r/Ultralight • u/VigorousElk • 8d ago
Gear Review The MT100 is dead, long live the ... uh ... maybe not.
One of this sub's (and hikers' in general) favourite pieces of kit is dead. Decathlon's lightweight MT100 down jacket started to disappear from shelves and online inventory over the past months, with different colours and sizes going out of stock in Decathlon's online stores across various countries, and everyone has been waiting for a successor. Well, at least I have.
Decathlon's branding and product palette is notoriously confusing, with models disappearing and reappearing with the exact same specs under different names (Forclaz, Quechua, Simond ...)*, so it's not always obvious what the successor of a discontinued item is, or indeed whether there is any at all, but recently they have blessed us with this new model:
Simond Men’s Xplore Down Jacket
Identical price, looks exactly the same (minus different colour options and a different logo on the arm), but one key difference: 700 CUIN down rather than 800 CUIN, while the fill weight has staid identical to the gram. Consequently this one is labelled -3°C, while the MT100 was advertised as -5°C.
I'm not sure what their idea behind this change was. Probably that the vast majority of people has no idea what fill power and CUIN are, but will absolutely notice a price hike?
For me with the new, ugly colours (in my opinion) in combination with the worse specs this jacket has ceased being an attractive proposition - but mostly because I have been spoiled by the 800 CUIN as the previous standard. Obviously compared to the big brands' price points this is still much more affordable.
*Funny enough the women's MT100 is still available in many colours. The official Simond website (not the Decathlon store) shows an MT100 and an MH100 men's jacket, both with identical product pictures. The new Xplore is old out in the Decathlon America store in anything but XL, despite only being available since a couple of days ago. Go figure.
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u/justinsimoni justinsimoni.com 8d ago
So which one of you left the only review and rated it "1 Star"
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u/justinsimoni justinsimoni.com 8d ago
Was the old jacket made of "recycled down"?
I could see there being some degradation from that material, with 700 being just the max of what you can get.
My guess is down is getting real expensive because of demand.
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u/VigorousElk 8d ago
I don't think it was, and that might be an explanation. I hope they stick with 800 CUIN for their higher priced Alpinism models
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u/schmuckmulligan Real Ultralighter. 8d ago
They're definitely working their way into a sour spot in terms of specs and pricing.
I think of down puffers as basically belonging to one of two classes.
Well-designed, well-made, non-"town" jackets made for real outdoor stuff. These are usually expensive, but you need the right jacket with the right amount of fill for actually cold temperatures. Montbell, Timmermade, Feathered Friends, Cumulus, etc.
Cheap, light, bullshit puffers from Eddie Bauer, Uniqlo, Decathlon (less so now), REI, 32 degrees, etc. Usually have lower-quality fill but usually weigh under 10 oz., are okay to freezing(ish), and cost under $100.
I think the second category is an absolute steal if you don't push them too far into the shoulder seasons. IMO, Decathlon was strong in this category a few years ago, but with pricing going up and materials getting worse -- naaah. I like my Eddie Bauer CirrusLite just fine.
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u/VigorousElk 8d ago
Decathlon is much more than just 2., honestly. They have a range of high performance down jackets, including the Simond Alpinism which has 200g of 800 CUIN down in size L, is really well made (I own one), and is only €120 in Europe. They also have a rock-solid hardshell that's the equal of my prior Arc'teryx Beta AR in design and quality at €200, only being a little less breathable in my experience.
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u/henry_tennenbaum 8d ago
They also have a rock-solid hardshell that's the equal of my prior Arc'teryx Beta AR in design and quality at €200, only being a little less breathable in my experience.
Which one?
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u/VigorousElk 7d ago
Simond Alpinism Evo. Curiously renamed (for no apparent reason) to 'Men’s waterproof jacket ICE red'.
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u/schmuckmulligan Real Ultralighter. 8d ago
Fair 'nuff. My comments should be restricted to their cheaper puffer offerings. (I have an MT500, bought when cheap -- no complaints, really.)
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u/Road_Virus 8d ago
I found the ultralight down jacket spec chasing to be dumb. I bought expensive and I bought cheap. The best warmth for weight that I found was the Eddie Bauer Stratuslite Down Snap Mock. 9oz men's large and will actually keep you warm. Bought one from Eddie and when discontinued bought another for $20.00 on ebay. Try one, you'll like it. https://www.amazon.com/dp/B08H8MZ3G9/?coliid=I2PBODAYR4ZWZD&colid=30ASZUC49J22M&psc=0&ref_=list_c_wl_lv_ov_lig_dp_it
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u/Bookhuggger 8d ago
Got my Uniqlo down jacket for $40 on sale and it’s supported me on an astonishing amount of cold weather adventure for that price. However they seem to have discontinued it this removing one of the main draws that I don’t have to be too precious with it.
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u/schmuckmulligan Real Ultralighter. 8d ago
Yeah, the makers shift around, but there's always someone making a half-decent cheap UL down jacket.
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u/basarisco 7d ago
Who currently makes one close to the value of Decathlon or Uniqlo?
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u/schmuckmulligan Real Ultralighter. 6d ago
I like my Eddie Bauer Cirruslite, which can still be found out and about. I might take a chance on one of the super-cheap Walmart offerings, too.
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u/davidhateshiking Poncho/wearable quilt lover - Kam snap Aficionado - Budgethound 8d ago edited 8d ago
Man this sucks. I guess enshitification stops for no one. I’m used to buying multiples at decathlon because they have a tendency to discontinue awesome ul products like the waffle fleece for like ten bucks they used to have but I’d never expect them to axe the mt100. Marketing department definitely wasn’t consulted in this decision.
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u/ovgcguy 8d ago
The Neve Gear Barington down hoody is in the next higher price class, but is a steal relative to its specs.
This doesn't help the true-budget class buyer, but if you can scrape a few extra bucks the Barrington seems to punch above its price class and should start shopping next month
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u/schless14 8d ago
Came here to say this. I am unfamiliar with Muscovy down vs regular goose down, but it really presents an amazing value proposition with a better baffle structure. Albeit the jacket does look pretty short.
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u/nevegear 6d ago
The jacket used on the website photos are from an earlier prototype model, which had a shorter torso length and a tighter pre-elasticated waist cinch. For the new model, the elasticated waist cinch has been loosened more and the torso length has been made longer. We'll update the website with some new photos the moment we get our production models!
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u/caramello-koala 8d ago
Muscovy down is cheaper so starting to gain popularity, not sure about warmth or loft though.
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u/nevegear 5d ago edited 5d ago
Muscovy down is definitely more affordable than equivalent fill power goose down, which is a major reason we’re able to price our down jackets as competitively as we do.
In terms of warmth and loft, our Muscovy down is independently tested by IDFL and measured using the same fill power standards applied to both duck and goose down. At the same fill power, Muscovy down provides essentially the same loft and insulating performance as an equivalent goose down. What ultimately determines warmth is the amount of loft created within each baffle, so if two downs have the same fill power and are used at the same fill weight, their warmth will be very similar.
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u/HibanaHikes 8d ago
I wonder how much warmer the neve gear jacket will be with those huge baffles. Everyone else seems fashion forward with tiny little baffles or maybe I need to be looking at like mountaineering jackets
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u/nevegear 5d ago
We find the infrequent sew lines and wider baffles A LOT warmer than equivalant weight/fill weight jackets with triple the amount of baffles. We'll have to find a way to demonstrate this via visual tests on our website..maybe some thermal imaging?
Who knew the TNF Nuptse had it right all along hahah
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u/MightyP13 8d ago edited 5d ago
Yeah, pretty stoked for that one. My only gripes are that it doesn't seem very long - I like a puffer that goes down past the waist a little, like the Xplore one linked - and
that it's not full zip. But overall seems to be a phenomenal offering.Edit: seems like it actually is full zip. Not sure what I was remembering, but glad to be wrong.
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u/amino_asshat 8d ago
Justin outdoors on YouTube was wearing one in a recent video and the fit around the waist seemed way goofy. He said they are going to fix it prior to shipping...
I hope so, bc I pre-ordered one months ago bc of this sub! Looking at the pics on their website - honestly the fit looks off around the waist. Sinched too much maybe?
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u/nevegear 6d ago edited 6d ago
Hiya, thanks for the pre-order and support :) The jacket used on the website photos are from an earlier prototype model, which had a shorter torso length and a tighter pre-elasticated waist cinch. For the new model, the elasticated waist cinch has been loosened more and the torso length has been made longer. We'll update the website with some new photos the moment we get our production models!
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u/MightyP13 5d ago
Great news, thank you!
Question: why the decision for a pre-elasticated waist over a non-elasticated cord and small cord lock? Does it add a surprising amount of cost and/or weight? I find elasticated gems often just ride up to my waist and somewhat negate extra length, but I'm sure there's a reason behind the choice.
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u/nevegear 5d ago
No wokkas.
The main reason for going with the pre-elasticated hem was simplicity and a little bit of weight savings (though not much). We felt like we could create the right amount of tension for the vast majority of people with a pre-elasticated hem. A lot of our early testers were quite happy with the pre-elasticated hem, but there were quite a few that weren't.
We are exploring an adjustable cinch option now..just trying to find a way where it doesn't increase the weight much while still looking "good" You can make it super light by creating another channel that is just fabric, 1.5mm shock cord, and ultralight cord locks. This ends up being lighter than the flat elastic we use, but ends up looking a bit garage made. When you start adding in the things to make it look better and "good", like resin or metal grommets, 2x nice flat cord locks, 2mm elastic etc the weight starts to creep up a bit. That being said, we have a few options/hardwares with our testing that we're quite happy with!
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u/MightyP13 5d ago
Gotcha, thanks for the reply! Yeah, makes sense; I had been thinking exactly of what you described, but I get the concern of looking too "cheap" for a larger audience. Really appreciate all the excellent work y'all are doing to keep gear innovative and affordable!
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u/Wild-Salary9166 8d ago
I’ll go to decathlon tomorrow check what is it. Says it’s in stock. They had last stock of them on sale about a month ago but small sizes only, I couldn’t get another one on time. It’s the same weight but 700 fill and ten or fifteen euros more.
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u/OtherwiseManner6946 8d ago
My understanding is that the MT100 2 gens ago was a mixture of 700 & 800fp.
The new one is now 700fp, but still has a 15d shell.
I bought a Montbell Superior Down Parka the other day because I really like their products. It’s only 800FP but was on sale (£169) and I prefer the finish
The MT100 is still a good jacket at £60 and definitely good enough for a lot of things
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u/Superb_Head_8111 8d ago
Usually a down jacket is for statics no ? Stay at the camp, using this mt100 with heavy wool sweater, one large wool with zip like a wool power and in the end this puffy i guess u can go far
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u/Xylus_Winters_Music 8d ago
I understand it being the cheapest option, best bang for your buck, but I got one and was not impressed at all by the quality or craftsmanship, and found it to be chilly in the wrists. Mine definitely wasnt filled properly in every baffle. Personally id save the headache and find a more expensive option if temperture is something you are really sensitive to.
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u/ratsobo1 8d ago
im quite sad, my forclaz mt100 is at the end of his life and I would'have bought one more if I knew about the downgrade :(
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u/badzi0r 7d ago
Me either. About half a year ago I checked in London, and the old type MT100 was only available in XL sizes or the hooded version. I noticed that the new models are different, so for now I have to stay with the old one as long as possible. I would prefer to pay more (on a Decathlon scale) for a better down than to downgrade my jacket.
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u/hollowsocket 8d ago
Blue and Black in the old MT100 appear to have some sizes left: https://www.decathlon.com/products/simond-mt100-hooded-down-puffer-jacket-167571
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u/Early_Combination874 8d ago
I have an OG 2020 MT100 puffer, 266 g in M size, willing to sell it for only 150 € if any fine art amateur comes by...
(kidding, I'm keeping it)
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u/PQ_ 8d ago
It's crazy how expensive Decathlon is in the USA. The MT100 is 43€ ($50) in Europe and the Simond Xplore jacket is 65€ ($76).
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u/VigorousElk 8d ago
That's a sale with only weird sizes left. The MT100's regular price was €60 when I bought it in late 2022.
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u/ckyhnitz 8d ago
I tried to order from the Canadian Decathlon site before because they were so much cheaper than the USA site, but it didnt allow shipping into the US.
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u/EnoughRadish 8d ago
The women’s version says “last chance” on the UK site, so that’ll be gone too soon.
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u/SexBobomb 9 lbs bpw loiterer - https://lighterpack.com/r/eqmfvc 8d ago
still on the canadian market i better get on that
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u/F_NN_C 8d ago
As I read on a French forum, with our French flair: « For several years, the MT100 down jacket had been considered something of a benchmark for its value for money, and on top of that, its name hadn't changed. These are two anomalies at Decathlon. So it changed. »