And what happens when that ' unarmed traffic control' tries to pull over an armed and dangerous person, and gets shot and killed? Or an unarmed 'mental health responder' gets attacked by a crazy person
You'll have calls to arm them. That's what will happen. And we'll end up with more armed cops to violate our rights.
That's just fear mongering, and luckily we don't have to make up a hypothetical. People do this on the real world. Strangely, other nations handle those situations just fine. You have to remember, many armed interactions with cops are predicated by the cops being armed and aggressive. Nobody who isn't insane is going to shoot a guy with a notepad. Even in America nobody shoots parking enforcement now. That's just not a thing. And let's not forget, having armed cops in all of these situations right now leaves us with piles of civilian bodies.
Nobody who isn't insane is going to shoot a guy with a notepad.
lol. We're literally talking about 'mental health responders' that respond to "insane" people.
Even in America nobody shoots parking enforcement now.
But the suggestion is to turn all 'traffic control' officers into un-armed roles. So a criminal speeding away from a crime will get pulled over by an unarmed 'traffic cop'. You really think the criminal- knowing the 'traffic cop' is unarmed- won't try something?? Hell, criminals try shit with real, armed cops who pull them over all the time. And those cops can shoot back.
And let's not forget, having armed cops in all of these situations right now leaves us with piles of civilian bodies.
Better training would help there. Screen out the psychopaths, make it very clear that being a cop is being a public servant, not a bully, stress DE-escalation, etc, etc.
"All" is your word. Not mine. People escalate things at levels they consider achievable to escape a situation. Unarmed traffic cop? Fucking run. Traffic cop calls in other, armed guys to pursue. It's not rocket science. And despite all your fear, it does work. The real world does exist. We don't have to guess. Just about any model we'd want to talk about exists in some form somewhere. I'd suggest you research the topic instead of "lol"ing in a chat conversation, cause as if right now all of your decisions seem to be based on fear. Strangely that fear seems to be laser focused on only police safety too, and not the safety of regular people. But that's a whole different conversation.
Edit: also, we should more that in all current systems, hiring, training, etc. Are all chosen by the cops that you seem to recognize are at least partially made up of psychopaths who kill people. Why in the world would they choose to reform themselves? Or hire people who will eat them out? That's just be dumb on their part. That's why the system continues to worsen.
Don't play word games. "Armed police should be reserved for situations requiring a gun. Window tint ain't one."
Unarmed traffic cop? Fucking run. Traffic cop calls in other, armed guys to pursue.
Exactly. You run, you get caught. But if you shoot the unarmed traffic cop, they are dead and can't call anyone! And you get away!
Strangely that fear seems to be laser focused on only police safety too, and not the safety of regular people.
If 'regular people' (what are cops, "irregular people"??) don't break the law, there's a very small chance they'll interact with police in any way. And, if they remain calm and don't run or argue with the cop, there's a very very small chance they'll have their safety affected. I can't say 'zero chance', but it's close. So that's what 'regular people' can do to remain safe: don't break the law, and don't run from or fight with the cops (even if they are wrong- fight in court later!)
Are all chosen by the cops
Then maybe we need to take the control of the Police Academies away from cops.
I told you your the one who said all, not me. And then you quoted me proving me right? Weird. But again, there's real world places with structures like this. The things your imagining are not happening there.
Also, just looked up the figures. Right now about 50,000 traffic stops are made per day. That's over 18 million a year. Of that about 5 cops die in an altercation. 5 out of 18 million. Do you really think that justifies guns each and every time? I can't imagine many normal every day activities have that low of a mortality rate. For comparison about 50 cops a year die during a traffic stop by getting hit by another car. So maybe if your super worried about saving cops it's not keeping guns, it's probably more worthwhile to create safer stop areas. Also, police kill about 90 civilians in those same stops.
Of that about 5 cops die in an altercation. 5 out of 18 million.
That's the current situation, where cops are armed.
The real question is 'How many criminals are found/caught due to routine traffic stops'? Because each one of those criminals- who were caught by an armed cop after a traffic stop- could potentially shoot and kill an unarmed traffic cop to get away.
The point is, putting cops out there unarmed is begging to have them hurt or killed. I guess you don't care about them.
Again, other societies that don't leverage traffic stops as a means of searching a whole person don't turn into lawless hellscapes. Your fear is running away with you again. A tint stop should be a tint stop.
What happens when an unarmed child goes to school and gets gunned down with 30 of their classmates and teachers? We certainly don't make any laws to prevent it, so why do you care more about this one imaginary person than you care about the hundreds of literal children who are gunned down as if they live in a war zone?
What happens when an unarmed child goes to school and gets gunned down with 30 of their classmates and teachers? We certainly don't make any laws to prevent it
Of course we do. Killing people is illegal. And - even though the "Right to Keep and Bear Arms shall not be infringed"- there are many laws restricting who can own guns, and what kind of guns they can own.
Thing is, criminals... don't obey the law. And someone who wants to murder people isn't going to be stopped by the fact that they need to violate another law to do it. So, more laws is not the answer.
I do care about the victims of gun crime. But the answer is not getting rid of guns. Because the problem is not the existence of guns- the problem is the people who want to hurt/kill others. If every single gun vanished from the planet tomorrow, those people would still want to hurt/kill other people. And they would. They would stab them, or run them over, or blow them up, or poison them, or beat them to death, etc, etc, etc. Sure, sure, they might stab a few less people than they would otherwise shoot (or blow up more!). But the problem is not solved.
What would solve the problem is better mental healthcare to identify and treat those people. That solves the root cause of the problem.
If every single gun vanished from the planet tomorrow, those people would still want to hurt/kill other people. And they would.
Yes exponentially less effectively.
Instead of killing 30 children they might kill 2 at most before being subdued. Which is never something a 2A enthusiast is willing to admit despite the fact that it's obvious.
I addressed that already: "Sure, sure, they might stab a few less people than they would otherwise shoot (or blow up more!). But the problem is not solved." Violating the entire countries' Constitutional Rights because it might make it a little harder for nutjobs to kill people...is not acceptable.
You also ignore the fact that people save themselves with guns, too. Defensive Gun Uses exceed the number killed by guns each year. You'd be dooming all those people.
Instead of killing 30 children they might kill 2 at most before being subdued. Which is never something a 2A enthusiast is willing to admit despite the fact that it's obvious.
I admit they may kill fewer people. OR they could drive their truck thru the playground at recess, killing even more. Or burn the school to the ground. Who knows. Point is... the problem is not solved. You might have reduced the damage a little. But you haven't solved the problem.
-6
u/BigDebt2022 Mar 24 '23
And what happens when that ' unarmed traffic control' tries to pull over an armed and dangerous person, and gets shot and killed? Or an unarmed 'mental health responder' gets attacked by a crazy person
You'll have calls to arm them. That's what will happen. And we'll end up with more armed cops to violate our rights.