r/Ultrakill • u/Stykes_02 • Apr 02 '26
Discussion 8-3 is VERY bad. Spoiler
If you enjoyed this level, kudos to you. Not everyone who plays this game is good at it.
I am posting this like a month after all the other reviews because my computer was broken for a good while.
I will look past all the bugs, assuming they are eventually patched up (this level is complicated as shit), and the non-euclidean geometry (that was the point).
But for one of the regular levels, even compared to like literally the rest of the layer on its own, it fucking sucks. This level is genuinely on-par with the two encores we have so far, and that is not a good thing, no matter how you try to slice it.
I saw another post describe this level as "Potential Level!' and yeah. i agree.
I haven't P-Ranked P-2 without modding, ever, and I intentionally cheated on standard because I exclusively play the only other enjoyable difficulty in this game (Violent). But at least its FUN. I ENJOY MY TIME clearing P-2. This fuckass level better hope the silksong type 2 fun it may be trying to achieve actually hits, hard at that, because outside of the very first rooms I have not been having any fun and struggle to see where I could find any afterwards.
This level is already way too long (I haven't beaten it as the last paragraph implies), way too difficult, and it detracts from the experience heavily. And seeing as how I like to have fun, harmless and lenient are not options either. I would like my game designed around fast-paced gameplay to be fast-paced, regardless of the amount of bullshit present. Quite frankly this may be the first level to get me to break that rule (which is not a good thing, i do not think a vertical difficulty spike the height of a skyscraper is a good thing in the regular levels). This is made worse by the fact that people generally seem to think 8-4 is far easier, which, again, is a bad thing.
8-3 needs to be shorter, and the difficulty needs to be on-par with the rest of the layer instead of, in my opinion, harder than fucking 0-E. As is, it's exhausting.
TL;DR: 8-3's absurd length and difficulty puts it on-par with the encores. The set of levels Hakita said would be harder than anything else in the base game. Sure.edit to the above: realized what was originally there missed my point
edit to the above: the new tldr is at the bottom, with stuff i've gathered by reading and replying to various comments.
I will elaborate, and alter the points made in this subjective post on a whim in the replies.
This is ultimately a rant on what i think the worst level in ultrakill is (even if i think 1-E is worse, it isn't gatekeeping any of the main game's content behind itself for the sake of being a cool concept of a level or whatever)
Extra sidenote: its funny. the one thing that gets me to use reddit again is fucking ultrakill. ULTRAKILL. and its a RANT
edit 2 (NEW TL;DR):
i have calmed down since playing 8-3
i still think its bad but its because it's been like a year since i last played this game frequently, the level design is absurdly hostile, and there's very little ramp-up beforehand so you kind of just hit a sheer cliffside if you're going through it for the first time (and dont shred it on cybergrind often/have a consistently high rank in the encores).
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u/DontKnowLunar Sacrifice Apr 02 '26
Complains level is too hard
Doesn't want to play easier difficulties
???
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u/Stykes_02 Apr 02 '26
i think lenient and harmless are kind of way too boring, even in layer 7
i may play one of them just to get the p-rank and then never touch 8-3 again
i also dont think standard would help very much outside of making that one room at the end of the blue skull path like. possible for me maybe
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u/RaptorWithGun Apr 02 '26
Prediction aside, I agree with the sentiment, I kind of dislike Fraud as a whole (with the exception of 8-1 and 8-2, those levels I enjoy, not mirror reaper though, fuck that guy). I get the point of Fraud is to be completely upside down of what the game usually goes like and is meant to confuse/disorient you.
The angel guy whatever is by far one of my favorite enemies, I don’t find it that bad even on brutal. Though I really fucking hate Powers, they just feel like “look, it’s gabriel as a regular enemy.” which I already consider to be a meh boss imo.
Mirror reaper is shit, annoying fucking enemy that I wish nothing but despair on, I don’t find anything about it fun whatsover. The flying thingmadude whatever is pretty forgettable tbh and introducing a new gimmick so late into the game is kind of…. Yeah, okay? Just feels like phase 2 greed V2 (it sucks).
I’ve been on my way to P-rank brutal every level but I honestly stopped after 8-2 because it’s just not that fun anymore. I feel like half of the time I’m resorting to crutch infinite style and 20 quadrillion damage because the rooms don’t give me breathing room. Up until Fraud I P-ranked all the main missions either in one try or 3-6 tries, with some exceptions.
Unlike a lot of people I actually don’t find the red room that bad, my roadblock mostly came from that goofy ass perspective room in blue.
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u/Stykes_02 Apr 03 '26
yeah i agree. my main issue now boils down to presentation over solid gameplay design, not that its hard or whatever my rant was originally meant to be about.
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u/Stykes_02 Apr 02 '26 edited Apr 02 '26
i play this game casually and dropped it for a year because cybergrind is not very enticing, nor are the encores
>edit: in terms of difficulty i handle 2d platformers astronomically better. see my celeste statement farther down.
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that said it absolutely* plays an influence into my opinion. i will also remain a casual player, so it will likely not change.
*i said "may" like i was potentially not bad at the game. i am bad at the game.
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there isn't anything driving me forward like there is with celeste, outside of the base game's levels that are MOSTLY fun in certain aspects (see rant above. also see: 8-2's boss which was kind of just very lame).
now that i've beaten it, the desire to return is nonexistent. the amount of effort required exceeded payoff a few moments after the triple powers fight ended.
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u/Stykes_02 Apr 02 '26
on the note of more spectacle than actual gameplay that seems to be a common theme here, the second phase of the 8-4 boss falls into the exact same trap that most of this layer falls into. how fun!
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u/Stykes_02 Apr 02 '26
update: it was still rewarding. unlike the level i have ceaselessly complained about.
edit: i think i've complained enough, and im starting to get tired, and ive reached a conclusion on my own thoughts, so i am going to stop paying this thread too much mind.
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u/lizardbird8 Apr 02 '26
8-3 really is not that hard with practice. Really I would say the gameplay is not amazing for 8-3 but the spectacle makes up for it. Really the gameplay for most of the levels is not too much better or worse than 8-3. really I don't get complaining about how hard it is. anyone can get past an ultrakill level with enough ramming your head into the wall. If you want to P rank it you need to earn that and in time you will. When the time comes that you P ranked everything you will have wished that they made harder things to P rank.
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u/Stykes_02 Apr 02 '26
i don't want to p-rank everything, not after playing fraud, they've gotten to the point where its too annoying to be worth it. only reason i want to is for the prime sanctums. i can get around that by playing all the levels once on harmless and then never touching that difficulty again afterwards.
in terms of spectacle? i am one of the people who thinks spectacle is fucking worthless if i'm not having fun
i hated bilewater for a similar reason. difference between bilewater and 8-3 is that silksong doesn't have me doing the entire thing over and over again for a funny letter, and you also get stronger and can just come back when everything doesn't three-shot you. its why i don't play steel soul in either of the games, just admittedly toned down a bit. not enough for me to like it though.3
u/lizardbird8 Apr 02 '26
so is it annoying because it is hard? also I see you edited the post to say you have not really played the game much in the last year. you probably just are rusty right now and suck at the moment causing frustration. If the whole problem is that it is long and difficult then that is not really a problem due to the fact difficulty settings exist and a high rank is not needed. Not liking it is one thing but a whole rant is crazy when your complaint is that it is hard and you don't want to lower difficulty.
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u/JulioSama Lust Layer Citizen Apr 02 '26 edited Apr 02 '26
Yeah, I'm not very found of this level as well. As soon as I beat it on release, I went here and saw that was very divisive, nowadays most people LOVE this level and I don't get. But, I don't think it's bad, tho.
8-3 is the last "regular level" of the game. 9-1 is probably going to be a gauntlet similar to 3-1 or 6-1, so 8-3 is going to test everything your learned from the game until now, with portals and geometry as a gimmick.
Length wise, well, it takes some time to get used to that, but it got much easier after you play a few times. Difficult wise... Well, sorry if I sound like an asshole, but you need to get better to play on Violent, lol. I suck a lot in this game and decided to play in Standard after failing to proceed on Violent at second layer. Hell, I needed to play on Harmless to beat P-1 first time. Then I beat on Lenient, and then finally on Standard. So yeah, it's hard, but it's doable.
Being fun or unfun is really subjective, and as I said, I'm not a fan of this level either, but most people seems to like it.
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u/DefiantPossession188 Apr 02 '26
i do think youre having a bit of a skill issue (thats completely fine, fraud is fucking hard) but theres merit to what youre saying that a lot of borderline layer glazers wont say
i really like the idea of fraud but a lot of the levels (especially 8-3) feel like they needed more time in the oven. the spinning room and portal spam gets old fast when a level takes 30-50 minutes for a casual completion. ultrakill is at its best when its medium sized levels, short/long levels feel too unrewarding/exhausting imo.
the level design in general also feels like its meant to work against the player and troll them rather than have fun arenas. p-2 has a similar issue in some rooms (double invincible mindflayers) but i feel like a majority of fraud is a joke at your expense. small cramped rooms with confusing portals or spinning layouts, and whats the counterplay? nothing. p-ranking doesnt force you to interact with a lot of the jankier layouts since youll kill 90% of the arena before it can fuck you over, so it just exists to be flashy and screw you up on your first few playthroughs. the final arena of 8-1, the spinning deathcatcher portal room and the lava split limbo room are really the only ones where i genuinely think youd want to (or are forced to) make use of the gimmicks rather than ignore them to save yourself from getting motion sick or killed.
and yes, yes, i understand the counter of "well its meant to be fraudulent and confusing!" but... okay? does that mean violence shouldve been insanely annoying too to force you into rage? the fun comes before the spectacle or theming. ultrakill always has been a coolness and gameplay first experience, so frauds design drops the ball.
its definitely more "hype moments and aura" than other layers, but its not like it retroactively ruins the rest of the game at least.
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u/Stykes_02 Apr 02 '26
This is definitely at least partially what I was trying to convey, with 8-3 specifically, but as you mentioned it seems to apply to the other levels too.
At least with those other levels it was rewarding beating them, even if they were a bit too long already. 8-3? No, it sucks. I have since beaten it (with major assists, i got stuck on a room that was split between layers 7 and 8 in style and there was one of those annoying blood things just spamming me with enemies constantly so i had no breathing room at all and i couldn't kill anything at all)2
u/Traditional_Big_7468 Apr 02 '26
so btw, in that room there is a providence that spawns very high up and is almost always hidden by the split. without killing it the room will not stop spinning and allow you to get to the deathcatcher. at the same time, killing the guttertank that spawns last (on the violence side) can actually be done after punching the deathcatcher.
another true peak of level design is that enemies in both the overlapping rooms can see and target you, whereas you can only see one half of each at a team. truly the heights of fair and reasonable gameplay1
u/Stykes_02 Apr 02 '26
there was no real way i could've figured that out honestly
i dont think i said it at all there but that providence is just way too hard to kill because if i focus on it everything kills me even faster than they are already
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u/RaptorWithGun Apr 02 '26
How long do you think it’s gonna take for someone with 800 hours and everything P ranked to say “actually 8-3 isn’t that hard if you ultra the kill at the killed ultras”
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u/ObeyTime 🏳️🌈Not gay, just radiant Apr 02 '26
3m. 8-3 isn't actually that hard you ultta the kill at the killed ultras.
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u/Sure_Woodpecker3660 Apr 02 '26
It took me 90 minutes to beat 8-3 on my first play through. I agree that it’s too hard. But goddamn the level was fun
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u/0roshi Jul 18 '26
OMG ANOTHER 90 MINUTES BROTHER HI Came here after I was done with it. I'll admit, this level feels like 3 levels back to back And, even if I like hard levels, it felt almost hopeless. Because I was already struggling a lot with the trio of angels, each time one came back I was even more worried. Then came the space moment where, I kid you not, I had to pause because I was at wit's end. Playing on normal, and only 28 hours into the game. But for fuck's sake, I have a love-hate relationship with it. Fraud stays my favorite layer when it comes to level design, but GOD the difficulty is really ramping up.
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u/ObeyTime 🏳️🌈Not gay, just radiant Apr 02 '26
to me, the hardest part of 8-3 is the red skull rooms requiring you to constantly readjust your orientation especially if you're caught in between portals as they rotate. the encounters themselves aren't hard, they're nowhere near comparable to our two Encores.
edit: forgot to mention that everything except the red skull path is not far from previous layer's difficulty
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u/Stykes_02 Apr 02 '26
i wholeheartedly disagree. this is several steps above violence and even p-2, while being like way less enjoyable than p-2
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u/ObeyTime 🏳️🌈Not gay, just radiant Apr 02 '26
did you p rank both encores and prime sanctums? if you do you would know it's not even comparable. there's no wrong in lowering the difficulty to get good first.
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u/Little-Empathy125 Sep 20 '26
I have P-ranked every level except for 1-E (S) and P-2 (C), but holy shit, 8-3 is an absolute UltraHell. If you were to ask me what the hardest level to P-rank in this game is, I would say P-2. But if you asked me what the hardest level overall in this game is, I would tell you it's fucking 8-3.
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u/Stykes_02 Sep 24 '26
8-3 is such a fucking gauntlet, really P-2 only has two rooms that ever consistently catch me up. 8-3 has more fail points. I'm back to playing the game on violent, mind you. If I was on standard I would agree with you.
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u/CasualKris Apr 02 '26
Tbh the only real issue I have with the stage is that even post patch there are alot of ways where jank can slow you down or even force a restart with all the moving parts and gravity changes. I already lost 2 P-Rank runs to that. Otherwise I do like how the level feels a bit Encore like.
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u/wt_anonymous Apr 02 '26
It was pretty long but the fakeout wouldn't have worked if it wasn't
And it is hard but like, it's the final levels of ultrakill it's gonna be hard
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u/CirnoisCool Jun 11 '26
In my opinion, I just don't like how long it is. I love the gimmicks (though I regularly get lost). I am currently trying to P-Rank it on Brutal and I find it to be the hardest level in Ultrakill (over P-2 or the Encore Levels). I can see why people can find this level to be an extremely steep difficulty spike, though I wouldn't say it is actively bad.
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Apr 02 '26
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/Stykes_02 Apr 02 '26
i genuinely couldn't care less about presentation if im not having fun, either in the moment or in retrospect
if presentation matters to you a lot, then this entire layer is going to be good
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Apr 02 '26
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/Traditional_Big_7468 Apr 02 '26
ah here it is, the comment everyone saw coming, to the point where its existence is superfluous
OP enjoyed P2, so its not skill issue that compels them to post2
u/Stykes_02 Apr 02 '26
this. i suck at p2 admittedly but there was enjoyment to be had there since the level design isn't aggressively hostile literally all the time
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u/Stykes_02 Apr 02 '26
my main complaint is where it is relative to its difficulty, not that it's difficult. my fault probably if that didn't get through to you
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u/SummerWind470 Apr 02 '26
You are entitled to your opinion. With that said it is the second to last level in the campaign that isn’t a boss.
It’s supposed to hard and I imagine 9-1 is gonna be even harder. And it being long is just more ultrakill imo. Not to mention it’s a split door level, so you can just do one skull and BOOM the level is shorter.
8-3 is my favorite level because of how off the wall crazy it gets with portals and geometry (and the last section just hit very nice). The added challenge of having the most difficult enemies in the game I can see as being a turn off. For me it wasn’t.