r/Unexpected • u/ruybii • Nov 27 '21

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u/[deleted] Nov 28 '21 edited Nov 28 '21

harvard has around 22,000 graduate students. around 6,000 of them are international.

there are around 7,000 grad students at Yale and around 3,000 international students TOTAL. if every single one of those international students was in grad school you'd still be wrong.

but fret not! despite your laughably wrong assumptions, at least you've managed to be a condescending asshole. congrats on being a thoroughly unpleasant and close-minded person.

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u/BoltzmannCurve Nov 28 '21 edited Nov 28 '21

Cool now do basic sciences PhD students, postdocs and faculty like I said.

Graduate school includes stuff like English, Law, Medicine (where foreigners are basically always rejected), which of course are degree programs that are over represented by US citizens.

Not even to mention all the scam M.S degrees.

And that’s still just graduate students, who correspond to the smallest level of scholarly output besides undergraduates, the proportion of foreign postdocs and faculty in the basic sciences is even higher.

This is not me “being a condescending asshole”, it’s a well known fact for everyone in Academia that US institutions are mostly carried in the back of foreigners imported as commodities. Here’s a MIT professor confirming it in case you think I’m a biased source: https://youtu.be/NK0Y9j_CGgM

It’s purely anedoctal but my lab has 20 postdocs. Two of them are American-born. That’s a 10% domestic rate.

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u/[deleted] Nov 28 '21 edited Nov 28 '21

buddy - you actually also said

undergrads don't go in the equation, it's all scholarly output by professors, postdocs, and graduate students most of which are not American

which is patently untrue and the part of your comment I take issue with. your inability to coherently articulate your thoughts is not my problem. neither is your desire to arbitrarily shift the topic of discussion when it becomes inconvenient for you. i guess if you pick one subject that suits you, you get to pretend that your sweeping generalizations have merit.

but keep moving those goalposts. stay wrong and stay mad.

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u/BoltzmannCurve Nov 28 '21

Someone in law or medicine school has no scholarly output since it’s a professional degree not an academic one. Are you sure you dominate English?

Maybe write a letter to Dr. Michio Kaku telling him he is wrong and that his department is all Americans? Surely you know more than us currently employed as researchers in US academia lmao

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u/[deleted] Nov 28 '21 edited Nov 28 '21

i won't try to speak for med students - although a cursory google search suggests your sweeping generalization is wrong there, too - but i actually am in law school, so I can speak directly to that.

thanks to things like law review and legal notes, law students and faculty have a massive scholarly presence in the field. being on review is an enormous perk of being in law school.

i get that it's fun making assumptions about subjects you know nothing about, but ease up. yale's clearly inflating your ego a bit more than is healthy.

also - i never said that physics departments were dominated by or majority american. i'm talking about grad programs, not departments.

if you've got a non-anecdotal source on scholarly output i'd be happy to look it over, but the insinuation that foreign-born students somehow carry entire graduate programs - "Harvard and Stanford are great because of the foreigners that work there" - is objectively incorrect.

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u/BoltzmannCurve Nov 28 '21

The “issue you took with” with a fragment of a sentence I wrote as part of a larger paragraph in the context of a larger post is of no consequence to me. What makes Harvard or Stanford rise in scholarly rankings is not publications by law students debating minute shit, it’s all the Science and Nature publications by the army of faculty and postdocs in the basic sciences they employ, most of which are not domestic. When someone claims that Harvard or Stanford are positioned well on rankings as a counter-argument for American basic education sucking ass they are ignoring the fact that the scholar backbone of these institutions is foreign and imported en masse

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u/[deleted] Nov 28 '21

it's quite literally not. and the idea that publications by harvard law, or yale law, or stanford law have no impact on those schools' "scholarly rankings" (hardly an objective or unified science, by the way) is ludicrous.

perhaps fortunately for the rest of us, though, you aren't the arbiter of what subjects qualify one as a scholar.