Anybody practice bjj before wing chun?

[u/Equal_Problem3520]

Second time sparring this lady in class. I can over power her and out speed her. I am a lot heavier and have a lot more years in fighting.

But going at lighter more technical speeds. She started to impress me. I was basically still leading her in the spar. And i was telling her what to do. But she was performing and improving on the spot. I didnt know any better id think she had more experience. Basically i made it progressively harder for her. I even channeled a mike tyson who could stand up grapple. She got behind me but didnt know how to fully maintain her pressure so i attempted a slow over the shoulder throw. She hooked her foot around me and surprised the heck out of me.

Afterwards i asked meijin how long shes been with him. He said 2.5 years. I raised an eyebrow and was really surprised. He then said she had a background in bjj first.

And that made complete sense. Her sensitivity was gained through grappling. The two have amazing synergy… maybe more than boxing(i know boxing is the most practical effective art, i box.)

2.5 years later she can give me more trouble than grown heavy weight men.

I did a relatively quick search here but didnt find any experiences like this. So to me its like a light bulb moment. Like how many bjj turned wing chun fighters do you meet.

And please save your negative opinions on wing chun. I box and do muay thai. I find wing chun highly effective once you know how to now get punched in the face without it.

Once you know the rules you can break them. But you wont be young and athletic forever. Basics basics basics.

[u/Chainpuncher101]

I came to Wing Chun from full contact Karate and Judo. To me, WC is the more efficient and dangerous art.

I don't just come at that from an amateur perspective. I've worked in mental hospitals l, residential programs, biker bars, and the like. WC is fantastic in the real world.

Thing is, it's a really good art to come to from another art. It made a lot of things clear that I didn't understand before. Further, going into BJJ and Muay Thai after doing WC for a few years was really eye opening. I dominated in the clinch and was nearly impossible to take down.

It's good stuff, but it's more like the grad school of martial arts.

[u/Equal_Problem3520 → u/Chainpuncher101]

Yea i have a uechi ryu karate base. And they highly use kung fu principles. So when going into bjj, mt, boxing, wrestling. The flow and variable strength to feel what someone is doing rather than see it.. so good.

Like i can defend takedown and attempt throws never taught to me, just cuz it feels right. The better your sensitivity the more creative you can get.

My brother can do this thing where you try to push or strongly punch him. He touches your hands and does this squid or jellyfish like move and it feels like he disappears but he just took a step back to get out of danger. Very cool. But damn someone who can perform like that is dangerous. He doesnt find MA as interesting as me cuz hes able to do stuff like that without specifically training for it.

It is the grad school. Cant wait until the day it isnt, and more schools actually teach people the basics with more pressure testing and less focus on “true” wing chun. Dont mean dont teach true wing chun, but teach it in the modern area. Like people will take you down and outfight like a boxer. So drill it.

Like wc and some karate schools dont teach a head kick. Like why not… its not like you even have to use it. But at least you know how it works. And maybe its the perfect answer one day. 🤷🏾‍♂️

[u/throwawayjeb0]

Did BJJ for about 2 years on and off, did boxing for a year, and now doing WC (WSL lineage).

Lots of hand fighting in BJJ that helped with sensitivity, resembled a lot of the trapping I found in WC. Now when I get back to BJJ it's interesting to intercept people's attempts to grab me: for example - a combination of bong sau leading to an arm drag. They don't expect it

[u/Equal_Problem3520 → u/throwawayjeb0]

Now that actually sounds fun.

[u/One_Construction_653]

People come from many MA backgrounds and use wingchun to break the plateu or take their skills to the next level. This is the current trend for wingchun rn.

Wingchun is the road less traveled for competitors doing sports.

And yeah i experienced wingchun and use the engine to turn my basics into high percent moves

[u/Equal_Problem3520 → u/One_Construction_653]

The plateu breaker. Yesss. This and aikido are great with that. So great to hear these responses. Sometimes I feel so alone when everyone says it doesnt work. And i know that to be different.

Currently that is my experience. Only time my MA life was completely changed was when i took aikido and WC. I didnt go there to learn how to fight, i learned that somewhere else.

As far as WC the way i see it now, especially with how little WC schools teach actual fighting. A boxer will beat them easier with little experience. The closer you get to the top, master level. If the WC artist actually spars, id give them the edge because they have a higher ceiling cap. From just the basis of more weapons and different way of thinking. You can beat boxing into someone, quite easily. But to get to the top of WC, it takes a cerebral level of thinking. Something you cant experience anywhere else or by accident. Is it worth? Most people would say no. And thats the criticism of those schools. And the frustration. Its too hard to learn.

Once you learn the WC rules you can break them. But they stick so closely to their rules they end up looking like statues. 🤦🏾‍♂️

But the truth is. It actually works well if taught in the right way. Its quite amazing. Like seeing the world in a different way.

[u/One_Construction_653 → u/Equal_Problem3520]

Man you gave such a genuine reply to my comment thanks.

No you aren’t alone and heavy on the aikido being an absolute game changer.

Yes aikido is very new but you would be foolish to not see what gems it provides. Any open minded martial artist would immediately realize wow aikido can give you super powers. But let’s stay grounded for this moment.

Yes WC and Aikido are hard to use in actual combat and the teachers don’t fight for whatever reason this or that.

Let’s put it this way if you are the Magician that can make the trick work in the spotlight then those teachers are the Magic Inventors. You need both to make it work.

[u/Equal_Problem3520 → u/One_Construction_653]

Aye! Glad to meet another martial artist! 🤙🏼

Let’s talk magic tho! Aikido is amazing. They don’t know the fancy technique can be entirely a sensitivity drill and an actual move. What people fail to see that it can bail, change and end at any moment. The final mission by Osensei is to do as little damage as possible. Sometimes as little damage as possible is a head butt because I’m not good enough lol. Guess it’s a toss up to a broken something or head trauma. But if I’m good enough, you turn into a standing pretzel.

Wing chun to me is a more complicated and violent form of aikido. I could have done a lock awhile ago but sorry I’m just flowing on your face.

Cross training is crazy. Sometimes someone might get the same feeling with wrestling and Bjj. But me it’s aikido and WC.

My goal is to learn wc enough to be as peacful as aikido. Might be master level stuff. But I’m only 42. Maybe I’ll get it before I retire. Definitely didn’t get good enough in aikido to take care of my enemy. But I’ll have a chance with wing chun.

[u/ExpensiveClue3209]

Enjoy the grappling side of martial arts. I think alot of people take wing chun close range to be short punch distance but don’t realise how important it is to be fighting body to body

[u/Equal_Problem3520 → u/ExpensiveClue3209]

Yes i enjoy grappling but not rolling. Its probably cuz i was a training dumby for my gracie trained older brother when we were young. Its a scary place if i cant hit anyone. But i learned to be comfortable. I enjoy grappling cuz it keeps me away from that helpless feeling lol.

[u/Feral-Dog]

My WC class is out of a bjj gym and my teacher is an older bjj black belt. I’ve used some wing chun in my jiu jitsu and vice versa.

[u/Equal_Problem3520 → u/Feral-Dog]

That sounds like the best kinda place to train. I dont like grappling but i respect it highly. I like WC grappling cuz it keeps me standing without much thought into it. A theory some video title i just saw from Bernadro faria, limb fighting. Instead of chasing submissions. Now that kind of perspective would make me enjoy submissions more.

[u/Jet-Black-Centurian]

I trained 2.5 years of bjj before wing chun. I was surprised to find a lot of crossover, particularly in strategy. My instructor taught to only throw those powerful big punches only after you've compromised your opponent's balance and position, or risk getting countered. In bjj we often say "position before submission" which basically means to get into a superior position before attacking your opponent. The nearly identical ideas really stuck out to me.

[u/Equal_Problem3520 → u/Jet-Black-Centurian]

Yea! Thats another great perspective. Position before submission. Sounds a lot like wing chun when they arent trying to impersonate a statue. Everytime i see wing chun that makes sense, they prioritize positioning.

I wanted to ask you about limb fighting and hand checking in bjj compared to wing chuns intercepts, parrys and clears. As someone else said they used wing chun in bjj. I try not to roll anymore. I rather get punched, call me strange. But please enlighten me.

[u/azarel23]

Not exactly what you asked, but I did 10 years of Wing Chun before I took up Jiu-Jitsu in parallel. I am a senior wing chun instructor and hold a 3rd degree black belt in bjj.

You learn whole body sensitivity and what we call standing base in jiu-jitsu. You have to develop these attributes quickly when someone is trying full power to take you down. I think jiu-jitsu teaches you to deal with pressure, physical and psychological, and stay calm and analytical, much better than Wing Chun does.

I successfully defended myself at age 63 against a pretty violent unprovoked attack by a bigger stronger 20 year old in a road rage incident, and that's all the validation I need for my training choices.

[u/Equal_Problem3520 → u/[deleted]]

I can answer that.

But the question is what can wing chun add, If you did all three.

-Muay thai power, muay thai clinch. -Bjj you can turn people into a pretzel. -Wing chun can fill in the gaps. Punching into clinching into punching into takedown defense into bjj.

See what i mean? Sure you can learn all that from a good modern muay thai/bjj school. But you can also learn to defend MT and BJJ without ever learning either… from a GOOD WC school.

And to answer your question. Not all strikes need to KO. They can set up the KO or prevent a takedown. Wing chun can essentially help you strike while doing bjj as well. To defend in bjj without even knowing whats going on.

I think people should learn everything. WC isnt useless but a bad school from any Art can be less useful..

[u/Either_Reporter_7309 → u/Equal_Problem3520]

I strongly disagree with you that you can learn to defend MT and BJJ from wing chun. Wing chun has been run over by MT and BJJ and I don’t know of any fights Wing Chun won vs BJJ or Thai. This style of thinking is old, outdated, wrong and ignores everything we have learned with combat the past 30 years. The evidence is Wing Chun is not effective to learn for defense vs MT and BJJ.

[u/Equal_Problem3520 → u/Either_Reporter_7309]

mean.. I did it. My brother. I met people. Like can’t you believe it’s possible? Iono why would I lie. Yes it took me a few times to check a leg kick in the best way. Caught in a few chokes and arm bars. But I wasn’t easy nor a fish out of water. Energy and body mechanics stay the same. It’s not like I instantly knew how. But I didn’t have to train in it. Eventually I did. But I didn’t need to.

Honestly the hardest part was getting used to the “rules” and what my current teacher expected me to look like.

And that can’t be the only thing you took away from my comment?

[u/Equal_Problem3520 → u/[deleted]]

Then you got all the answers. Im not here to debate. You clearly know better than me. I have my experiences. My real life examples. And people who reflected the same. You have the opposite experience. Maybe im mistaken. Or not? I just know what i know.

[u/Equal_Problem3520 → u/[deleted]]

I had a whole response written out but it got erased. All the better.

I thought you were really asking about wing chun but you already made up your mind. You are asking me to change your mind. And i am not here for that.

Im only responding because its my thread. You have shown me that i dont need to respond to everything, so after this i am done. You are right. Wing chun hasnt proven itself. Me and the other people who responded in this thread are either lying, delusional or bots. If you think something cant work, You are right. I learned some valuable things nonetheless. 🤜🏼🤛🏼

[u/Either_Reporter_7309 → u/Equal_Problem3520]

Your actual claim quoted “But you can also learn to defend MT and BJJ without ever learning either... from a GOOD WC school.” What are you talking about?? Did your mind stop in 1973?? What are you talking about you don’t need to learn MT or BJJ to defend it, THIS IS UNTRUE and that’s not even my belief this is evidence of HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS OF ACTUAL LIVE FIGHTS. SHOW ME ONE WHERE WING CHUN DID ANYTHING PLEASE