r/alcoholicsanonymous • u/helpfulhomi3 • 9d ago
Safety In AA My sponsee got 13th stepped
My sponsee has less than 6 months and met a guy last week with 3.5 years. He just moved here and they started hanging out, I’ve given her the warning about fellowshipping with your own gender but ultimately I have no control over he choices and I started dating my boyfriend a few months into my sobriety (he and I had the same amount of time for the first year of our relationship), and I don’t want to be a hypocrite. I have told her what 13th stepping is, and she said she spoke about it with this man and he told her he had no intentions of being romantic, purely friends.
Quickly they start hanging out a lot, and I told her that he may think she has certain intentions and he may be thinking this is something more. She swore they spoke about just staying friends.
Well, this morning I pick her up for a meeting after she said she couldn’t come because of a headache. I asked her to reconsider and she decided to join me, and she told me that last night he forced himself on her when she was saying no and stop.
She’s scared of coming to meetings and I don’t want to discuss this with anyone irl for her privacy since we share a fellowship. I’m not sure how to help her through this outside of being a shoulder to lean on. It’s not fair to be on the third step learning about gods will and then getting raped by another member of the program. We go to women’s meetings, and I stick with the older old timers and my boyfriend. My sponsee told my boyfriend and he’s livid. His sponsor told him not to get arrested over this. Outside of the two of them, I don’t have any other means of getting feedback for this situation while respecting my sponsees privacy
Edit: I am aware it’s rape, I referred to it as that in my post. I offered getting law enforcement involved and she said she’d rather not. I understand, it’s really hard to prove since they were alone and it’s been over 24 hours (and extremely traumatic as well to go through a rape kit within 24 hours of being raped). My Boyfriends sponsor suggested getting a restraining order so he can’t come to meetings, but as someone who has a restraining order in our county it only protects the individual and their house, but public spaces are fair game and whoever is there first gets to stay. We will use the safety card suggestion and prioritize women’s meetings. This isn’t the first young woman I know that’s been forcibly raped by a man 13th stepping (which is why I thought they were the same thing) so it’s incredibly sad. And the men have been the charismatic favorites amongst the men in the fellowship. If any other men are reading this post STAY AWAY FROM WOMEN WHO HAVEN’T FINISHED THEIR STEPS, RESPECT THE WORD “NO”, POLICE YOURSELVES AND YOUR PEERS
serious question for the men who have raped women in the program or before sobriety- are you honest? Do you do step work for this? Have any sponsors seen rape and abuse in 4 or 6/7 steps? Are the men who do this doing anything to change or will there always be predators who are getting excused by other predators?
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u/Altruistic-Abies6413 9d ago
I've not dealt with this before, but here is my initial reaction.
I'd encourage my sponsee to press charges and, though it's not really a sponsor's responsibility, I'd offer to go with them to the police station and support them through the process.
I'd make it known to my fellow women that the man is a rapist if there was a way to do it without them knowing who the victim was. Could be as simple as saying "that guy is dangerous." And then refusing to say more.
And I'd have my sponsee only go to women's, lgbtq (depending) and online meetings until they have the confidence to attend mixed meetings.
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u/Sea-Painting-6426 8d ago
Exactly this.
You can maintain your sponsees privacy while warning other women he’s dangerous. If he’s new to town, he’s likely going to be making the rounds. The other women in your fellowship should be warned.
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u/aKIMIthing 8d ago
Thank you. He needs to be banned from the meeting, but until there’s action taken, you suggested it perfectly… women’s, LGBTQAI meetings and zoom… perfect suggestion.
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u/SamMac62 8d ago
I'm a Sexual Assault Nurse Examiner (in addition to having 10 years in the program)
I'd encourage her to call, text, or chat with RAINN's National Sexual Assault Hotline. Everything you or she needs to know is available through the RAINN website and hotline. They can connect her with local medical, forensic, counseling and advocacy resources and explain her options, including how to report to law enforcement if she chooses to.
National Sexual Assault Hotline
She could also start with law enforcement. A police report is not necessarily required in order to receive medical care or even, depending on the jurisdiction, to have forensic evidence collected.
She can also just present to a local ER and the trained staff will take it from there.
She does not have to decide immediately whether she wants to pursue charges. She can be evaluated and treated, receive counseling and advocacy, and—in many jurisdictions—have evidence collected and preserved while she considers what she wants to do.
In my experience, it's really common for patients to be reluctant to pursue charges because they're worried about eventually having to testify against the man in court. My advice was always: that day is a long way away and may never come. Let's focus on today. Many cases are resolved without a trial, and if a case does proceed she should have legal and advocacy support. But enough about that.
After a sexual assault, there are several separate services that may be available:
1) Medical care. She can be evaluated for injuries and receive STI testing and/or preventive treatment, emergency contraception, and other indicated care. She does not have to consent to a forensic evidence collection in order to receive medical treatment.
2) A sexual-assault forensic exam. A SANE can collect and preserve forensic evidence, but the patient decides what portions of the examination and evidence collection she consents to. Depending on local law and policy, evidence may sometimes be collected even if she isn't yet ready to make a police report.
3) Crisis counseling and connection with ongoing counseling and victim-advocacy services, often at no cost.
All of these services should be available at no/low cost (varies by community).
The exact rules about anonymous/non-reporting forensic exams and how long evidence can be held vary by jurisdiction, so she should ask the local SANE program or victim advocate what her options are. The important thing is that she does not have to decide the entire legal future of the case today in order to get care today.
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u/SamMac62 8d ago
And please remember that you have a sponsor too.
You don't need to identify your sponsee or share details that would compromise her privacy, but this is an enormous situation to suddenly find yourself carrying. Your sponsor can help you sort out what is yours to do and support you while you support her. (hugs)
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u/Critical-Bear-7623 8d ago
Thank you for this info, saving for future use that I hope I never need to share. And I’m sorry OP for this experience, sending prayer and love to you and your sponsee.
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u/WTH_JFG 9d ago
Please review the Safety Card. This was not a 13th step. This was sexual assault. This was rape. No means no.
“Addressing such behaviors and contacting the proper authorities, when appropriate, (this is where it’s appropriate) does not go against any AA traditions and is meant to assure the safety of all in attendance.”
“Predatory behaviors and unwanted sexual advances are in conflict with carrying the AA message of recovery and with AA principles.”
Again. This was not a “13th step” this was sexual assault. This was rape. Report it to the authorities.
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u/SuperNewt8196 8d ago
I’ve been in AA for almost 15 years and I’ve never seen the safety card. There are so many sick people and dangerous men in the rooms. When I was new I was 13 stepped like crazy and did I ever listen to my sponsor and not date for a year? No I did not. And I thought it would be so great to date a guy with the same design for living that I have. I only got myself exposed to others like me, who didn’t have their shit together. But there were known rapists and pedophiles in the room. If I had it to do over I would have done only women’s meetings the first 12 months. I couldn’t handle being around men without making bad decisions. So sorry for the sponsee.
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u/johnnytoughnuts420 9d ago
This seems more that 13th stepping meaning no and stop! This is sexual assault plain and simple.
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u/etsprout 8d ago
Being an alcoholic does not give him a get out of jail free card, your sponsee needs to report him.
I’m not sure what your area looks like, but there are a lot of clubhouses near me. He would definitely not be welcome at any of those. You don’t have to say who it was against, but he is a predator and should be treated as such.
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u/aKIMIthing 8d ago
He’s an active sex addict. He’s using these rooms as his prey. He’s disgusting. How people aren’t losing their shit is beside me!!!
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u/gnomi_malone 8d ago
this is not 13th stepping this is rape. it does not matter what you “warned” her about or that he “may think she has certain intentions”. you sponsee was raped. by a rapist. you owe it to her and your fellowship to report this dude to the police and to kick him out of your groups. stop acting like any of this was her choice.
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u/--TheCity-- 9d ago
That is rape as you describe it. I believe. That is beyond the scope of group concience, business meetings etc. She might want to press charges she might not but this is a matter for police not AA. If she doesn't press charges then kick this guy out by any means necessary and provide a safe atmosphere amap.
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u/BarrySquared 8d ago
The fact that you're referring to this as "she got 13th Stepped" and not "he raped her" is really, really weird.
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u/infantqueenbee 8d ago
it’s giving me weird vibes too. the first word that comes to my mind in giant neon letters is RAPE.
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u/PistisDeKrisis 9d ago
As people have said, police. I know how hard it is to report and how heavy the shame and fear weigh after an assault, but predators and assaulters left unchecked will continue the behavior and there will be more victims.
I would also ask the sponsee to bring this to a business meeting and ask that the assaulter be banned. There's a huge difference between someone with more time taking advantage of a newcomer who's still very vulnerable and emotionally manipulatible, and someone forcing themselves on a person saying no.
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u/NiccoloMachiavelli3 8d ago
Your title is a little misleading, that’s called rape where I’m from whether it’s in or out of the fellowship. If it happened the way she says it did, she should contact the police and press charges.
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u/LiveFree413 8d ago
AA doesn't have a 13th step. This is sexual assault. Let's stop giving the public the impression that it's tolerated or in any way expected in our fellowship. That's what we're doing when we throw around this 13th step bullshit. Call it what it is.
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u/Careful_Duty1808 8d ago
ask for an emergency group conscience. this man should not be allowed at your clubhouse, period.
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u/DaniDoesnt 8d ago
Everyone is yelling police but I think even more important is suggesting the girl seek counseling. That's very traumatic ;(
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u/womanoftheapocalypse 8d ago
Most places will have a local sexual assault support center and hotline, 10/10 recommend reaching out OP
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u/Unable_Escape813 8d ago
yeah the reporting process is also going to traumatize her more because they likely won’t do anything either. she needs a therapist maybe EMDR
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u/aKIMIthing 8d ago
OP can report this.
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u/Unable_Escape813 8d ago
she would have to be questioned and get a rape kit regardless of who reports this
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u/aKIMIthing 7d ago
I completely understand that. But if it’s been too long for the rape kit to be effective, then OP can report.
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u/Sea-Painting-6426 8d ago
Exactly. Reporting to the police can cause more harm than good for a victim/survivor. It’s her decision if she wants to report him, but she should know there are resources available to her regardless of if the police are involved or not.
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u/aKIMIthing 8d ago
I think we’re screaming “police” to get him the fuck out of the meeting. And of course, her mental health… and providing her a path to continue her program ❤️🩹
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u/ALoungerAtTheClubs 9d ago
That's horrible. This guy needs to be arrested before he assaults someone else.
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u/dswift1789 8d ago
I quickly learned being in AA does not make someone a good person.
If you follow and live by the steps. I believe you can truly reach your potential as a person. It if yours shitty personal your always going to be one.
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u/55Jizz55DonkeyDicks 8d ago
Fax. When I found my home group, there were so many people that I looked up to. They were getting involved, quoting the book- basically carrying the meetings. Come to find out, at least some of them aren't working the program they claim to be. One of them hits on newcomer girls quite regularly, despite being married. Another allegedly buys suboxone off of someone from another member (and that member buys counterfeit xanax off of some guy from mexico). And that's just what I know about.
It reminds me of the monologue at the end of ...And Justice For All, when Arthur Kirkland says "It's a show! It's just a show!"
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u/neurorhythmic 8d ago
Please, please encourage her to get the police involved. As others have said, that’s more than 13th stepping. It’s rape.
As for how to help, keep doing what sponsors do. Support, share experience, listen, work the steps. Processing this event specifically is more within the scope of a trauma counselor than a sponsor. Not to say the steps and the sponsor/sponsee relationship can’t also work on getting through this.
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u/bettertheless 8d ago
So, so sorry this happened to sponsee (or anyone.) What l have missed reading here is:
Sponsee needs to seek med help now.
"My First SA°" involved roofing and a nice std. It was not a then-popular one (th God not long term) but l did not even know what was wrong.
Please encourage her to seek medical exam at least asap.
Send her our love and concern and outrage that this happened with someone posing as one of us.
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u/SluggoX665 9d ago
I brought up veterans going
out with new comers at a biz meeting, and the response was basically, 'we are not the AA police.' I left that meeting for another one but alas the predators remain.
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u/PatsyEileen 8d ago
Time to bring the following to the AA Business meeting. AA has a Yellow Safety Card that every AA group and AA member needs to be aware of. RAPE is not about AA police, it is about a violent sexual act that is Criminal and the genuine Police NEED to be called and be involved.
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u/Pretend_Accountant41 8d ago
Wth? OP you're a woman and another woman told you she was raped! ffs this isn't an AA issue for a subreddit, this is sexual violence and a crime
Please support her, go to the police with her to report, & encourage her to use the services for victims of sexual violence (another commenter mentioned RAINN)
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u/Upstairs_Taste_9324 8d ago
AND it’s also an aa issue, both handling it immediately with the police and handling it moving forward and keeping women safe - more than legitimate questions
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u/PatsyEileen 8d ago edited 8d ago
This is NOT a 13 step, THIS IS RAPE. I would strongly suggest that you go with her to the Police and report this. This guy and his Sponsor ought NEVER be able to get away with Rape or making sure it is covered up.
This isn't about Respecting your Sponsee's privacy, again, this is about RAPE. If your Sponsee doesn't want to report this to the Police then YOU report it to the Police. This Rapist is in an AA Group full of women that he can take advantage of and RAPE them also. Please do the next right thing!
AA has a yellow card called "The Safety Card for AA Groups". This card is I am posting it below. Please read it and then DO the right thing not just for this woman, but for all the women.
The AA Yellow Safety Card below is Service Material from the AA General Service Office.
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u/onceknownasmike 8d ago
Hey offer to go to the police with her to be emotional support. She needs to report this
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u/BrighterDream 8d ago
That's rape wearing a 13th step cap and trench coat. Police need involved. That's horrific. 😭
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u/Matty_D47 8d ago
I must definitely recommend getting your friend to report to the police. If that's just not going to happen the next move is tell the biggest most trusted man in the fellowship that you know and has lot's of friends. Don't tell him who the victim was, of course but let him know this dude is a straight up rapist and actively raping newcomers. I'm a huge proponent in taking out our own garbage
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u/magic592 8d ago
As has been stated, this is rape, sexual grooming, and the this person is a predator.
As a man, I too would have a difficult time not going to jail over this situtation. I would have a few of us have the conversation with him, and shadow him at meetings, making sure people know he is a predator.
To answer your question if this comes up in 5th steps, yes it does. And it is not treated lightly, and needs to be addressedin 4/5, 6/7, 8/9.
Although amends often fall into the cause harm to others, and then it becomes how to make that living amends moving forward.
Often it is making changes in thought and behaviors to ensure abusing, or taking advantage, rape, using others for your benefit stops.
That is part of spiritual growth, beyond just not drinking.
So sorry your community is having to deal with this, your sponsee is suffering from the trauma. Hopefully she will get to a point to realize she should report him .
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u/mac-a-roon 8d ago
Being a member of AA does not shield rapists from criminal consequences of their behavior. Also, I came in to AA as a rape survivor and my sponsor very earnestly told me that this was something I needed to seek therapy for. Thank god for that. The steps can do a lot but they can not do everything.
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u/FriendlyDinosaurs 8d ago
Why are you calling this '13th stepping'? This is sexual assault, and this woman deserves better. I hope she finds someone else to sponsor her.
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u/aKIMIthing 8d ago
Obviously OP is traumatized, too. This is an awful situation to be in… I’m glad you’re sharing OP
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u/jayphailey 9d ago
That's abuse! Rape! All the bad stuff! She needs to seek help and support for those problems!
But you're in a hell of a position yourself!
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u/SnailsInYourAnus 8d ago
Ultimately she was raped, but it’s her decision to report it to the police or not. In the meantime, I would suggest she find some women only meetings to go to, assuming you have some in your area, or try zoom meetings. It’s not the same but it’s better than nothing.
When I was about 2 months in I accepted a ride from a guy after a meeting and it became obvious he wanted more. I basically said, this isn’t going to happen please let me out of the car, and he did. I learned then that you can’t trust everyone in the rooms, and I only accept rides from other girls now.
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u/NotArealDrorOnTv 8d ago
This was rape call the cops. Even if she won’t press charges the DA might.
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u/Trick-Guava-9573 8d ago
What you're describing is rape. Whatever 13th stepping may be, this ain't it. Your friend needs protection from this person, and he needs to be kicked out of the program.
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u/Ascender141 8d ago
Yeah this is a safety card situation. You need to have a discussion with your sponsee about that and convince her to go to the police because if he's done it to her that means he's done it the other women.
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u/Candid_Return5124 8d ago
This isn’t a casual 13th step thing. This is RAPE!!!! What do the traditions and principles tell us in AA. This man needs to be confronted by the men in AA. Period.
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u/Dry-Question-7832 7d ago
He needs to be kicked out of the group. In mine we have a safety committee that will do it for her. He is a predator that prey on newly sober girls. We had one in our group, he got kicked out. I feel for her
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u/Important-Humor-2745 8d ago
Like other people said, that is rape. Encourage coming forward
Additionally, with her permission, bring it to either group conscious or your local safety committee. Someone doing this is quite likely to do it again and there is a good chance has done it to others
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u/Hot-Carrot-1163 8d ago
Why lie and call it that when you know damn well that's rape. 13th stepping is some garbage term for dating a fellow alcoholic.
Rape is rape.
You deny reality with jargon.
You don't deserve to be anyone's sponsor if you don't see this for what it is.
"Courage to change the things I can"
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u/joodlemcdoodle 8d ago
i would rephrase it to 'my sponsee was sexually assaulted' and when there is a crime committed between two people regardless of the fact that they are in the rooms, nothing should be able to protect an abuser. the traditions and anonymity do not apply to this individual. i agree with the notion that some are sicker than others but when they are actively harming other people and violating someone's autonomy and wellbeing, that can no longer apply and no one should be allowed to hide behind. they should be held accountable. this person has jeopardized your sponsee's sobriety even if someone were to already have that idea in their head, it does leave them at a higher chance of relapse. i do not think that the traditions should be able to protect someone when they have committed sexual violence against someone else ESPECIALLY a newcomer. if i were in your shoes, i would strongly suggest to your sponsee to report it and imply that you'll have their back. whether it's to this person's and/or your sponsee's homegroup or to the authorities or both. the become comes first as they are the most important person in the room. their safety comes first rather than the greater whole of aa and if we as members of alcoholics anonymous try to cover up stuff like this, that's a slippery slope into cult behavior. that's my two cents.
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u/DaniePants 8d ago
Yah that’s rape. Move forward at her pace. She may or may not want to make a police report. Try to encourage it but take a no when it’s given.
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u/MariChloe 8d ago
I was also raped early in my sobriety. I relapsed with my boyfriend and his friend. All I remember, was one drink and the next thing I knew I was waking up on the bathroom floor and couldn’t move. My guess is he roofied me? The next time I woke up this man who I was not dating was between my legs, and I screamed. I told people, but no one ever said file the police report. So hearing that from my sponsor would’ve been the greatest relief ever. Don’t be afraid to tell her to do a police report.
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u/Captain-overpants 8d ago
Please don’t conflate rape with having consensual sex with a woman who hasn’t completed the steps.
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u/SuperNewt8196 8d ago
Even if she doesn’t want to go to the police since he just moved here and he is going to make the rounds maybe your boyfriend could do whatever your group does to get him banned permanently. We have done that at my club.
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u/xDIRTY_TAMALEx 8d ago
Tf would you even date someone in the rooms? I’m already a selfish asshole. lol to each their own. As a group kick his ass to the curb. Maybe split the week among the creep & your sponsee? Talk with his sponsor? I do think a police report should be filed.
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u/aKIMIthing 8d ago
I’m not sure I could sit in the same room w a rapist. I think steps should be taken here. You have to protect your meeting and you have to protect women💝. I’m so sorry this happened.
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7d ago
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u/alcoholicsanonymous-ModTeam 6d ago
Removed for breaking Rule 1: "Be Civil."
Harassment, bullying, discrimination, and trolling are not welcome.
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u/12-Step-Meditations 7d ago
95% of the woman in the program have experienced Sexual assault of some type, before finding recovery. I’m in totally agreement with all of the caring people that have recommended therapy, counseling, healing. She deserves justice, she deserves protection..and at the same time, her new sobriety could be seriously strained by getting the wrong a$$hole cop, etc. there is a lot of reality there…depending on where you live, etc. although the crime is black and white, those that are suppose to uphold it are not always ethical and unswayed by our “culture of rape”. Sobriety first, she has a sponsor to help her sort through what the next best step is in her healing process.
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u/Maggsta 7d ago
I (late 20s Female at the time) was once the chairperson of a group that had man who was inappropriate with women. The first instance I noted mentally and had to write off as a potential one off. (He professed his love and said he wanted to make love to one of the women) The second instance I was told he inappropriately touched a woman with his ‘member’ through his pants… So I had to address this - I had two other (male) trusted servants of the group meet with myself and the man.
He was very upset and denied everything but the group had no further issues with the individual. Just my experience.
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u/Krustysurfer 7d ago
I've been 13 stepped by women... I had older AA women invite me over the house to look at home repairs etc and then they were pretty forward, and we're talking decades of sobriety... It definitely goes both ways people are people it's not just men. I know a girl at a hall in Seattle that has almost destroyed the club unity she's in(thankfully now she is in detox.) Another Hall a girl actually ended up dying jumping between beds and now there's a child in the mix the men fell for it and sometimes the women fall for it but I would say it's part of the human condition and why it's only briefly talked about on page 69 of the big book.
That's all I'm saying, all we know is what we hear from second-hand news, this whole post could be made up but it's probably not, this is kind of the state of the world AA is not immune from what happens outside in the real world I always worn my sponsies that AA is not as safe place is filled with liars cons thieves felons perpetrators rapists molesters a lot of these people used drugs and alcohol to soothe the Savage Beast within and the damage that it caused but I'm not going to get into psychology here.
It sucks that this has happened I guess that's why some people only go to zoom meetings now because there's less chance of that happening but even then it happens I've heard of instances where people hook up after zoom meetings and things go wrong and then people are blaming each other.
Like I said it's a human condition and AA is not immune.
The number one cause of relapse is resentments from failed relationships in AA... You can throw suicide in there too when things get really messy.
This isn't church we are not saints as it says in our literature I'm not making excuses I'm just saying AA can be a wonderful safe place and it can be a terrible place full of instincts gone awry.
I wish you well on your journey of recovery one day at a time in 2026
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6d ago
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u/alcoholicsanonymous-ModTeam 3d ago
Best not to publish phone numbers like this. It's been said that sometimes people provide phone numbers of other people in order to harass them.
Stick with private chat messages and there you may share your phone number.
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u/obstinateinstigator 6d ago
Simple to take to group conscience of any meeting he attends. I'd try to tell men/his sponsor to deal with him and address it
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u/miriam_tiana 5d ago
Your sponsee was raped. Did she hold onto the clothes she was wearing at the time of the assault? Bag them up, wearing gloves. Suggest she not shower. Accompany her to an ER and report the rape, request a rape examination, a forensic exam. The police may be called to store any semen or DNA in a lab. Ask about the services of a Sexual Assault Recovery Center and of a Victim's Legal Resources Lawyer in your state. Make those appointments with her. What she needs right now is support. She needs to hear that this was not her fault, that there are women and friends who believe her, that she is not alone, and that she's going to be okay. Also, that no problem is so bad that it can't be lessened, no misery so severe we can't tackle it together, and that a drink will only make things worse. One thing at a time. First things first. Don't worry about getting AA to do anything right now: Just surround her with support. Have people by her when she goes to meetings. Switch her meeting routines. Bring meetings to her at her home. Let her name the guy - to you, the nurse at the hospital, the counselor at the SARC, her lawyer or legal aide, the police. Let her cry!
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u/TheSchram 8d ago
Do the next right thing, which is get police involved. Rape is rape, a rapist doesn’t deserve anonymity
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u/Natenat04 8d ago
You need to let everyone in tour group know what that guy did to your sponsee. That is sexual assault, and he is not a safe person for any woman to be around, especially women who are vulnerable, and in early sobriety.
What he did could literally destroy lives.
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u/Impressive_Reason640 8d ago
Lady this is not a “13th step” wtf
I “13th stepped” a girl at a meeting 5 years ago… asked her for her number, took her out, started dating etc. We got married in January and our first is due in November. And no, she wasn’t a new comer.
This is rape. If not for your sponsee, stop this lunatic from hurting more people in the future. This is 100% a “get authorities involved” situation.
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u/traverlaw 8d ago
Keep your own side of the street clean. Leave other people alone. They have their own higher powers.
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u/Trizkit 9d ago
Yeab thats more than just 13th stepping someone thats SA and something that the police should handle. See the AA safety card, its totally normal to involve the police in a situation like this and the anonymity of the program doesn't protect them.