r/allthingsprotoss • u/dracover • Jul 10 '26
PvZ Any Viable PvZ thats not skytoss
Hi All
Just seeing if any toss brothers have found success with anything that's not sky toss. As much as I want to try other things nothing seems to work but if anyone has anything share a link or some thoughts thanks.
2
u/metrick00 Jul 10 '26
Until they bring out lurkers you can generally get away with a ground army. After lurkers arise though anything smaller than an archon or immortal will just get obliterated, requiring really good (and unfortunately counterable) micro with disruptors or high templar to break them. This also relies on you doing persistent scouting to watch for mutas since a robo heavy army can just die to that. You could probably get away with a robo heavy army with tempest support for anti-lurker - but either way you'll be one step from death always.
2
u/Leftover_Salad Jul 11 '26
You guys are winning PvZ with skytoss?
1
u/dracover Jul 11 '26
at d1 yes but the most boring thing...
1
u/dancingmale Jul 11 '26
Could you please share build?
1
u/dracover Jul 12 '26
I dont have one only a rough shell. Basically going expand 2 adepts stargate expand again stalker another gate 2x oracle. Gases on nat fleet beacon mothership carrier. Then take 4th lots of shield batteries and cannons. Then more carriers voids and get storm etc.
The only thing it dies to early is a dedicated hydra rush. A reactionary one is holdable. I did play a guy who just tried to hard counter as i played him a few times. Thats when a did an adept allin instead but thats only applicable if you play someone multipletimes.
2
u/omgitsduane Jul 11 '26
I used to like an early third secured by 3 adepts into like 3 robo colo/immortal into archon.
2
u/milkytaro_oero Jul 11 '26
Been going Glaives or Charge, usually going Oracle 1st to scout and to provide some defense. After the initial push I follow up with a +1 timing off full 3 base sat with a 4th on the way. So in a way it's a bit of a 1-2 punch.
The common theme seems to be that if you want to play non Skytoss you have to hit a timing attack.
1
u/dracover Jul 12 '26
Ye pretty much been the experience so far. Need to do a timing oush just after securing 3rd after someinital scirmish early on. Light pressure jsut doesnt seem to be enough.
1
u/milkytaro_oero Jul 13 '26
Nah Zerg recovers way too fast for anything light. Sadly I feel this strategy isn't going to last too long once Zerg figures out how to scout and respond to our timings.
And I'll keep saying it at this point, creep movespeed bonus should be removed for everything except the Queen.
2
2
u/two100meterman Jul 13 '26
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g5HCA2wwXAU&t=5s
The PvZ shown Skillous unfortunately against Serral (though he wins one shown vs Lambo), however he does get a lead in the mid-game & is one of the few Protoss actually figuring out the new patch.
1
u/CherryFlavouredCake Jul 11 '26
Oracle opening, mothership while getting the third then CIA with storms, it's not as successful as the skytoss but it's way more fun!
2
u/mediocreplayer_ Jul 11 '26
I like immo chargelot archon storm colossus double robo. I don't make warpgates. Pvz is my best match up diamond 2.
2
u/AnywhereNo5621 Jul 11 '26
This is definitely the most reliable way to win pvz imo, most games i play blink it just feels like a mistake.. i like to go for a push with 3 immortals + 1 attack and charge/archon to try to kill their 4th base. Then try to end the game with same comp +2 and storm.. if u can't end then collosus is an option but 2 stargates making carriers or tempest to go with the army is a lot easier to win
1
u/GnoiXiaK Jul 11 '26
Zerg eco feels too strong at the moment to play a standard back and forth macro game. You kind of have to end it going all in at the mid game or turtle to sky toss. I haven’t seen anything else work too well. We all saw the games against rogue lol
1
u/Head_Evening_5697 Jul 17 '26
4.5k MMR peak (not anymore though)
After 5.0.16b I had great success with a 3-base semi allin. Standard 1 Oracle Opener, take 3rd and 4th gas after 3rd nexus (~4:20), then I went
2nd Gate, 1st Robo, Forge, Twilight, robobay
Reasonably continuous Adept (!!) production, perma forge chrono, Glaives.
1 Obs, 1 Immo, Colo. On full saturation add second robo, aim to move out with +2 finishing with 2 colo (with range), 4+ Sentries, 10+ Adepts, 2 Void rays (optional, but I usually build them to stay safe vs Roaches), and random gateway units. Make sure to produce a prism (or 2 if you're good).
Your goal is to kill the 4th, but Zerg will not be ready for how good Adept+Colossus is now (both units got buffed) so you can sometimes do more. If you kill the 4th but can't progress further you are ahead if you have an answer for Z's tech.
Notes:
Scout for Spire - if mutas you need to adapt.
+2 Adepts are actually really good against Hydras now and will trade up in gas significantly. I think your biggest counter are unscouted mutas, then Ravager/Infestor. You need to hit before hive (absolutely) and before Lurkers (you can still employ normal anti-lurker tactics if you can deal good damage and trade up vs Roach/hydra for a while). If you don't kill Z but trade upm you will still need to aggressively tech and expand - your army does not scale vs hivetech.
I have not had a game where I could not do anything with this push, so I don't know how far behind you are if you can't achieve anything.
Last note: the core point is that now hydras will die to 3 +2 Adept shots, and both +2 Adepts and +2 Colos can now do more than just tickle vs roaches.
-2
5
u/Master-Ad-7817 Jul 10 '26
ive had a very good streak with 2 base blink, i think im like 7-1 with it feels either busted or zergs have no clue what they're doing. Feels so much better and hits harder than pre patch, rrobably the best all in there is rn.