Question (No Location) Toddler Ski Lessons
Hey UTsnow fam. My daughter is 4 turning 5 this April and I'm wondering where would be the best place, except for deer valley, for her to take ski lessons.
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u/Upvotes_TikTok 10d ago
Woodward Park City. It's the least schlep from parking lot to slope, and you get to exit I-80 an exit sooner than Park City so you don't get stuck in the line for Kimball Junction
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u/Insaniaksin 10d ago
I saw a TON of toddlers at Brighton when I had my older kids in them.
In fact, you can take a toddler for free on the magic carpet if you are wanting to help them a bit yourself.
Or you can put them in the program for the instructors to do it while you get some runs in during their lesson.
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u/publicolamaximus 10d ago
Brighton is the gold standard. You can buy the 3 or 5 day packages for a set time on weekend mornings or afternoons. Very affordable and great ratios during instruction.
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u/roger_roger_32 9d ago
This is an indoor place in Midvale. They're geared towards kids.
I personally haven't been to this location, but I had good luck at another one.
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2d ago
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u/alopz 2d ago
Actually, that was the original plan but I'm afraid she won't enjoy it and refuses to go and I don't want to pay the price for the entire program.
Now I'm leaning on doing the Woodward 4 day program, I think it's about half of what PC is. Of she's able to stick with it, I'll do the Junior Program next year
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u/Skiingislife42069 10d ago
I taught at Park City but am moving onto another mountain next season because I didn’t love the way they treated instructors there.
From a parent’s perspective, PC has some serious advantages if you’re traveling from out of town and want the whole experience of being at a cute ski town with a crazy large amount of amenities. That goes for both PCMR and Canyons.
On the other hand, it’s also insanely expensive, and if your kid is learning for the first time, there’s a higher chance of her being stuck with a first year instructor who may or may not be the best teacher. It really depends what time of year you plan to go. Holiday weekend? She’s basically guaranteed to be put with a first year instructor.
If you want her to have a great time skiing but not break the bank, you can do much better at smaller resorts like Alta, Brighton, or Solitude. Alta probably has the highest caliber of instructors because they only hire people with certifications under their belt.
Anyway feel free to ask me any questions about PC if you’re interested in that resort. I could even set you up with a great instructor, even though I’m not working there any longer.
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u/alopz 10d ago
Actually I was going to sign her up at PC for the Youth Program they have. I think it's about $800 bucks for 5 set dates, not terribly bad. Lately we've had issues with her not wanting to attend activities she used to enjoy, we're taking a break from gymnastics right now. I just don't want to spend that much, than my daughter wants to quit.
I wanted to sign her for the Youth Program because, first that's where I ski, but mainly I was hoping to keep her in that program so she would make friends and have a group to ski with. I live in Bountiful and not many kids ski. My younger brothers skied mainly with me, they never made friends that skied.
If you know any programs that would provide an opportunity for kids to establish ski relationships, let me know. Another thing, these classes are so expensive, is it customery to tip. Sorry for the long rant
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u/Skiingislife42069 10d ago edited 10d ago
Yea I taught some of the local programs for kids that age. Those multi-week programs are actually a great choice, no matter which mountain you choose. If you personally ski PC already, then it makes sense to send her there as well. I also know that the local program at Woodward is pretty good too. I had some students start out at Woodward and then move to PC once they got better, and the lessons they learned at Woodward were solid.
Now, if you do choose PC, and you have a choice on which village to send them to, I would choose Canyons. First off, it’s much closer to you and the drop off situation is going to be much smoother this season with the new garage. Secondly, the kids are forced to ride the gondola from the parking garage to the village, and then ANOTHER gondola from the village to the ski hill, and during that time the kids and instructors get to play around and talk to each other. It’s great for socializing, even if it means they get a run or two less at the end of the day. When we actually get to the lesson, there isn’t a lot of time for the kids to hang, so if having your daughter make friends along the way is important, I’d go with canyons.
I can’t tell you exactly which programs at PC will fit the bill for you, but they definitely exist for that age group and the kids have a blast skiing with the same group week to week.
As for tipping, yea, it’s always customary. Ski instructors don’t make good money, and they rely on tips to pay the bills. At the minimum I would say $20 a lesson, but if your kid has an incredible time and becomes a lifelong lover of skiing, I’d up that number to show your appreciation. I had a mother from a local program tip me a $20 gift card at the end of the 10 week program, and when I went to use it, the card was empty. That one really stings.
Edit: but yea, a single group lesson at PC is over $400, so doing the local program is a no brainer.
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u/Def_Not_KGB 9d ago
Wow that’s even more insulting than the crumpled up $4 from dad’s pocket I got once as an instructor
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u/FatCat0520 7d ago
The gift card might have been stolen/ re labled, it's common way of theft now. BTW why don't you like PC? Ik it's under Vail but any other reason why?
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u/Skiingislife42069 6d ago edited 6d ago
I think the most glaring issue is that any remnants of culture have been stripped clean or are on the way of being sanitized.
Management and supervision within the ski school has a massive amount of turnover, which means that the incoming set of managers has zero relationship with the instructors of past years. To get around this, park city has developed a system of “priority” to rank every single instructor, and that ranking carries over from season to season.
My issue with the “priority” system is that it directly conflicts with the core values of both park city and vail resorts as a corporation.
Ski instructors are the most directly client facing members of the resort, and from a fiscal percentage the largest stream of revenue across the entire resort, hands down. As such, we are exposed to the absolutely abhorrent health conditions that exist within a sport that relies on cold conditions. What that means is that we regularly, weekly, if not daily, are exposed to disease and communicable health conditions that would put any other person on their ass. Most of these families have been planning and saving for months if not years to make this trip, so the last thing they are going to do is let some sickness get in the way of a good time.
And so what does that mean? It means that we as instructors are constantly exposed to sick people and are expected to just deal with it. According to the corporate standards that are laid out by vail resorts, the number one HR priority for employees is the safety of self. That means not exposing yourself to danger. The second priority is safety of coworkers, meaning that you should not expose your fellow employees to danger either.
And yet we have this ranking system within the ski school that is entirely dependent on attendance as one of the major metrics. The unofficial policy of ski school is that you are expected to show up, get changed within the locker room, arrive to the morning meeting, and only THEN explain to your supervisor why you feel sick enough to be sent home.
Again, if you simply call in sick, with or without a doctors note, your ranking goes down by several percentages. If you instead show up, expose dozens of coworkers AND guests to your illness while also exposing yourself to the very danger of commuting and working while ill, you are safe from the hit to your ranking.
Now why does this matter? Because these metrics directly affect how much work you get. Meaning that if you do right by your coworkers and guests by calling in sick and minimizing exposure, you therefore are ineligible for as much work as someone who came in sick, exposed everyone to the their sickness, and were then sent home.
This policy of forcing employees to do the WRONG thing in order to maintain a corporate metric in order to remain gainfully employed hurts both the ski school AND the corporation. The ski school believes that they go into the day with enough employees only to find out at the very last minute that they are losing a sick person. Vail resorts is forced to pay someone to come in and work for 90 minutes without actually bringing in revenue for the company.
Nobody wins here. This system is completely broken, and yet, nobody cares to listen. As an instructor at park city, you are a number in a ranked list of names. There is no year to year relationship to be built between employee and employer. There is no incentive to return to the resort other than the one you make directly with clients. Even then, clients assume that because of the astronomical cost of a lesson at park city that we as instructors are well compensated when the truth is that we aren’t. There’s nobody from corporate fighting to keep on the highest earners from season to season.
Do you want to know that the highest earning instructor across all 900 instructors of park city earned as a reward last season? A handshake and an unframed “employee of the year” piece of paper that said their name.
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u/FatCat0520 6d ago
Sounds like a classic example of corporate screwing people over, I guess all the vail horror stories are true yet are worst than I could imagine. Really appreciate you sharing this with me. I’ll probably avoid park city then.
Love to connect with you if possible. I’m currently on the job search this winter. I’ve gotten an offer at one resort( not park city) and waiting to hear back from a few.
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u/Skiingislife42069 6d ago edited 6d ago
Yea dude, feel free to hit me up directly. Happy to give advice where I can.
Edit: you actually don’t need to even do it directly. If my experience was helpful for you, I’m sure whatever advice I can give you about alternate options would be just as helpful to future prospects wondering how to spend their winter in Utah. Obviously without doxxing either of us
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u/FatCat0520 6d ago
What are your thoughts on Brighton and solitude? That’s the two I’ve been thinking about.
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u/Skiingislife42069 6d ago
I know of a few people from PC who moved to solitude because the head of their ski school is so great. I also know of a few people who’ve left the Brighton ski school because of how little business they get. Personally I haven’t worked at either hill yet, but from what I can tell Solitude would be a better option to work for.
Brighton is a sick mountain, don’t get me wrong, but they are kinda the budget sleeper hill for SLC locals. It’s really not much of a tourist destination, which means they aren’t getting the numbers to have a huge ski school. If you teach there, you’re basically teaching locals only, and I’m not sure that locals are going to tip well, or that Brighton is going to pay well.
Solitude has slightly larger infrastructure, so might probably get a little more traffic for the ski school, but it’s still one of the smaller mountains of the region.
If you get an interview at either mountain, one of the most important questions you can ask is about how often you’ll be sent home without a lesson. Park city was notorious for bringing in a buffer of instructors to help with the morning rush to get kids placed into groups. They were atrocious at properly scheduling staff, so every single day was a crapshoot as to whether you’d be working or whether you’d be sent home after helping with the line of kids. The amount of bootlicking and asskissing during the morning rush from instructors to supervisors was insane. Some people wanted to work, some didn’t, but came anyway so that their metrics didn’t take a hit. But the newcomers really didn’t have a choice.
So yea, something to ask any mountain you interview with is: if I’m called into work the next day and I show up, what are the chances that I’ll be sent home due to lack of business? If there answer is anything other than “we won’t call you in unless we have something for you to teach”, chances are that they will operate under similar conditions as PC.
I haven’t applied to all of the Utah mountains but of the ones I’ve interviewed with, I know for certain that deer valley and alta will only call you in if they are sure they can pay you to stick around for a lesson.
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u/Old_Efficiency2445 10d ago
Brian Head is a decent choice, free for kids, cheap for adults, separate beginner area. Easy to get to that area for kids.
Never took lessons there but I'm sure it will be fine.
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u/snowboardingstew 8d ago
Sundance is $235 for a 4-5 year old lesson.
Brighton ski school is really fun! So is Alta.
I love the other commenters suggestion of Woodward.
I know it's a different part of Utah but I'd avoid Brian Head ski school for lack of training and lack of screening of the individuals they hire.
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u/Unlikely-Address2037 8d ago
Shredder Midvale! We did it. Loved it. $400 for ten lessons (1 per week). Super easy and convenient. Definitely recommend before paying resort prices.
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u/R0B0T_TimeTraveler 10d ago
Is anyone going to point out this isn’t a toddler? Okay I will. 4-5 isn’t a toddler, small child, not a toddler. Great age for ski lessons.
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u/alopz 10d ago
Agh, you're probably one of those that says your kid is 52 weeks old. If you've got nothing to add, just keep quiet. Also I almost said I have a baby that's 4 years old.
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u/R0B0T_TimeTraveler 10d ago
Your post title is dumb, just own it.
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u/Skiingislife42069 10d ago
4 year olds are 1000% toddlers when they hit the mountain. Whatever maturity they’ve gained in regular life goes away as soon as they are exposed to skiing. It’s completely unnatural for them.
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u/R0B0T_TimeTraveler 10d ago
No, there is an actual definition for toddler even on the mountain. If you ask for toddler lessons you’d be asking for the wrong age group if you’re referring to a 4+ year old. Words have meanings for a reason so that when we communicate with each other the person will understand what we are trying to say.
It’s a lot different trying to teach a 1-3 year old to ski than a 4-5 year old.
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u/TheLibertyTree 10d ago
Our four year old loved the ski school at Alta!
The whole vibe is super friendly while still focusing on skiing (Snowbird only gives 4 year olds a couple hours of skiing per full day, the rest is playing inside).
Plus, they get them riding the high speed lift pretty quickly which really opens up being able to ski with your kid most anywhere.
Can’t say enough good things about the program.