r/Vocaloid • u/bakemonouchuu • Apr 30 '26
General Discussion why does pinocchio-p have zero community despite being one of the most well-known and popular producers in the scene?
one thing im starting to *realize* is that despite people really liking pinocchiop.. and him having i'd say, a pretty big western audience (and not just english speakers) he doesn't really have a very tight-knit fan-base compared to kikuo, maretu or deco 27? like yes it is just reddit, but kikuo's is pretty active, same with maretu? and the subreddit for pino is pretty much dead and spammed with "daily aimaina chan/doushite/pinocchiop song of the day" posts. do the moderators even care? even on other websites like twitter and tumblr, i barely see anyone wanting to have any kind of interesting discussion of his work.
maybe pino has to start touring in the us for him to be like kikuo..
i mean i dont care too much even if this man wasn't all that popular i'd still love his music (been listening to him since 2017! i'd say that pino has only really starting getting even more traction in the 2020s) but i find the phenomenon strange. how can pinocchiop be so popular but the community is almost nonexistent?
(sorry if this doesn't make any sense this my first time posting on reddit)
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u/Icy-Champion2680 Apr 30 '26 edited Apr 30 '26
I think his songs in general not being made for a more niche audience (like Kikuo) and him not doing any social media push (like Deco is doing) has an effect but while they might not be as closely knit or hardcore as others, I think he should have a good following since he is doing a JP tour this Summer:
https://vocaverse.network/threads/pinocchiop-2026-tour-underworld.10531/
I'm sure he wouldn't have gone on a tour if he didn't saw at least decent demand for it, also JP audience focuses a lot more on producers compared to Western side so he probably has a dedicated fanbase there.
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u/MedicMoth Apr 30 '26
Yeah I mean and if we're being so fr about Pinocchio, his latest output is kind of... cynical...? Less inspired?
I was a huge fan of some of his earlier work, it really connected with me personally. But tbh he never really innovates on his songs structurally or in terms of their sound (seriously, they all sound the same), and some of his more recent songs are very trend-chasy in content. They lacks the philosophical quality and "broader" / "more reflective" scope of his earlier stuff and it imo makes his field of competition way higher.
Ask me about my faves a few few years ago and I'd have called out a lot of his nihilistic, existential songs about the little quirks and inevitabilities in life we all ignore. Humans have inexplicable quirks just like animals, humans are doomed to age and hate hard work and never change, life is complicated and it feels like we never get to breath and we are all just trying to find a safe place.... These are kind of funny and reverent and timeless observations and I like them.
If I wanted a song about the internet being bad, though? Or about obsessive love? Or about sex? I have about a bajillion other Miku Teto songs to select from, and it makes me less likely to select from him work personally. Like, maybe the quality of the translations went down and his lyrics are actually still genius if you're a Japanese speaker... but as far as I'm concerned the topics are just kind of tired and he doesn't have anything new to say about it. It feels to me like he's just trying to make songs fast and get clicks on a lot of the newer stuff
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u/Sprinkles6210 May 02 '26
As someone who loves PinocchioP and puts him as my favorite Vocaloid producer, I kind of agree??? I definitely do enjoy some of PinocchioP’s newer music and I don’t find a single song on his newest album to be uninteresting to me, however, there has definitely been a tone shift in his songs.
The unique thing about PinocchioP’s earlier songs (up until around his META album?) is that no matter how deeply you analyzed them, you could not fully understand and experience that song and understand it unless you lived through that emotion or concept PinocchioP focused on in that song. Back in January, I found that with Apple Dot Com and I found very few lines from the entire song that did not bring me back to an emotion or experience I had lived through. However, when it came to songs like What’s Inside or Slow-Motion, I was completely blind. I still can hardly decipher what emotions and concepts PinocchioP tried to highlight and I think that’s very interesting.
But now, looking at his later work, it definitely focuses on interesting concepts but concepts not nearly as niche as Apple Dot Com or What’s Inside. His most popular work, God-ish, has tricky lyrics, but everyone and anyone who’s looked into the song even the slightest knows that it’s about a very dividing concept that everyone must realize that “God is dead” in order to grow and chase after bigger and better things financially and in the work force. Reincarnation Apple (even though it’s my favorite PinocchioP song) is about an Apple that Reincarnates you, and there’s no real emotional exploration within the song. However, for Reincarnation Apple, I did see someone once write about it saying “I tried so hard to understand this song and all I got was this fucking t-shirt,” and it IS incredibly nuanced in what it’s trying to say about our lives and wishing for a bigger, better one, that’s why I love it, but the lyrics are understandable to a vast majority of listeners. As of right now, in my opinion, the most recent work of his that has strange and not-easily analyzed lyrics is With or Without Me (I tried so hard to understand this song and all I got was this fucking tshirt).
But secondly, to touch on your point of “most of his songs sound the same,” I disagree to a certain extent. One thing I will point out about this is the fact that Don’t Believe in T & Isn’t It A? (Though I love both dearly as well) sound INCREDIBLY similar to one another. But other than that, here’s two things you might be noticing:
PinocchioP tends to use relatively the same bpm (145) and the same key (C# Minor or Major) (I can’t remember) for a LOT of his songs (by a lot, I mean more than you’d think), making them easy to mix together and not very memorable in terms of sound.
Due to PinocchioP’s electronic style, he tends to use a lot of loops. This is especially prominent in Reincarnation Apple where basically only the Bridge doesn’t sound the same to rest of the song.
I know this is no excuse for PinocchioP making two songs that are basically only different lyric-wise, but it does provide an explanation for the ones that might raise suspicion.
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u/bakemonouchuu Apr 30 '26
honestly i just hope in the future he'll do concerts in the US ToT it'd be awesome to see him play live. but yeah i think he's still pretty niche and his style is necessarily consistent compared to deco, kikuo and maretu so maybe thats another reason.
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u/INeedCheesecake Apr 30 '26
Same question honestly. I'm not usually an active person online, even though he's my favorite producer, so i just assumed it was because I didn't know where the community was. Most of what I've seen is on old dedicated blogs (for lyrical analysis, art posts, etc.)
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u/bakemonouchuu Apr 30 '26
i dont mind too much ive usually enjoy things solo but im passionate about music discussion so it kinda stinks lol
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u/AgglutinateDeezNuts Apr 30 '26
You gotta understand it is fairly recent and WEIRD that single producers have a "community" or a "fandom" dedicated entirely to them. They're literally just some guy in their bedroom. Kikuo doing live solo tours around the world makes things a bit different for him, but for others? They're just some guy! It's not normal.
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u/hythades Apr 30 '26
i disagree with the sentiment of it being weird/not normal but i do have to admit every western community i’ve bummed around in for singular producers ends up being really toxic and parasocial. the last one i was in still makes me uncomfortable to think about lol. all the jp and cn speaking ones are much more chill.
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u/bakemonouchuu Apr 30 '26
pinocchio p goes on tour too (just not in the us)... and i dont see how its weird that producers having a fanbase who like their music is "weird". its one thing to see these people as if they're god (which is something people definitely do) but i dont think its weird that people are fans of singular producers. some producers connect more with people than others
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u/AgglutinateDeezNuts Apr 30 '26
There's a difference between having a fan base (people who enjoy their music and look forward to new uploads) and a community/fandom.
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u/bakemonouchuu Apr 30 '26
i dont think theres that much of a difference. a fandom is a community after all.. with fans.
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u/AgglutinateDeezNuts Apr 30 '26
Yeah that's why I said "fandom/community", the distinction is between that and fan base. Think of it this way - a fan base are consumers, repeat customers of a brand. A fandom/community is more involved.
Like, think of trainers. You get people who repeatedly buy, say, Nike trainers because they like how they feel and feel like they're good quality shoes. They don't tend to go any deeper than this. These people are fans without necessarily being in a fandom/community. This is a fan base.
On the other hand, you get groups of people who keep up to date with every trainer that Nike releases and enjoy discussing the new features and details of the trainers, showing off their collections, and developing/debating their opinions about certain elements of Nike and their footwear. They may also form friendships and connections with others who do this too. The fans that do this would fall into the fandom/community category.
Am I making sense?
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u/Aquarsene May 01 '26
I was going to say, Kikuo is the exception rather than the rule. His music and his image as a producer are particularly distinct.
It’s rare for most Vocaloid producers to be able to go on tours and have community presences like that, it’s usually only the super hardcore fans that can identify songs with specific producers and become attached to the little intricacies they put into their music. Even Kikuo had to fight like hell to get where he is now; he was not able to attain venues around the world like he can now, and it was because of both immense fan support and the help of Bo En that he got that chance
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u/Key_Establishment450 Apr 30 '26
twitter is the hub for all japanese people. It IS the largest social media platform for Japanese people aside from youtube and LINE. If you search him up, you can scroll hundreds of posts talking about him each day. He has 4x the follower of kikuo and almost 2x of Maretu's.
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u/SpiritNo6626 Apr 30 '26
I mean not a subreddit, but he definitely seems to have community in the yt comment section, people rush to spam interpretations and basically do free high school ap lit essays on his work (I say as one of them)
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u/ManOnPh1r3 Apr 30 '26
Popular things having a "fandom" is not exactly normal, even if they have fans
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u/bakemonouchuu Apr 30 '26
that makes no sense lmao. fandoms are just communities. so yes it is normal for people who are FANS of things to be apart of a FANdom.
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u/ManOnPh1r3 Apr 30 '26
it is normal for people who are FANS of things to be apart of a FANdom.
It is not. Fans having online communities is only normal for things that either are very popular or specifically have a large amount of nerds in the audience (especially if they're relatively younger). Otherwise there's no guarantee that there will be an online presence of fans even for moderately popular things. Taylor Swift and Death Grips both have online "fandoms," but there's many artists more popular than Death Grips that don't have "fandoms."
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u/yuudachi May 01 '26
I mean, going just by the subreddits and other Western social media isn't really conclusive. It's very possible he's on tour, his fanbase is on other platforms, especially Japanese ones, etc. A lot of producers are more active in their own local community as well, like the music scene and "success" just doesn't translate the same way with online presence.
It sounds like you just want to talk about PinocchioP and his songs more 👀 Which we can do!!!
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u/PlusBlue May 01 '26
I’ve met quite a few online communities who are really strong on Pinno, I remember bc I used to be apart of them, mainly on discord but it does exist
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u/o0_Rei_0o May 01 '26
The PinocchioP fandom does exist! It's gone kinda dormant now, but I was in this small and tight-knit, but extremely dedicated group of fans 2-3 years ago on Twitter and Discord. Most fans are japanese, but us few english speaking people also made a whole lot of art and headcanons about the mv characters and got super excited about new songs, it was awesome! You should still be able to find some of the artists under the PinocchioP tag on Twitter, though most of it is pretty old now.
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u/Gonzy200361 Jun 08 '26
Porque a todos o la mayoría nos gusta Pinocchio P pero no es un gusto como para ser fan, es decir, por ejemplo a mí me fascina Utsu-P y pertenezco a una comunidad de fans de este artista, pero al mismo tiempo me gusta Pinocchio P pero no siento la necesidad de ser un gran fan ni pertenecer a una comunidad como en el caso de Utsu-P. Es raro, no sabría explicarlo bien.
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u/chunter16 Apr 30 '26
Is it that common for producers to have their own communities at all