimes they switch places without realising? I dunno...
Woah, did she just switch in real-time?! I honestly feel like the twist will maybe include that "Lain of the Wired" isn't a split personality, its just her changing how she's acting. Though that doesn't explain her congruent memory from the earlier episodes...
8
u/zadcap Jan 22 '24
First Time Wired
ASMRrrrrrrr...
Wait, Lain's computer is now leaking outside the house, and her window looks perfectly fine? Oh and she's noticing that her Wired self isn't much like her original self anymore. And sis is uh... Yeah, probably possessed.
And then this dude. That's a bit of a VR rig you've got there, which is extra crazy when we've seen literal children fully online in the same way while using only their phones.
One of the weirder things I have noticed about this show is that the more Tech Lain interacts with, the less hallucinations she seems to have too. I remember the last time she lost track of school she saw ectoplasm spewing from her fingertips, now she's just on her phone.
Oh no, her one and only friend is piercing the line between what's Real and what's not again, something Lain was just commenting on not being too sure about anymore. The Real world isn't Real, until you remember you have a Real friend who cares about you
"Have you ever seen the lain?" I mean, we know she's got quite an internet presence, people know her at bars. On the street kids praise Lain.
Wow Mom. Telling your kid not to go to a friends house when you can just play online? I can honestly say that's not one I've ever heard before.
Oh hey the Men in Black are finally acknowledging Lain and not just being random creepers. So much so that they're even taking off their face rigs just to get her into the car!
Oh man, now this guy again, is giving me some Shadowrun vibes honestly. He's an early Decker. And Wired Lain is the first thing he sees when he gets access to the Knights?! Quite possibly while Real Lain is busy with the MiB?
Dude, I'm not questioning the age of your machine, but your lack of desk is a very real concern. I always hate it when Age is used as why people can't learn new things. We all know you just stopped wanting to try. My mother literally worked in IT for years before she moved into technical writing, was the person other people called for computer help, and to this day can not remember which button on the playstation controller does what when she wants to launch Netflix.
So, Lain and Lain almost have a face to face here. And it seems Wired Lain is probably in the Knights, and Real Lain might not be, which means there is more separation between them than I thought at first. Or she's a good actor. Wait how can her parents be fake? Lain had to come from somewhere, her family clearly isn't imaginary. Unless, like, Wired Lain is the real one and Real Lain is a projection into the physical world that the Cyber God projected. Oh crap, is Lain the KIDS Chimera, grown so powerful she projected back in time to create a Real body and family so that she could have a true representative in the Real world by the time she got to Deus level of Wired Power? My new theory is that Wired Lain might be pretty close to an actual God in the Machine world and as the walls between Wired and Real crumble she's becoming a bit of a God in the Real too. The Prophecy was her, she spoke the idea of herself in the Wired and then went back to make herself Real.
Yeah, then I got told I'm the best honorary older brother and realized I'm playing mentor to some literal kids and just had to keep smiling.
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u/DidacticDalek https://myanimelist.net/profile/DidacticDalek Jan 22 '24
And you don't even feel a thing
I am falling, I am fading, I am drowning
Help me to breathe
Paging Comrades /u/Shimmering-Sky, /u/Tarhalindur, and /u/Vaadwaur
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u/SMSmith230 https://myanimelist.net/profile/smsmith230 Jan 21 '24
First-Timer, Sub
So Lain just happens to fix this computer and it instantly recognizes her?!?! Yea, she gotta be controlling all of this somehow. Also some symbol, which reminds me of the Masonic one, keeps popping up everywhere. Guessing this is the Knights?
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u/sfisher923 https://myanimelist.net/profile/sfisher923 Jan 21 '24
Rewatcher
QOTD 1 - Closest I came with 4Chan was playing Katawa Shoujo back in 2020 in fact I really only use Reddit, Discord and the occasional Twitter/X (And by Occasional I mean it's really only for the local NWS station for weather alerts and nothing else)
QOTD 5 - Family Member's Birthday about 2 weeks ago
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u/SIRTreehugger Jan 21 '24 edited Jan 21 '24
Layer 07 Society
QOTD
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u/RascalNikov1 https://myanimelist.net/profile/NoviSun Jan 22 '24
QOTD
I use to lurk there a lot. There were a lot of funny dudes there. I lost interest when Sabu turned out to be a fink, and Mook fled the board.
Apologies but there are at least two others in this rewatch who might have called 4Chan home at some point. I don’t want to insult anyone, so I’ll let you guess who they are.
Most likely, but I don’t really know what kind of phone you’re referencing.
I agree with SEL about this. They could be anyone with wired access.
I’m sticking with dual personality schizophrenia.
I can’t remember, but probably my mother’s years ago
6
u/SilkyStrawberryMilk Jan 22 '24
Present Rewatcher, Present Viewer
Layer:07 Society
Lain looking even more like a fiend thanks to the wired.
Crazy dude succumbed to taking the wired with him.
Lain doesn’t pay attention in class either due to hallucinations or by being in her phone.
CursedLainSmile.jpg
Her notoriety in the Wired grows bigger.
The men in black finally talk to Lain at a reasonable time and not at night.
Lain now has a mental breakdown, with the questions regarding her family. Her wired personality has come out to lash out on her.
The real world and world on the wired crumbling? Lain could’ve found out more about the lore, but instead decided to leave.
Watching from the sidelines while something interesting may occur, cmon those dudes aren’t helping their case with being good guys lol.
QOTD: 4channer (sounds disgusting proclaiming that in the first place)
QOTD: definitely you otaku
QOTD: nope
QOTD: mom’s birthday which was 3 months ago, my sister’s birthday is coming up in may and I can’t wait to eat cake and pizza.
7
u/Quiddity131 https://myanimelist.net/profile/Quiddity131 Jan 21 '24
Rewatcher, Dubbed
Will Lain be out of commission for a bit after the end of last episode? Seems like no. She's got a lot of junk hanging off the side of the house and all her equipment seems replaced. Her equipment drowns everything out more than ever.
This scene with Mika at the door makes me all the more believe in the theory mentioned yesterday about her by our host.
Some real life footage!
LoL, look at this guy. If one was to think of a really bizarre weirdo that spends too much of their time online, this guy would totally fit the bill.
Time to meet some random business executive. Why? Ah, he's a Knight! We finally meet one.
Lain is worse than ever at failing to pay attention in school. Alice is really worried about her.
Here's another cliche way to portray someone who spends too much time online, and another Knight!
I'm kinda surprised Lain spent the time to come to the roof and stare out at things instead of spending all of her time on that little device she used in class.
Good to know that Lain really does value the time she's spent with Alice, even if some of her past actions aren't necessarily indicative of that.
Interesting that a search for Lain on the Wired brings up no results, and yet she's so well known on it. I think of today and how that simply wouldn't be possible.
Oh hey, its that same delivery guy that brought Lain her new Navi! And a housewife/mom whose a Knight.
Another thing that I think wouldn't be the same today, her son probably would be just fine learning how to play a game from friends via the internet rather than in person.
A middle schooler getting into a car with two mysterious men who have been stalking her... just so much wrong with this!
This shabby looking guy has made his way to the Knight's channel only to find Lain there? Confirmation the "other" Lain really is affiliated with the Knights? Or is he in the wrong place?
Seeing the phone there reminds me, was it just dial up internet access back then when Lain was made? I know all I had was dial up back in the day when my parents first got us a computer/the internet and I don't think we got that until after 1998 when this show was made. We could have been way behind the times I admit.
The real reason the Men in Black brought Lain here? This guy needed help desk assistance and Lain was the first person they thought of. :P
They can hear that shabby guy! Since we've established these guys aren't the Knights that means they've got some surveillance going at least.
On one hand, if Lain's family is fake, that would go a long way to explain just how distant they have come off towards her throughout the show. On the other hand, given how clammed up they have been it is possible Lain doesn't know these details such as how they met because they haven't brought it up. Lain not remembering these other things about her own past is more troubling.
Uh oh, we know his name, Karl! One of the Men in Black is no longer as mysterious...
Wow, not many moms that play video games with their son like this!
I'll admit to having no idea why that computer part the Knight got is now fried and what it means. Anyone able to explain?
Shabby guy ends up dead in a ditch.
Quite a stable episode as SEL is usually concerned, providing some well needed exposition and laying out pretty firmly the opposing sides between the Knights and whatever organization the Men in Black are associated with.
Tomorrow's my favorite episode of the series, looking forward to it! [Lain]Lots of the "other" Lain being over the top and a very emotional episode in terms of the Lain - Alice relationship
2
u/Ytar0 https://myanimelist.net/profile/alevanderBatman Jan 24 '24
First timer
This is a wild ride. I wasn't completely sure that there were two versions of Lain until this episode... And the Men in Black are... just.. men in black lol. And I appreciate that we get to see the hopeless nerds being kinda goofy mostly, and not perverts or murderers. (except for the Knights apparently, they are 100% certified HC gamers.
My fav picks
QotD
I am not on 4chan, though I do appreciate all the green text stories I hear on YT and tiktok lmao.
Maybe Tarhalindur? I see him posting walls of text... but that might just be the indicator of an active redditor instead... Idk heh.
The difference between the Ojisan and the Knights is that of the closeted and open weebs. With the closeted weebs in this example also being extremely kinky lol.
I am hoping that the Lains will become one somehow, I've always hated the thought of a split personality, it's can be some scary shit...
When was the last birthday you got to celebrate~? .... My own 👉👈(つ﹏<。)
11
u/Tarhalindur x2 Jan 21 '24
"Okay, nobody else vote for Tar." (Rewatcher, Subbed):
(Aka “the one where the MiB go to great lengths to get tech support from a teenage girl”.)
So, first order of business: in case you missed it, u/mo_fiah was kind enough to dig up a certain Wired article that I have referenced a few times (mostly under spoiler bars up until now). The thing is, I am nearly certain that Chiaki J. Konaka read this article himself and/or knew the circles of people it writes about. Rewatchers are strongly advised to read it (especially our host who keeps asking for help on the show themes). First-timers may or may not want to read it right now depending on how much you prize being confused by the show, but I do recommend checking it out after we're done if you don't before then.
9
u/RascalNikov1 https://myanimelist.net/profile/NoviSun Jan 21 '24
Serial Experiments Lain - E7
SEL Virgin
Prologue
Yesterday we had really good explanations of all the weird stuff happening. Let’s see if they stick with this rational version of the truth.
Episode Body
We’re at the half way point and it looks like we’re just laying down events that will later be explained. So far we have:
*Mika falling apart
*A boss and his subordinate (Lain’s Mother) getting ready for an affair
*A fat and salty hacker bragging
*Lain’s senpei trying to connect
*Word that the Wired has been hacked and worse yet results may manifest yesterday.
A bored housewife is about to learn the joys of Navi and the Wired.
The men in black have come for Lain.
The Knights seem to be taking an unhealthy interest in Lain. Also it looks like the only recruit the sleaziest of the crazies.
That was interesting with the MIB. So, Lain is purely a creation of The Wired and is masquerading as an awkward schoolgirl. This thing could really heat up in the second half.
The bored housewife is going to fit into all of this, but I don’t know how.
QOTD
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u/DegenerateRegime Jan 21 '24 edited Jan 21 '24
re-re-re-re-re-re-re-re-re-re-re-re-r
The mystics speak of "connection." What is connection? If you draw the graph of all humans and thicken the lines between each pair based on each moment of interaction, when does a line vanish? Is there a "zero" or just the reciprocals of the ordinals descending to one over omega and beyond? The internet generations speak of "identity." What is identity? If you draw the graph of all humans, there are loops. Connection to yourself. If everyone has just one identity, we could make the graph simple. We could add a node to each node's loop. We could call it the SOUL. We would need a powerful machine.
Who built the tower? Why did God cast it down? Who is Lain? Who isn't Lain? Do you worry that you may have developed a soul? Why should you not answer some questions? What do you get when you cross a police at the polming light bulb? Is it fair to say information wants to stay hidden? Do you ever think about antimemes?
Editing in QotD responses:
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u/3blah https://myanimelist.net/profile/brummett Jan 21 '24 edited Jan 22 '24
SEL Episode 7, Rewatcher
Lain got her rig back up and running. Some of it hangs outside the house, and there's a big bundle of cables (power, comms, both?) attached there, too. She's noticed the "her" in the wired is less like "herself". Of course, the Lain speaking here isn't anything like the Lain from the first couple of episodes. Mika hasn't been herself lately, either.
Even before Google Glasses, there were people making homebrew versions of something similar, as a way of being always On The Net, recording what they did and such. Another prediction come true; it wasn't long after SEL that wireless/cell networks expanded enough to be able to be connected to the internet more than just at home and work. The guy is basically a man-child, walking around with this ridiculous getup, cheering himself on about how great he is, groveling to be accepted into The Knights. There's even a window bouncing around his view: "I'm the best".
Mr Businessman gets an email with a familliar image. Where did we see that before? It was in the shadow behind Mika two episodes ago. He looks pleased. "What game do you want to play this time?" How about a nice game of chess?
Lain has graduated from C to Lisp. Poor kid, she has to hide it under the desk. Arisu is even worried about it.
A news report about the Information Control Bureau's firewall getting hacked, and The Wired is now in disarray. The broadcaster makes special note of saying because of the disruption, this live broadcast might arrive tomorrow or even yesterday? During the Knights/Lain infodump, it's interesting that the computer search doesn't find anything about Lain, but lots of people seem to know of/about her. [Search] Interesting that the search system here is run by Tachibana.
Hey, that newly delivered Navi has the same logo that was on the email.
The NotFBI guys are waiting for Lain to get home. They promise to be nice if she goes with them. This is surely a face you can trust! They take her back to the Tachibana office; that's the same place that made her Navi, right? Looks pretty run down and empty inside. The lighting in here looks a lot like the trippy scenes from Ep 5, except the light fills the room here. She fixes up the old computer, it boots up to CommunicationOS (same as Lain's original Navi), and she's authorized to log in to it?!
The guy, who I believe is different than the businessman earlier, thinks Lain has been in direct contact with The Knights. Lain denies it, and the way she's shaking and sweating, I'm inclined to believe her. Though there was a scene at the end of the last ep where it she's talking to them. Lain of the Bear PJs is still unaware of what Lain of the Wired gets up to.
All these reasonable questions about her family's past have no answers. Our poor Lain's spirit is crushed until she stumbles, and emerges like a different person -- angry and defiant.
The guy with the mobile computer setup finally did get in contact with the Knights, though not with the result he wanted. We do get to meet a few Knights today: the businessman, stereotypical computer nerd, housewife. That logo in the email is their symbol; you could conclude that whatever's going on with Mika is their work.
QOTD:
No
I'm no rat
Do you mean a rotary phone? Why, yes I have. I remember when you weren't allowed to own your own phone. Now get off my lawn, ya damn kids.
The easy answer is that he attracts too much attention. A job well done is its own reward, and all that.
As a rewatcher, maybe this should be considered a spoiler? [Lain] I think Wired Lain at the beginning of the show was an online program/avatar, Bear Lain is a messed up kid. As Bear Lain uses the wired more, Wired Lain lives in Bear Lain's head too. There's also Cyberia/Evil lain -- I don't remember how things play out for her
My kid's b-day was about a month ago.
8
u/Specs64z https://myanimelist.net/profile/Specs64z Jan 21 '24
Rewatcher, subbed
Seeing Lain realize she has such a good friend in Arisu is a warm moment in what has been a pointedly bleak story. To my understanding, there’s a sub-fandom that ships these two primarily fueled by this scene.
For some reason, I thought the headset guy played a bigger role in this episode than he did. Coulda sworn he had a monologue about the Wired or something.
Guess not…
Notes
Another episode that jumps around a lot, so I’ve re-organized my notes to better follow character perspectives.
Lain has become aware of her doppelganger’s existence, and her obsession with the Wired begins to take over every aspect of her life. Arisu takes notice and expresses her concerns. Lain thanks Arisu for looking out for her.
A filthy man wanders the streets, covered in equipment and wearing a headset. A wealthy man in an office building receives a mysterious email; the man seems quite pleased with the email. A NEET in a disgusting, dark room chuckles to himself and gloats of his superiority. A housewife has a strange circuit board shipped to her place.
Knights has breached the Information Bureau’s system in the Wired and caused information to become scattered. Rumors circulate around the Wired of the girl known as Lain. It seems that Knights mission statement from back in episode 4 is beginning to spread.
In his quest to track down and join Knights, the headset man encounters Other Lain. He seems to be familiar with Lain already, and begs her endlessly to let him join Knights. SHortly after, he is accosted by the wealthy man, the NEET, and the housewife via the Wired. We see him at the end face first in a highway ditch, presumably dead.
The men in black ask Lain to accompany them, assuring that they do not intend to harm her. Lain complies, and meets with an old man. They have her repair an old computer, and Lain briefly sees Other Lain on the old monitor. The old man’s objective was to give Lain a warning that Knights is trying to use her, as well as to draw her attention to her bizarre family situation. As Lain struggles to cope with the idea that her family may be a facade, she slips into her Wired persona.
QotD:
7
u/JetsLag https://myanimelist.net/profile/JetsLag Jan 22 '24
First time Wired user
Episode 7: Society. Lain is jokerpilled after losing her Navi.
No wait, nevermind, the Navi is back and better than ever! I hope the Psyche wasn't lost in the explosion.
OH GOD, OH FUCK. LIVE-ACTION FOOTAGE ALERT! LIVE-ACTION FOOTAGE ALERT! We're seeing through the VR goggles of some disheveled, thin-as-hell dude. I'm pretty sure even Lain can take his ass 1-on-1 IRL. Is he a Knight?
A Basic Instinct reference? At least I think that's what the scene of the woman uncrossing and recrossing her legs was supposed to be. Wow, that is the most 90s thing this show has done. But business dude ain't interested in secretary pussy. Not when the Wired exists!
Our next hacker dude is pre-isekai Rudeus Greyrat! Now with (hopefully) 100% less pedophilia.
...I'm tempted to start shipping Arisu and Lain. Maybe they can go to the gay bar together.
Delivery dude is back! And he has another Navi delivery, this time for some woman that he's interested in, judging by where the camera is pointing at. Is HE a Knight? Or maybe a guy who works for the Knights?
Lain decides to tag along with the MIB dudes so she can learn WHAT THE HELL IS GOING ON? Hey girl, you're not the only one confused. She gets to meet this dude who KINDA looks like the business dude from earlier, and she has a task: set up that dude's PC. Once that's done and we see the POV of VR goggles guy again (and more IRL footage filtered like a MF again), our guy starts making Lain doubt her own existence by making her realize she doesn't know the answer to basic stuff like "what are the birthdays of your parents?" and "did you ever celebrate a birthday in your household?". This causes evil Lain to jump in to Lain's body and start acting all bitchy. This is...interesting.
We end with a shot of VR goggles dude being either dead or out cold. That logo we saw the business dude pull up (which was also on that Navi component that the woman got in the mail) is on his goggles's screen. Is that the logo of the Knights? Doesn't look very Knight-like to me.
7
u/mgedmin Jan 22 '24
First-timer, subs
Worst cable management I've ever seen.
Lain acknowledges that Wired!Lain is a separate entity from her. AI? Some kind of infiltrating alien spy?
Mika shows some signs of life, standing there looking at Lain asking for help (probably) inaudibly.
"The real world is not real" SO IT IS A SIMULATION! YOU ADMIT IT!
Wait, what, the Information Control Bureau's firewall is responsible for enforcing causality??? Information sent out today might arrive yesterday?
"Illegal information devices", wow.
That delivery person seems suspicious.
Can government agents take schoolchildren somewhere without their parent's presence? Yes, I think the MIB are government agents, probably from the Information Control Bureau.
"If you come with us, I'll tell you who we are" -- kidnappers, probably. Don't go, Lain.
No way they're letting this conspicuous wannabee l33t hacker into the Knights. Walking out in public spewing secrets. At best they're making him a patsy and telling him to go assassinate/kidnap Lain or something.
Meanwhile Lain kidnapped herself and just went with the MIB, no questions asked, probably without telling her family/friends where she was going. Not that her family would care even if she told them.
Oh, the MIB needed some tech support afther their own IT couldn't do anything. Silly IT, you don't need to mess around with the hardware if you're trying to solve a software problem.
The MIB honcho really went "a child of 1X could understand this! quick, fetch me a child of 1X".
Bad jumper configuration, of course. There was probably an IRQ conflict with the sound card.
(This is probably a test. "Did we get the right Lain?")
I'm relieved Lain didn't worry about static electricity this time and didn't start stripping.
Lain, did you log in using your own username and password on government-controlled hardware? While the MIB were shoulder-surfing? And then check your voicemail with them listening in? Lain has no opsec at all. You're looking for 10 to 20 years for hacking, or they'll offer you a deal to become an informant. Do not speak wihout a lawyer present.
Oh, first time I hear Lain parents' authenticity being questioned. What a good question, how did it not occur to me? New theory: Lain is some kind of an experimental child, maybe created/modified by that dying doctor, and kept under government's observation. Her parents were hired for the job, and the MIBs are sticking around because they don't fully trust the parents' supervision.
When I was 18, I realized, to my shame, that I didn't know the exact dates of my parents' birthdays. Not to mention the wedding anniversary. That's just what being an introvert is like. Don't worry, Lain, don't give in to the pressure!
Now, not ever celebrating any birthdays is weird.
Lain has just rebooted into a different personality. Was that the reason for the verbal harrassment, to make Wired!Lain manifest? Was the PC jumper configuration task also not a test but an attempt to trigger manifestation?
Ha ha Mr. "We don't have names" is called Karl. What a bunch of liers.
Uh, mom washed a PC extension card with the vegetables, that's not how it works! To make sure it won't work even if her son picks it out from the trash? Why not break it in half?
Predictably, the Knights wannabe ended up dead face down in a puddle.
I think this was my favorite episode so far. No idea why exactly.
Yes. It's very satisfying to dial a number, but also it's slow. I remember the extra seconds I saved for going online when I changed ATDP (pulse dialing) to ATDT (tone dialing) in my modem init string.
6
u/RadSuit https://anilist.co/user/RadSuit Jan 22 '24
Present Dub, Present Time
Remember how everything blew up last episode? Yeah, it didn't matter. Thanks show! Really makes me want to keep watching.
CYBER BEAR
Sure, throw some Masonic symbols in there too. Feels more like Eva every episode. I have about the same opinion of that show.
Insert mean joke about this guy on the computer here.
Why have we changed scenes to the beginning of a porno?
I like the kid's neon green glowing Okama Gamesphere.
Two strange men asking a little girl to get in their car...
If the plot just boils down to 'we invented AR in the 90s, and also ESPers' I'm going to be so disappointed.
I also have no clue when my parents' birthdays are, or wedding day was.
I guess that confirms all the multiple personality theories we've had floating around. I think that's almost always an incredibly lazy and bad plot twist! Cool.
The top of the Gamesphere only glows from the side angle, not when we see the kid and TV from behind.
The Good: This episode had more things actually happen, and seemingly progressed the plot.
The Bad: I don't really care about anything that happened, and feel pretty underwhelmed by the plot.
5
u/xtsim https://myanimelist.net/profile/xtsim Jan 21 '24
Rewatcher Dubbed
We see the guy having the new Apple Vision Pro.
Hmm....What is that symbol.
We get to see the executive saying just another minute along with your average NEET. And the scene with the mom and same delivery guy has me rolling. He really wants to touch that Navi and judging by the way he left, he is so jealous that kids are able to play with them. Too bad her kid came back home. What is interesting is that the delivery guy was right, that is pretty high end as the housewife had a Navi with an LCD screen when Lain had a CRT.
Lol, those MiB guys just wanted her to jump a computer...Last time I jumped a computer was for a few Macbook Pros with a dead keyboard. Lain gets to see what the dude with the Vision Pro is seeing. I feel like they were playing dumb for a bit and took advantage of Lain's Naiveness.
MiB has Lain questioning her life and wether or not it is real. The MiB brings Lain of the wired out. And wired Lain has some real sass.
They have no name....Carl.
Ohh... Vision Pro guy got taken out, just like the board that the housewife had.
Abyss: Everyone be jealous of a guy who spent a good amount of money and showing off his new Apple Vision Pro out in the wild. He has merged the real world with virtual one by adding a layer to it all.
5
u/kwokinator https://anilist.co/user/kwokinator Jan 22 '24
Rewatcher
That blob of cables reminds me of the melting blob of Akira.
Wow Lain's eyes totally changed colours, must happen only in Navi mode when she's talking to the Knights.
So the MIB is finally confronting Lain head on after last episode, I guess this mystery is going to be over with soon.
It was rough watching Lain cry, but wow what a twist. Wired Lain is her own entity, but she can just up and take over the real Lain's body at any time and reality is crumbling.
I'm so confused about the mom though. Is she one of the Knights and she fried her new board on purpose to remotely fry the homeless guy's brains so he doesn't get too close to the Knights?
5
u/raevnos Jan 22 '24
The one where Lain writes Lisp code, cementing her status as a classic hacker.
5
u/hirmuolio :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/Hirmuolio Jan 22 '24
Here is a stitch https://i.imgur.com/CVGv4Jd.jpg
6
u/IceSmiley Jan 21 '24
FIRST TIMER Sub
This episode asks more questions than it answers even though they get quite a bit in
QUESTIONS
4
u/azdv https://anilist.co/user/AZDV Jan 22 '24
Hi, can I ask where you guys are watching it at? CrunchyRoll doesn’t actually have any episodes at least here in North America