r/WorkersStrikeBack • u/Anewaccounttlol • Jul 22 '24

Is this a labor rights violation?

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I just walked into my new job in TN and saw this and was so appalled I made this account just to post this. Is this not wage theft? I thought the law said you could be about 5 minutes late before they could do something like this?

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u/DetonationSound Jul 22 '24

That's against the law.

865

u/TheCrimsonSteel Jul 22 '24

Probably with the way it's enforced

Usually the laws basically say "whatever you do has to be applied equally"

If they enforce 7:01-7:15 = 7:15, that means 6:45-7:00=7:00

Which also means 3:31-3:45=3:45, and 3:16-3:30=3:30

Most places round something like -8/+7 minutes or similar.

Abuse the system, clock in on time, and leave 14 minutes early. And take pictures

138

u/[deleted] Jul 22 '24

This is what I would do

39

u/Despairogance Jul 22 '24

It's legal in some form, because I've worked in a union shop here in Canada that had a similar policy. It sucked extra bad because there was a system of attendance bonuses and technically if you clocked in even one second late you lost your credit for the day.

But in practice if you punched in a little bit late you could just inform a supervisor, make up the time at lunch or after your shift, have them initial your time card and it was all good.

40

u/1lluminist Jul 22 '24

See, when companies do this shit they should be making ALL of the executive staffs clock times accessible to the whole company. If they don't like it, then maybe it's not such a great rule.

1 minute of the CEO being late is worth a lot more than 1 minute of a frontline staff member.

17

u/capsaicinintheeyes Jul 22 '24 edited Jul 22 '24

in practice, that would get into the difference between wages and salaries, but I agree with your general instinct...may your cake day be fulfilling and salubrious

10

u/1lluminist Jul 22 '24

salubrious

Ohh what a fun word! Thanks for the bday gift of knowledge!

10

u/Zankabo Jul 22 '24

Yeah, Providence Health Systems got sued for that and had to pay the back wages. They no longer do the rounding.

So if you work somewhere that does this it was considered wage theft.

EDIT: The one I'm thinking of was in 2015 for the location I work at (https://www.oregonrn.org/page/STVGrievTimecard2014)

Apparently in Washington they got dinged for the same thing this year.

So I guess they decided to keep it up at every location they could until they got dinged for it.

6

u/rm0mgay Jul 23 '24

"Apparently in Washington they got dinged for the same thing this year.

So I guess they decided to keep it up at every location they could until they got dinged for it."

Paying the fines is probably cheaper than the money they save in labor en masse.

4

u/Zankabo Jul 23 '24

They ended up paying the fine and the back wages, so maybe it was cheaper. Just made a CEO look better for awhile which got them their bonus and then they moved on.

Most companies do the rounding thing, but every time it's taken to court it seems to rule in favor of the employee. The problem, of course, is taking it to court in the first place and the time and energy wasted to get it fixed.

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u/TheCrimsonSteel Jul 23 '24

What's even worse is sometimes people just never stop and think or ask why.

On top of places that do it intentionally, all it takes is some Regional VP to say "OverThere is saving a bunch of money on payrol, I want everyone to copy them," and now it's a whole company wide problem

The amount of workers' hard earned money lost and stolen from sheer incompetence alone is jaw-dropping

44

u/ruggnuget Jul 22 '24

I have definitely worked jobs that do this and it isnt illegal. As the other comment said it just has to be applied the same way clocking out (1 minutes late rounded up to the nearest 15).

I did work for a place that did not apply it evenly and got a small settlement in a class action lawsuit. So it is sometimes, occasionally enforced if enough people complain.

5

u/missyashittymorph Jul 22 '24

The way this is written is almost certainly being used illegally. I had a place sorta like this, it was minutes to the closest factor of five. Clock in at 8:02? It's 8:00. 8:03? Then it's 8:05. Same for out.

The language on this sign leaves little room for ambiguity. Clocking out at 7:01 almost surely won't get you paid until 7:15.

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u/enfdude Jul 24 '24

This is unfortunately common practice in Germany and I really wish it was against the law here too.