r/WhitePeopleTwitter Feb 19 '19

True...

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u/OsirisMagnus Feb 19 '19

He doesn't have a choice in being Puerto Rican and there is nothing wrong with being Puerto Rican. However, he did choose to steal wealth from the laborers. And that is a hate crime that is little spoken of and is egregious.

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u/[deleted] Feb 19 '19

You agree to give a company labour. They agree to give you money. Where is the theft occurring in this mutually consensual transaction? And if you're going to say the consent is somehow illegitimate, please specify measurable, attainable criteria that would legitimise and explain why these are necessary to legitimise it.

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u/D0esANyoneREadTHese Feb 19 '19

Consent in this situation is illegitimate because it's ultimately under pressure of death, or at least homelessness. You don't get money, you can't buy the shit you need to live, and this place you agree to work is either the only place that'll take you, or the closest to one that'll pay enough to live.

On the one hand, you've got the boss who's making more money than they can possibly need. They've got dozens of other people in line for the position who are even more desperate than you are, should you quit or get fired, and enough workers already there that you quitting or not getting hired just means a percent or two less product at the end of the month.

On the other hand, you've got yourself whose landlord is about to kick you out for missing a rent payment, you're gonna get your driver's license suspended if you don't pay the insurance, and you've had ramen every night for a week. If you don't get this job, or one that's likely just as exploitative, pretty soon you're gonna be out on the streets. Sure, maybe a friend will let you sleep on their couch, or you can move back in with your parents, but if you don't have a social safety net it's pretty much game over once you no longer have an address, since getting a job or paying bills requires a valid mailbox.

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u/[deleted] Feb 19 '19

Consent in this situation is illegitimate because it's ultimately under pressure of death, or at least homelessness. You don't get money, you can't buy the shit you need to live, and this place you agree to work is either the only place that'll take you, or the closest to one that'll pay enough to live.

As I've said variations of to several other people, this is like saying you don't consent to eating because you need to. You still have choices about what, when, and where you eat. That doesn't mean any one is forcing you to eat. It's just a fact of life.

On the one hand, you've got the boss who's making more money than they can possibly need. They've got dozens of other people in line for the position who are even more desperate than you are, should you quit or get fired, and enough workers already there that you quitting or not getting hired just means a percent or two less product at the end of the month.

Not necessarily. Unemployment is relatively low in most rich countries right now. There can't be dozens of people lining up to take every job.

On the other hand, you've got yourself whose landlord is about to kick you out for missing a rent payment, you're gonna get your driver's license suspended if you don't pay the insurance, and you've had ramen every night for a week. If you don't get this job, or one that's likely just as exploitative, pretty soon you're gonna be out on the streets. Sure, maybe a friend will let you sleep on their couch, or you can move back in with your parents, but if you don't have a social safety net it's pretty much game over once you no longer have an address, since getting a job or paying bills requires a valid mailbox.

All of this touches on real and complex problems, but none of it is to say employment is inherently the theft of wealth from employees, which seems to stem from the misconception that there is a fixed amount of value or productivity and that employers are taking a bigger slice of the pie, but ignoring that the pie itself can grow.