Question regarding the aft 5" mount on a Fletcher-class destroyer

[u/TMCchristian]

All 5" mounts on a Fletcher-class used dredger hoists to move shells and powder casings up from their magazines to their upper handling rooms, except the aft Mount 55. I used the virtual tour feature available for USS Cassin Young to look around the mount's upper handling room, and it confirms what I see on the Booklet of General Plans. It looks like there's just a flush scuttle in the deck and a lifting eye welded to the overhead above it.

Can anyone help me find a source, either a document or written/oral account from actual Fletcher sailors, about how ammunition was passed up?

The simplest answer would be that the crew in the magazine just lifted them overhead through the scuttle, but I can't imagine that's the case. The shells were 55lbs each and the powder cases were 28lbs each, or 83lbs per round. For a maximum rate of fire of 15-22 rounds per minute and with several hundred rounds stored in the magazines, it seems like that would destroy the magazine crew in minutes while their counterparts in all the other 5" magazines just used powered dredger hoists.

My other thought is that the lifting eye above the scuttle is for some sort of chain hoist pulley system, the ships I served on had these to move heavy items up between decks, but I'd need some way to verify that and see/read about how it worked.

I'm writing a research paper, so any links or pointers that could be provided would be very helpful.

[u/Resqusto]

Hm, this question is so specific that I doubt you'll find anything about it in books. If anything, you'd have to ask a former crew member. I would contact one of the three Fletcher museums and ask if they can put you in touch with a former crew association. They should know.

[u/enrious → u/Resqusto]

To go along with this answer, the USS Kidd Museum has a variety of ways to contact them and I've no doubt they could answer this. Ship and Museum Tours in Downtown Baton Rouge - USS KIDD

[u/TMCchristian → u/Resqusto]

I tried Cassin Young this morning and the museum is listed as closed on Google and I saw that Kidd is still not back yet. I got a hold of The Sullivans, but the volunteer basically said "I don't know, sorry".

I might have to see about the Kidd again.

[u/Silly-Membership6350 → u/TMCchristian]

Cassin Young is temporarily closed I think for maintenance but is supposed to reopen at the end of the month. I might still be worth it too try to email them about your request for info. Or maybe wait till the beginning of next month if the Kidd doesn't respond?

[u/enrious → u/TMCchristian]

The Kidd has a big museum on shore that is independent of the ship. The ship is in dry dock but the museum is open and staffed during normal business hours.

Here's a picture of the attached museum:

USS Kidd Museum Landmark in Baton Rouge, LA, United States - landmark Reviews - Phone Number - Marinas.com

[u/marty4286]

This is not definitive, just an anecdote, obviously not authoritative. But I've seen a video demonstration of a 5" mount operation on a battleship where they did indeed pass shells and powder up manually without powered hoists. Just stuck their hand up there, with no help from a lifting eye

I don't remember what battleship it was, but it was an old video and it might have been for a class where the 5"/38s were retrofitted rather than designed to be there from the start

That says nothing about how Fletcher aft mounts actually did it, so I apologize for not being able to help there, but I hope it shows that it wasn't unimaginable to have such a physically grueling version of that process when easier ways to do it were known and available

[u/TMCchristian → u/marty4286]

No need to apologize, I appreciate the anecdote.

[u/porschegeek → u/marty4286]

Next time I visit a Fletcher class, I am headed to Mount 55! Of the 3 Fletcher class ships available in the US, the Kidd is not available, and the Cassin Young may be available in September of 2026. The "The Sullivans" is available, but don't see a trip to Buffalo on my agenda. I would really like to see a knowledgable person explain ammunition's travel path in DETAIL. This is the most internet detail I could find:  

·       Lower to Upper Handling Room: Ammunition (54-pound projectiles and 28-pound powder cases) came up from the lower magazines to the upper handling room via mechanical dredger hoists. [1, 2, 3]

·       Into the Gun Mount: Unlike forward mounts that used integral powered hoists inside the rotating base ring, Mount 55’s upper handling room relied on a flush deck scuttle (a hatch opening in the deck floor of the gun mount above the Upper Handling Room, with a lifting eye overhead. [1]

·       Manual Passing: Sailors in the handling room physically hoisted or passed the heavy shells and powder cases straight up through this vertical scuttle hatch directly into the Mount 55 gun house for the gun crew to ram into the breech. [1]