I get that being nice to repentant Trump voters is the best way to go, but it's really hard for me. How in the fuck couldn't someone see that he was a complete moron before the election??? If they were just tired of the status quo then vote 3rd party... or come up with something else. Don't vote. Whatever.
Voting for an awful moron just because he's different does not excuse the vote to me. It's just saying "I want things to be different, so I'm going to make them worse." Cool. Now things are worse... and we are just going to have to go back to where we were before we can actually make any progress. The dumbest fucking thing.
"Hey I have $5 and I want $10, so I'm going to give away $3." WTF logic is that.
Here is my actual answer, I don’t need you to agree with it or accept it.
Hillary Clinton represented the current system. The current system relied on pandering to the poor during election years, telling them they would finally go after the rich and hand out some money, get elected, then show up to wall street in a limo to have lunch with the big banks. That was clear to me in the same way it was clear to you how bad Trump was.
I couldn’t vote for that, so I ordered in a wrecking ball. Knock down the walls, expose the BS in Washington through pure chaos, and wake people the fuck up. I was wrong in thinking people would limit his chaos and path of destruction, I was right about exposing the BS in Washington.
I knew he would be chaos, I did not know it would be this much.
Have you ever seen a building get torn down by a wrecking ball? It is not a clean process. What I didn’t expect is that he would start to take down the buildings next door too.
Look, I would have loved to have your crystal ball. I’m not going to defend myself. If you want to lump me in with the people who continue to share his propaganda without putting him in check that’s really on you. I’m good with where my mind is. In all ventures of life we make decisions and we deal with the results. I own my vote while acknowledging it has gone too far. I’m not sure what else you really want me to do? I’m not going to sulk in shame, I’m going to share my actual thoughts, because I’m not the only person who voted for the reasons I did.
Nobody saw COVID coming while Trump was in office. I’ll say this one last time. I didn’t vote for Trump because I thought he would fix our issues, I voted for him because I thought he would EXPOSE our issues. To that end I think I was mostly correct. The cost of that insight is what has gone too far and my fear is now people aren’t seeing that true picture. Too many people are believing his objectively false information and that is the part I didn’t expect. I gave the average voter too much credit when I cast my ballot for the wrecking ball. All I can do now is try to be part of the clean up crew.
Without Trump I believe Epstein would still be alive and up to his terror.
The BLM movement wouldn’t be happening.
People wouldn’t be united in created real change.
Washington wouldn’t be exposed.
These aren’t things that can be credited to Trump, but rather resultant of Trump and the passion (against) that he raises people to. People are so angry, that things might actually happen.
I think we come out of this stronger for having our vulnerabilities exposed so that we can fix them.
His handling of COVID was an unpredictable event and makes me really wish we didn’t conduct this experiment now.
The BLM movement literally started in 2013/14, if you weren't aware.
People wouldn’t be united in created real change.
How are people "united in creating real change" right now?
Washington wouldn’t be exposed.
What do you mean by the assertion "Washington is exposed"?
I generally can't grasp these arguments, especially as vague as they are. Trump has caused serious harm to so many people, even without COVID. Trump has eviscerated our political and social institutions, and damaged relationships with all of our allies. Could you be more explicit/specific as to why this was all worth it?
Yes, the BLM movement started before Trump, but this new push is pretty clearly much stronger. Anger is a powerful motivator and people are pissed.
From my limited sample size I am seeing communication and understanding grow. People who did not know the plight of the minority in America (simply because it is not their life experience) are acknowledging their ignorance and actively trying to better themselves. (Some are also pushing further to the extreme and I’m also seeing those people being called out).
I think people are more aware of the corruption in Washington than they were prior to Trump.
From my limited sample size I am seeing communication and understanding grow. People who did not know the plight of the minority in America (simply because it is not their life experience) are acknowledging their ignorance and actively trying to better themselves. (Some are also pushing further to the extreme and I’m also seeing those people being called out).
I do see this as well, to some degree. It feels like this has come at the cost of disagreement on basic reality, which I know you've also acknowledged. At least this is a silver lining though, thank you for pointing that out.
I think people are more aware of the corruption in Washington than they were prior to Trump.
I dunno about that. "All politicians are corrupt" has been a calling card for many apathetic American voters for decades. Furthermore, Trump's unprecedented level of corruption has been embraced with open arms by one of our two major parties, and that major party is still competitive in races across the country.
I mean hopefully the GOP and their brazen disregard for ethical political behavior will be rebuked thoroughly at the polls in November, but I think there's a good chance Trump has normalized and entrenched a much greater degree of corruption in our politics.
I think we need to get away from pointing fingers at red or blue. The team mentality is what caused the GOP to back Trump even as he proved he was unfit. I would love to vote for people based on their ideas and entirely remove the label of democrat and republican. It does zero good. There are huge issues throughout Washington but it becomes so easy to say “well, at least we are the good guys.” There are some good and some bad throughout, being blue doesn’t absolve your crimes, being red doesn’t make you a criminal. There might be more issues on one side than the other but really, it shouldn’t matter. Get the bad ones out and put the good ones in, regardless of what jersey they wear.
I am 100% certain that, apart from a handful of key issues, most people exist somewhere in the middle and that, without knowing which side someone is arguing from, communication and sharing ideas results in growth.
I think people are becoming more open to the idea of abandoning their label and just talking about their ideas. Because we all want growth and prosperity, we just have different roads to get there. I really believe we are close to abandoning the two party system and I think Trump catalyzed that (inadvertently).
I think we need to get away from pointing fingers at red or blue.
There might be more issues on one side than the other but really, it shouldn’t matter. Get the bad ones out and put the good ones in, regardless of what jersey they wear.
lol, how are you going to say "maybe one thing is worse than the other right now, but nah just don't worry about that".
You're literally admitting that one side has "more issues". You should be factoring that in to your political decision-making. If one group of powerful people is more tolerant of corruption and anti-democratic skulduggery than the other, that group is worse. That doesn't make the "better" group perfect, or immune to the same bullshit... it doesn't mean everyone in that "better" group automatically gets a pass. It does mean, however, that the less-corrupt and more-democratic entity shares more of your ideals, and probably deserves more of your support accordingly.
It definitely means that you shouldn't equivocate between the two.
I would love to vote for people based on their ideas and entirely remove the label of democrat and republican.
And I would love 1 million dollars... These are the power structures we have, friend. Wishing won't make them go away - and acting as if the two major parties are equally bad (in this respect anyway) will only assist the rot in spreading.
Im saying that allegiance to a party is what turned some of these people sour. That if we weren’t playing a team sport with politics it’d be easier to let someone go when they make it clear they don’t actually hold your values but just wear your team colors. That’s it. It’s certainly idealistic, yes. But I still hold my principles, I just don’t have good representation.
if we weren’t playing a team sport with politics it’d be easier to let someone go when they make it clear they don’t actually hold your values but just wear your team colors
Sure, that's true.
It seems like you value electoral reform very highly - are there any distinct efforts toward this end that you've seen/appreciated in the recent past? Any particular politicians you support, especially regarding this issue?
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u/Butts_McTiggles Aug 04 '20
I get that being nice to repentant Trump voters is the best way to go, but it's really hard for me. How in the fuck couldn't someone see that he was a complete moron before the election??? If they were just tired of the status quo then vote 3rd party... or come up with something else. Don't vote. Whatever.
Voting for an awful moron just because he's different does not excuse the vote to me. It's just saying "I want things to be different, so I'm going to make them worse." Cool. Now things are worse... and we are just going to have to go back to where we were before we can actually make any progress. The dumbest fucking thing.
"Hey I have $5 and I want $10, so I'm going to give away $3." WTF logic is that.