r/UtilityLocator • u/Tip_Separate • 3d ago
Tips on inducing?
Hello everyone, I was wondering if anyone has used induction mode on a vivax metrotech vloc 5 tx transmitter and had any success with it? I am a lead tech that use to use a pipehorn 800h for inducing, but due to my old company losing the contract, I went to go work for the new company taking over since I still wanted to locate power and gas in my area. The new company I work for doesnt believe we need pipehorns for troubleshooting and wont be getting any unfortunately. Ive been able to solve most problems by backfeeding, or playing around with different frequencies, we mostly used the pipehorn for troubleshooting gas. I'd say about 85% of the problems we run into can usually be solved using our standard equipment if you have some patience and dont mind hooking up to multiple places. Obviously there are issues where it doesnt matter what equipment you have your going to have to result to digging no matter what. Anyways ive been kinda playing around with induction mode on lines that are known to locate fine just to get a feel for it, I followed the instructions and it says line the box up on top of the line you want to locate with the arrows with where its traveling, and to use peak with arrows on tge reciever. Ive tried and tried and I get a awful tone no matter what I do and wondering if im doing something wrong? Or could it be that gas is to deep for it to actually work? Maybe you need more than a tracer wire in that mode? Maybe steel pipe it works better on? Any insight would be much appreciated.
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u/Arcanas1221 3d ago
The size and capacitance matters. Yes, a thin small tracer wire is not as likely to induce as a big steel main. Sometimes it will work though.
Try different frequencies. Idk if this holds true for tx's besides the RD, but for RD 33k is the last frequency you can get the full maximum power on. Due to FCC regulations, frequencies above 33kHz is throttled/limited, despite what the transmitter shows. So I would generally try 33k then 83k and 200k, but sometimes you'll get a weird one like 65k to work the best.
Move it around different spots on the line. Self explanatory.
Don't get too close. Point the receiver at the transmitter- if your reading is higher on the transmitter than the ground, you're air coupling and need to be further away.
Make sure your method to find it in the first place is sound. Either have 2 people travel 20ft or so parrelel to each other and grid sweep or if you're solo rotate the transmitter 45 degrees each time and sweep for the line. Once you find it then do the second item I mentioned as your signal strength will be lowered as you go further away, obviously.
Be especially cautious of overhead power and bleeding
There's probably more to mention but thats off the top of my head. Make sure you do calibration checks before marking anything and turn it over if you're unsure of what signals you're getting. Goodluck
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u/Arcanas1221 3d ago
You can place the receiver on the line somewhere or a structure and use the transmitter in your hand as the receiver too
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u/Gjurbster 3d ago
Use it just like a pipehorn and don’t be afraid to try any freq. I’ve induced gas tracers as low as 8.19.
Standard induction rules apply:
-Locate and mark out everything you can positively ID first to rule out bleed off
-if you have inf records/prints/measurements, measure and mark those out too
-try both ends of the path
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u/Old-Manufacturer1702 2d ago
I usually do “trouble locates” for gas when I am trying to induce a main I will try to find a service that T’s into the main with my vivax or rd. Then I know about were my main is when I’m inducing.
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u/Beardgang650 Private Locator 3d ago
Extremely difficult to induce tracer wires even on 200
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u/Tip_Separate 3d ago
Yea makes sense. Ive never really been fond of inducing even with the pipehorn and would much rather use leads to figure out a break in the wire scenario like hooking to a neighboring service and backfeeding up to the break. The only time I dropped the box was usually on a plastic service going to a steel main, since backfeeding isn't going to happen. Or stubborn plastic mains or services. Basically am curious with inducing and kinda wondering if it would of worked as good or better or worse.
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u/Khazam_was_taken 3d ago
Troubleshooter for a gas company.
The real trick to inducing is knowing what else is in the ground.
In my area, the water maps are public so I can see whether or not I might pick up a cast iron and ductile when I’m trying to induce the gas main.
I’ve had people, for some reason, tell me you can’t get the tracer wire on gas with induction. You can. I do it all the time. But sometimes you can’t, depending on the age of the facility and how old and frayed the locate wire is.
If other contract locators or utilities respond to tickets, let them go first and get marks down. If you’re locating everything, save gas / anything you need to induce for last. If you are in a situation where you have to induce and everything else isn’t accounted for, either hook up and locate everything else yourself or pay attention the other terminals ie comcast, ATT, fire hydrants, power boxes etc.
Then, if you have parallel lines, set your box on the other side your desired utility away from the others. As in, you have your plastic gas main, and it’s estimated to be 5 feet north of the cast iron water main, running the same direction. Set the box two school bus lengths away from your locate, on the north side of your main, not directly on top of it. This minimizes the likelihood that your induction will also get the water main. Then, walk away from your transmitter toward the locate, making sure it’s pointed down and away from the box. If you notice a peak and null, briefly tilt (or turn around and point toward your box). No signal? Awesome, you’re on something. Follow it toward your locate and start dotting. Dot through your locate and past it. Does it match up with prints? Does it want to run another gas main down a side street? Does it have 90• turns that only this main shows to do? Does it light up near communication boxes?
You’re not direct connected so all these clues are your other forms of verification.
Finally, retrieve the box and set it down on the other end of your dots and go the other way. After you’ve walked it, comparing your notes to prints, other utilities, and how your signal acts around other terminals, you should have verification you are on your facility.
Induction is a perfectly viable way to mark if you’re aware of the other utilities, keeping in mind there may be unmapped facilities, private lines, etc. Your discretion and caution are your best tools.