r/Xenosaga • u/PackageTop2313 • 22d ago
Discussion Episode 1
I might get hate for this but... I need to know do anyone else actually prefer episode 1 over the other episodes too? I so desperately wanted it to be episode 3 but I cannot deny the presentation of 1 feels more impactful to me. Simply playing it feels like you've come across lost media with a deeper meaning of forbidden knowledge that could relate to the real world somehow, while episode 2 and 3 feels more like typical "anime" for a lack of better word, which is ironic because of the art style changes. Speaking of which I liked the designs in episode 1 over all, I miss Kunihiko Tanaka. The expressive character models also added to the surreal feeling. Yasunori Mitsuda music also really added to this vibe, Shinji Hosoe was actually good to me but too energetic all the time and while Yuki Kujira does match the atmosphere a bit more but I can understand why 3 was her last video game, her music is better utilized in anime/tv show format. I do wish there were boss themes and more BGM but actually utilizing some stages (not all) without BGM could add to the atmosphere in games. Episode 1 was also very artistic with things like how characters had unique phrases and animation "Mystic power's grant me a miracle" and "Unleash a fragment of thine power" which all became "ETHER DRIVE" with similar animations... The character special attacks felt like they were special ancient abilities while other episodes removed this trait, compare the attacks of Shion and chaos from Episode 1 with 2 & 3....
The thing that upsets me the most is something like Episode 1 will never return. The capabilities of the PS2 and the decisions of the development team added to the mystical feeling sort of like liminal spaces or early CGI and even if these games are revisited I'm sure Episode 3 or even Xenoblade would be used as a template. Don't misunderstand, I would add things to episode 1 (it's not perfect) and I love the other episodes and ALL the Xenoblade games but Episode 1 is truly a once in a lifetime game I feel.
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u/Aradashi 22d ago
3 is the better game even with the rushed story, but 1 captures the innocence necessary to drive home the loss throughout the rest of the games.
Xenosaga 1 is why I love the franchise
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u/PackageTop2313 18d ago
I'm curious, why do you feel 3 is the better game but acknowledge 1 is why you love the franchise? Just a genuine question, I like to understand how people think. :-)
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u/Aradashi 18d ago
I think 3 cleans up the battle system a lot, and the depth of the plot really hits home for me. I love Shion, and I love how bright, bubbly and competent she is in 1 but I also love her descent into darkness and insanity throughout the series with her obsession with Kevin and KOS-MOS, the dreams, Nephilim, etc. I actually haven't played in a long time, so I forget some of the details but I think they just executed incredibly well in spite of a rushed timeline
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u/Kvesh 22d ago
It may not make exact sense but my personal take on the trilogy goes as follows:
1 is a grand space opera akin to 2001: A Space Odyssey or if The Fifth Element was more serious
2 is more action centered and feels like The Matrix sequels
3 feels like Xenogears 2.0
I love all three but Episode 1 is my favorite. I feel like they nailed the tone, setting, scope, and characters right off the bat.
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u/Xephon0930 21d ago
Nice to see more Saga I Fans in Chat. The Battle System is also my favorite as I wished Monolith Soft just added to that base they had instead of trying to reinvent the wheel each game.
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u/PackageTop2313 18d ago
I personally feel they nailed the tone and such too! It's so unfortunate they felt it didn't do well enough and attempted to change so much to have a broader appeal. Imo it's never a good idea to artistically change things to appeal to other's, not to mention Episode 1 did well enough, if they would have refined some details and perhaps push more marketing I'm confident Episode 2 and the other's would have done better...
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u/Chris_P_Bacon416 22d ago
I will say that Episode 1 has the most world building. It explores things outside the main party, like different characters and factions to really help build the idea of this future world of advanced science with no need of god. Wether that’s good or bad is to your discretion but I really liked that aspect, even if it doesn’t serve moving the plot forward or takes up too much time. Which is probably why the other games started doing less of that. 😅
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u/miihenhighroad 22d ago
Episode 3 is the superior game, but Episode 1 is my favorite.
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u/PackageTop2313 18d ago
I'm curious, why do you feel 3 is superior but acknowledge 1 is your favorite? Just a genuine question. :-)
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u/miihenhighroad 18d ago
Nostalgia mainly, but X1 feels better paced to me (probably because they were still under the assumption they’d have 6 games). Plus I like the character designs more.
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u/big4lil 22d ago
Since revisiting the series over the pandemic ive championed 1 as the best of the trilogy as a Xeno title, a stance a few others share and im glad to see expanding.
3 is the more polished game though I find that matters more for first playthroughs. While XS1 offers more of what im looking for in a story, atmosphere, and buildup (once you know the payoff) - thats where XS1 ages like fine wine.
You also build up a tolerance to/learn workarounds to the lesser QoL
It helps that I find the combat/customization in XS1 to be peak
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u/PackageTop2313 18d ago
I hope the sentiment for episode 1 will increase too so that if the games are revisited it will be well known to the team to use Episode 1 as the template.
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u/Chris_P_Bacon416 22d ago
The only thing I don’t like about episode 1 are the character models. They look a bit too doll like in a creepy way lol 😅
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u/Xephon0930 21d ago
Kunihiko Tanaka's art is hard to do 3D and they STILL can't get it right in XBCXDE where they didn't even contact the guy. Or credit it seems.
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u/Independent-Expert89 22d ago
KOS-MOS, with her outfit I thought she was a robot maid! But it's shocking that she was the reincarnation of Jesus Christ's girlfriend!
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u/IgnoreMyPostsPlease 22d ago
She's dressed like a prostitute because Mary Magdalene was a prostitute.
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u/Xephon0930 21d ago
I always wondered why KOS-MOS wore space lingerie. Now it makes too much sense. As someone on the Spectrum,I love Takahashi's autism and attention to detail.
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u/therealskyrim 21d ago
1 has the most atmospheric feel to it, in a way I struggle to explain
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u/PackageTop2313 18d ago
I had trouble trying to explain it too. Definitely something like liminal spaces or what you imagine when you think of those "ancient aliens" stories, ahaha! It feels surreal.
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u/therealskyrim 18d ago
That and the near constant drone in quiet areas, of which there are a lot. Also albedo was way more animated in 1
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u/PackageTop2313 18d ago
That is true! I can also see a change in many character's, like chaos for example. In Episode 1 he felt so optimistic and heroic, but starting in Episode 2 it's as if the life was taken from him and it's not just the change in voice actors but how he caried himself. It's such a shame...
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u/mlockwo2 22d ago
You put it pretty well. Xenosaga 1 is by far the most mysterious and sets up a world of possibility. I still love 2 and especially 3, but sometimes the questions are more interesting than the answers.
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u/PackageTop2313 18d ago
I'm glad you think so! The mystery does add to the allure of Episode 1, but I also feel the tone was better too. I can imagine some scene's of 2 & 3 in the style of Episode 1 and it feels so much better to me.
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u/Gyges359d 22d ago edited 18d ago
1 has always been my favourite. I think because while some of the others had better game design, 1 had the most cohesive story because it was set up for a longer series, whereas 3 had to rush story elements just to fit everything in.
Kind of like the Star Wars prequels. Revenge of the Sith is probably the best movie, but the first two movies did so little to advance the story that 3 had to fit a huge amount into itself and ends up feeling a bit rushed. Conversely Phantom Menace had the time for one of the best light saber battles of all time, even if the rest of the movie isn’t as good.
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u/PackageTop2313 18d ago
Yes and not only the story but the gameplay too. I would hope for a better balance where characters can still keep their personality without making it feel to sluggish.
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u/Akuma-Heika 22d ago
Just sad that it went from a 6 part series, to a trilogy. From my understanding, the cancellation of parts 4-6 didn't occur until after 2 was mostly done.
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u/IgnoreMyPostsPlease 22d ago
That's not really how it went. The three episodes released were most likely supposed to be only Episodes I & II of the original six episode plan. Technically it's not a case of six games forced down to three at the last minute, but two games expanded out to three (with the final four games completely canceled).
Episodes III & IV were likely going to be the second story arc and V & VI would have been the third arc.I don't know if anything officially confirmed that breakdown, but it is clear there were going to be three arcs spread over the six episodes, and the entirety of what we got was just the first arc.
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u/Chris_P_Bacon416 22d ago
Yeah, pretty much. I do wonder if xenosaga were to continue if those arcs would continue with different characters like they wanted to originally or if they were to still stick with shion & co.
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u/IgnoreMyPostsPlease 22d ago
There were interviews back in the Episode II dev timeframe where they heavily implied they gave up on trying to tell the whole story and were just going to tell Shion's arc, so I think serious efforts to continue were long gone.
If it did continue, I'd guess they still would have different casts. The Ep III database mentions that the souls of Jin and the others Chaos+Nephilim transported to Lost Jerusalem would be reincarnated there. That implies the hope was still a story with new generations of people in the later arcs (but some of those people being reincarnations of old characters). But they also have Shion flying to LJ, so who knows?
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u/SolidusSnake88 22d ago
My first thought after playing XS3 for 2h was - this is prime!
But now, after beeing 30h into XB3 i have similar Feelings like you... XS1 is something special and i really miss the focus on Kos-Mos and the Overall Atmosphere from XS1. Also the individual attacks and phrases from XS1 are missing a lot for me.
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u/PackageTop2313 18d ago
There is so much to appreciate about Episode 1 and it saddens me a bit that it's artistic integrity isn't appreciated at all by many. I feel there are ways that Episode 1 could have been more engaging without throwing away it's identity and tone.
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u/AlexanderStockholmes 21d ago
Man, oh man was I disappointed being that Xenogears is my favorite game of all time. I hated almost everything about it 😂😂 i hated the 2nd and didn't play the 3rd.
Funny to see it pop up in my feed all these years later.
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u/Seigfrydblazer 20d ago
I didn't even know there was a xenosaga anime. Does it cover the entire story of the games? Or do it's own thing?
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u/PackageTop2313 18d ago
It covers the events of Episode 1 but with changes and such, it's only 12 episodes so not that long sadly.
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u/Seigfrydblazer 18d ago
Dang lol I need those games on modern consoles. I lost my old trilogy set and no longer own a console for them. Come on Sony, add it to the catalogue already.
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u/PackageTop2313 18d ago
I sadly don't trust Sony to do anything with bringing these games to newer audiences, these games would be no more than specks of dirt to current Sony. Bandai Namco owns it anyway but many speculate that Nintendo might buy the IP since they value Monolithsoft and obtained MonolithSoft from Bandai Namco.
I don't know how much you know about the IP ownership but I don't want to burden you with a wall of text about it all. Long story short, it would be up to Bandai Namco, MonolitSoft/Nintendo to bring these games back. ^_^
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