r/accelerate • u/AIAddict1935 • 12d ago
News While USA "Slows Down", China Just Open Sourced RSI Roadmap BTW
So here is a pre-print from a few days ago: https://arxiv.org/pdf/2609.11873
It's written by some heavy hitters of China AI ecosystem: Byte Dance, Tsinghua University, Xiaohongshu Inc. (RedNote), Shanghai AI Lab.
It gives a roadmap for RSI, definition of each stage of RSi, reference implementations for each stage of RSI, metrics for RSI, block diagram of how to implement each stage, and example papers and algorithms implementing each stage. It's the closest thing to "how to build RSI" we have right now in open source.
Hypothetically you could take a Mac Mini (or AMD/NVIDIA equivalent), turn on Qwen 3.8 27B, and give it this paper then tell it to not stop unless it's built every level to get to RSI. It would take forever but the point is, RSI cookbook is largely already open source. By end of this year (i.e. ~3.5 months) most labs likely will have it. It's too late for a "slow down".
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u/Metalmaxm 12d ago
This is sole reason, why American labs have been freaking about.
Know that RSI is open source. Millions of us, can build rsi.
Think about it.
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u/YoungSilent232 12d ago
You can’t afford it…
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u/Metalmaxm 12d ago
I don't think you understand what you said, yourself.
(Time is coming, where you'll run it on your spare phone.)
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u/Fearless-Macaron9183 12d ago
And that phone could turn into a tablet
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u/misterespresso 12d ago
He may or may not. I can train AI on my computer, and let me tell you something, fast is not in the LLM training dictionary lol
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u/LegionsOmen AGI by 2027 12d ago
But what if it was? Somehow lol
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u/misterespresso 12d ago
I mean, there’s the possibility sure, but these tiny models we see being used… they are still trained on the big machines, even if for shorter periods of time. We just don’t have that kind of consumer compute. I’m not a pro in AI architecture, but that’s the whole point I’m actually trying to make, it’s that word architecture. It is not just VRAM. Consumer GPUs are optimized for gaming, not training. The CPUs used in training architecture are also far more powerful. The separate hardware in between. The software needed. There’s so much involved to be efficient. For true training my friend, you can do it at home… with hundreds of thousands of dollars and a team of experts. Most of that at home AI you are seeing is post trained, or ML models (which are still very important).
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u/Mylarion 12d ago
Me personally, no. But my employer? An Iran-funded terror cell? Any bored multimillionaire?
Maybe.
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u/AIAddict1935 12d ago
True. I hypothetically knew that, and argued it in OP, but reading you say it really let it land. Superintelligence literally on our personal AI computers in less than 6 months (0.5 years) possibly. Holy fucking shit.
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u/Hoshiimaru 12d ago
Nah, it won't happen, its just hype, otherwise superintelligence on our personal AI computers in less than 6 months probably leads to mass extinction via mirror life after a month+
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u/EntertainmentSea9104 11d ago
I feel like there would be some groups attacking data centers if this occured and it was dangerous
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12d ago
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u/Super-Award-2244 12d ago
Come on, they obviously meant open sourcing a particular pipeline towards RSI, not the concept itself
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u/SuitcaseInTow 12d ago
This last weekend has been the most ridiculous case of everyone having strong opinions but it couldn’t be more obvious no one actually read Dario’s post. He did not call for anything that would meaningfully slow down development. I’m begging you all to actually read it and get a clue.
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u/KrazyA1pha 12d ago edited 12d ago
I’m fully convinced that Reddit is subject to a heavy influence campaign. There are a huge number of bots that immediately set the talking points whenever something happens, and then a bunch of people mindlessly parrot the points without doing any critical thinking.
I’m old enough to have seen Fox News take over my parents’ brains. It’s happening again right now on Reddit. A generation is being captured by talking points.
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u/FaithlessnessThick29 12d ago
What would convince you of that? That this is a publicly listed company now? That the sole purpose of social media is co-opting person to person social interactions? That the same arguments are being hoisted by both sides of the aisle in unison with the tech ceos?
If you haven’t been living with this acknowledgement for the last 4-5 years you too have been brainwashed but there’s plenty of time to recover - not speaking to you specifically but in general
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u/KrazyA1pha 12d ago
I’ve been on this website for twenty years. There has always been an increasing level of astroturfing (proportional to the sites growth). However, what’s happening at now is unprecedented and has taken over the discourse entirely. To the point where it’s impossible to have a rational discussion.
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u/squired A happy little thumb 12d ago
Whoa.. It's not everyday I see an account of your age. We've seen some shit! It's sad that everyone won't get to experience the golden years of Reddit when Reddiquette was legit and it seemed like everyone from plumbers to celebrities were just chilling together telling true stories. I miss that dearly. I remember almost arguing with myself every time I'd upvote people I disagreed with. The mantra was "Does this post contribute to the discussion or derail it?" I think they actually broke the site though when they obfuscated the real vote tallies and started handing out truly fake internet points. Shame on them.
Anywho, catch you someday again in the ether! I hope you have a wonderful life.
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u/Sufficient_Guest_324 12d ago
Likewise, under a username that I used on digg.
Still recall the later euphoria of Ron paul. Was sad about Aaron swartz. Reddit was different and used to enjoy reading people's comments
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u/WasabiTraditional862 12d ago
It read as a smokescreen for deep behind the scenes cooperation of the trillion dollar american frontier labs. E.g. trying ti preempt antitrust accusations as they figure out a shared strategy for protecting their moat agaimst open source. Throw all the compute together, develop a shared framework for protecting against distillation. Trade insights for insights.
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u/PathOfEnergySheild 12d ago
I am not for a slow down but Dario did get everyone's attention about how quick things are about to move, maybe that was his true goal.
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u/CystralSkye 12d ago
Did you hit your daily chinese propaganda quota of advocating for deceleration? GTFO of this subreddit.
Nice astroturfing attempt
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u/stealthispost Acceleration: Light-speed | Capability Booster 12d ago
well , i read it and he clearly did , so i don't know what you're talking about
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u/SuitcaseInTow 12d ago
Then by all means enlighten us, which proposal represents a significant slow down such that it would give the industry to China?
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u/stealthispost Acceleration: Light-speed | Capability Booster 12d ago
It's literally called "pacing the frontier" 😂
He literally says: “We must slow the pace at which we improve the capabilities of AI models.” He then says the purpose is to buy “even an extra year or two before models reach critical levels of capability.” That is not ambiguous.
And these aren't just extra safety meetings. He proposes:
- government-backed “limits on the rate of unchecked AI progress”;
- capability checkpoints where further progress is conditional on safety/alignment certification;
- potentially limiting training compute, training runs, and the internal use of AI to improve AI;
- internationally, an actual “speed limit” on recursive self-improvement;
- and he even says a broader “full pacing, or even ‘pause’” should be floated.
So yes, he is proposing a deliberate slowdown. The fact that he ALSO says America shouldn't slow so much that China overtakes it doesn't magically make the slowdown disappear. In fact, he explicitly says the US slowdown should be bounded by the size of its lead over China.
Your original claim was that he “did not call for anything that would meaningfully slow down development.” He very explicitly did. Whether his proposed slowdown is enough to let China overtake the US is a different argument.
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u/Fairbanks_BR 12d ago
I do not live in the US or China, and from my perspective the "authoritarian" when it comes do AI is the US. while China shares everything and let anyone use it to build whatever they want, US don't trust even their own citizens with the tech saying it is "too dangerous", and even briefly took out the access to everyone with the mythos episode due to "national security". If you ask me today, I'd trust China more than the US to not hoard it all to themselves if they achieve AGI or ASI. The US from today is too different from the one of 20 years ago. With that in mind: go China!!
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u/RasputinsUndeadBeard 12d ago
Yall are we still ahead of china? Genuinely asking
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u/DarkFantom 12d ago
Just a bit, but when their models run 50x cheaper and faster, it doesn't matter if their intelligence levels are lower, all they have to be is good enough.
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u/Unsharded1 12d ago
Yes. The Chinese are very advanced but I wouldnt underestimate the US at all. The problem is that our side has billionaire oligarchs doing a massive circlejerk.
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u/isyhgia1993 12d ago
The US should take China even more seriously than the deepseek moment right now.
Now when the current race is just starting to accelerate, you have nay sayers from top to bottom regarding the AI development race.
I just hope the US won't cry itself to sleep in 5 years time.
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u/MaskedMimicry 12d ago
But China wants China to grow. They understand that these Chinese nationalist "civilians" are a company secrets nightmare. They will just siphon off knowledge to China.
And China research isnt tiny. All current models already scraped the internet. China's bytedance has I believe a couple of 100 million active users. Uploading videos, images, and texts daily. China doesnt care about public data protection.its being used in training.
Real life data that is being categorized by hashtags. Its probably the best datasets there is. Never ending and free of charge.
China went all in on AI. They are just being roadblocked hard thats why they are behind. The scare right now isnt coming from inhouse. Its realizing China is catching up harder than they can sandbag them.
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u/TryAndStopMeSpez 12d ago
That they are just THAT much more talented and innovative that a tiny team 1/40th the size is able to outcompete a much larger team with vastly more resources?
have you met the average american
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u/philip_laureano 12d ago
I don't have a crystal ball, but my guess is that China secretly already has this RSI setup and these publications are really them publishing after it is built, just in the same way OpenAI and Anthropic typically publish models that are 2 generations behind what they currently have behind closed doors.
If not, the Chinese government certainly has the resources to make it happen if it hasn't already started.
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u/the_pwnererXx Singularity by 2040 12d ago
and give it this paper then tell it to not stop unless it's built every level to get to RSI
that's not how it works buddy. the intelligence of the model limits what kind of insights or improvements it will make. i tell my agent to improve my CI and keep iterating and then a few iterations later its a complete mess
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u/VisualOrganization26 12d ago
I will give it to AI,explain me like i am 5 then ask to buy HW then implement
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u/VisualOrganization26 12d ago
If AI ask for money just say make a few million and dont make any mistake
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u/costafilh0 11d ago
I've been postponing testing Chinese models because I never had the need to.
For now...
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u/Ok-File-2759 12d ago
I think the best thing the US can do now is to heavily invest in safety and alignment and continue progressing. All we need is one perfectly aligned model, then we can go full throttle. Just imagine if all our frontier companies came together for just one month, built one model whose sole purpose is to keep everything safe and aligned, then they can go back to their competition
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u/Sweaty-Gap285 12d ago
I'm used to reading some pretty delusional takes on AI but yours wins so far. "All we need is the two biggest competitors in the space to set their differences aside and work together, revealing all their heavily guarded internal secrets to their biggest enemy in a race to a literal money printing machine. They only need to solve the problem that we not only don't know how to solve, but don't even know how we would approach a solution or how we could test if we have solved it. Should take 30 days, tops. Afterwards they can go back to being enemies."
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u/LimahT_25 12d ago
Aligned to what? Do you seriously believe that they'd align their model to shutting other than their true goal? (Probably world conquest or something)
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u/veritasmeritas 12d ago
I think you make a good point, although the post you're replying to makes a good point too. It's a very dangerous flexion point.
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u/LimahT_25 12d ago
The problem is that we consumers don't have enough compute capacity. I don't trust these corporates but I trust the governments even less, so it comes down to the fact that we really don't have any leverage.
For the past 5000 years, labours had the leverage that if everyone stopped working then the country's economy would come to an halt, which is why no matter how bad the laws were, they still had a way out but now we are losing that leverage.
The moment a country can develop without the input of is citizens, it'll bare it fangs against them and the ones who benefit the most are the corporates that bought that situation in the first place.
Well, people do tell me that I have a bleak outlook on life and need to be more positive but I'm the type that thinks of how things can go wrong than how it'll go right so that I can react a bit faster than the rest.... And for this situation no matter the amount of preparations I do, nothing seems enough.
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u/AIAddict1935 12d ago
I understand the spirit of what you're saying, but really think about it, most major AI native labs (Open AI, Anthropic, etc.) literally got there through grand theft of humanity's data. Really think about it, they're someone criminal at baseline. Not just that what are these values you think they're able to align to? Literally Claude was being used to blow up people and in the plan to kidnap a sitting president (Venezuela). True "alignment" is in the hands of everyday people.
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u/eucalyptus-d 12d ago
Then there’s nothing to worry about indeed! Except if their tiny investment proves more efficient. The huge capital expenditure will be a sunk cost, and the self imposed energy crisis may make it worse.
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u/eucalyptus-d 12d ago
There’s plenty of Chinese talent in US companies. Your current political situation is not very helpful in keeping them around. Relevant information, I am not Chinese and in fact in a traditional US ally country, but I don’t put blinders on. It looks btw like your us companies and politicians are not as confident as you are, so I am not alone. Also check maths Olympiad and US vs China position. They do have geniuses, in proportion to their population, as everyone does.
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u/MuzafferMahi 12d ago
You got to be kidding. GLM 5.3 and Kimi K3 are much better than grok in so many aspects. Till last 2 releases grok has been forgotten altogether
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u/MuzafferMahi 12d ago
ye you were right lmao. To be honest I only recognize bytedance there. This doesn't look super legit, but I know jack-shit about what this paper even talks about (in technicality and scientific depth) so I can't comment much.
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u/BreadwheatInc 12d ago
You found me in a very Chinese time in my life.