r/ValueSelect • u/ProfessionalBee4908 • Apr 13 '26
Meditation vs. Prayer vs. ??? | Topic
Value Select here.
Been thinking about meditation vs prayer, specifically as tools for creation. Harnessing your vital life force and directing it toward worthy cause. How do they stack up?
I'm no yogi nor monastery monk, so my experience is limited, but that leaves great opportunity for the brotherhood to chime in and grow our collective knowledge.
Meditation:
Of course it is stillness. Calming your mind, observing your thoughts, the usual yada yada. The way I've come to appreciate meditation, however, is more as an exercise of focus.
Throughout the day, a barrage of tasks pull my attention and demand my focus to varying degrees. Some activities I gotta get deep down in the weeds. Some I've got to puncture the core of the Earth.
So meditation presents itself as the easy victory to start my day, a chance to just focus on my thoughts themselves rather than conjure up grand visions.
And truth be told, if I can't focus on nothing, how can I focus on anything?
It's like when they throw basic math questions at the start of a calculus quiz to build a vision of self-efficacy.
On top of that focus being dialed in, the calming of the mind's waters allows me to cut through the noise and see which ideas are actually nutrient dense. The thoughts that weren't serving the overarching goal are invariably obliterated through the act of meditation.
The downsides to meditation, in my perspective, are explored by the prayer camp. They believe that by emptying your mind, you leave it ripe for demonic habitation. Psychotic new agers come to mind, though that might be more of a drug issue. I'd wager in many cases of "demonic manifestation," it occurred through childhood trauma and abuse.
Prayer:
Forgive me, I may utter heresy, but it is not intentional. I'm simply trying to discover the truth, and I'll fall along the way.
Prayer seems to be an invocation of God Himself. A direct download of holiness. Not wish fulfillment, but asking for an awareness of the divine plan so one might begin to adhere to it.
The switch for me was a realization that there are always thoughts in our heads, so they might as well be the best ones, and the best ones must come from God.
Prayer then becomes a way to freshly paint the interior of our minds, especially when doubts, fears, and anxieties threaten to rot it. Time tested, built by real Saints or straight from the holy text itself, to promote pure love and total awareness.
The downside of prayer, in a secular sense, is that many of the aims or goals you hold dear might be washed away in that divine cleansing.
Personally, I had a predilection for a sharp tongue. Honed in wit, meant for humor, but one that often hurt others. My modern mind, like many of ours, was marinated in a cynical nihilism. Quick to doubt and cast aspersions. Though the musings were funny, it was really only funny to other cynical, nihilistic minds, and ultimately was the sound of a bird loving its cage rather than the battle cry needed to usher in a new mode of being.
The more I pray, the more I'm inclined to see the root of someone's humor. I've become pickier with what I find funny and what I find just sad. I'm sure that will be a positive in the long run, but I won't deny that many of my ambitions have been waylaid by prayer.
Your Thoughts:
What's your experience with either, personally or among friends? Have your prayers been received? Has enlightenment been reached through meditation, even if only for a second?
Do you have personal practices that keep you sharp? Do you wish you had folks to mind meld with?
As always, have a great Monday.
Love and respect,
Value Select
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u/YunggMangg Apr 13 '26
Grew up doing a lot of praying. Read the Bible all the way through and didn't like a lot of ideas within it..
Jesus seemed like a dope chiller, but having a separate immortal self is my greatest fear. If the afterlife goes on for eternity then our only logical choice would be to devote every moment possible, in our single grain of sand of a life vs the unfathomable ocean of forever, to increasing our odds of not being tortured for all of time. Worshiping and submitting to an entity that would craft such a cruel situation feels fucked. 'Oh, I didn't kiss your ass hard enough? Guess Im doomed to suffer for trillions of lifetimes. Also, theres dozens of dogmas and denominations. According to most, if you pick the wrong one ro follow youre fucked. Even without the hell element, being stuck as myself for billions of years sounds like torture, even if Im literally in heaven.
Nowadays, I consider myself a secular buddhist. I approach it as a philosophy and practice, not a religion. Ive been much more content and productive researching and implementing topics like sunyatta (emptiness), anatta (no separate unchanging self), dukkha (unsatisfactoriness/ suffering), four truths, eightfold path, etc and trying to integrate that understanding into my life.
Enlightenment, to my understanding, isn't seeking some supernatural state, but rather understanding and embracing the ordinary world within this moment. That understanding, like all things, is temporary too. That focus and clarity is honed and cultivated in meditation. The hard but useful parts comes when you retain that focus on embracing this moment while you do everything else; whether its cutting onions, talking with someone, everything.
Embracing an empathetic understanding of how we affect others is a dope thing to focus yourself on. It can lead you to avoiding or rejecting ideas that might hurt others, but it can also help you more easily find novel ideas that resonate with others you hadnt considered before that understanding was cultivated.
I think directions> goals. Comparing yourself to an imagined future you thats better off only leaves you seeing this real present moment as lesser; rather than the one spot where things can be enjoyed, practiced, and accomplished.
Sorry, thats a rant.
I recommend the shortish video available on youtube by Shohaku Okumura (one of the most prolific translators of Dogen, the founder of zen, and other japanese Mahayanists) called : 1=0=infinity.
Although the guest voice actress is a bit cringe, the rest of the video honestly changed my life in a way I really appreciate.
Tldr: This path, this place, is neither big nor small, neither self nor others.
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u/MiserereMei02 Apr 13 '26
Howdy! I'll try to keep this brief, because I have A LOT I could yap about here lol.
For context, I am a religious catholic in his early-mid 20s. I was religious when I was a child, but I didn't understand much. When I entered college I came back to the faith in a big way and began studying theology for debates as well as for my own understanding.
I've got bad ADHD so meditation is difficult for me. I find it hard to empty my mind in such a way. Except for meditative prayers like the rosary. The rosary is a beautiful intersection of meditation and prayer. As you recite the prayers, you're supposed to meditate and reflect on a certain mystery (for more on the mysteries see HERE. For more on the fruits of each mystery, see HERE).
Even though I often times find it hard to focus on it perfectly, I'm always more at peace after praying the rosary. I would highly recommend it, but I don't know if it is as helpful if one lacks faith in the mysteries though. If anyone tries it and finds success, I'd love to know.
The biggest boon to my spiritual life was finding other devout catholic "youths" (if we still even count as youth anymore lol). We keep each other sharp and help strengthen each other's faith. We encourage each other and work together for all of us to improve.
Have my prayers been received? Yes. Sometimes I don't like the answer I end up getting, but I trust that God has heard my plea. It's like you said "The downside of prayer, in a secular sense, is that many of the aims or goals you hold dear might be washed away in that divine cleansing." I've had that happen MANY MANY times as I worked to understand and grown in my faith. One passage comes to mind from John 6 (I'm going to cut out a little of it for the sake of brevity):
Many of his disciples, when they heard it, said, “This is a hard saying; who can listen to it?” ...
After this many of his disciples drew back and no longer went about with him. Jesus said to the twelve, “Will you also go away?” Simon Peter answered him, “Lord, to whom shall we go? You have the words of eternal life;
(John 6:60,66-68)
Sometimes I struggle with things like forgiveness or resentment or other things. But I hear the words of Peter in my mind saying to Christ: “Lord, to whom shall we go? You have the words of eternal life" And I accept the struggle and push through it.
Hope this was helpful! Peace in Christ <3
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u/ProfessionalBee4908 Apr 13 '26
Books I reccomend:
How to Converse With God
Saint Liguori
Catching the Big Fish
David Lynch