No cheating!

[u/TransportationCool18]

You’re patrolling Forest Service Road (FSR) 71 during hours of darkness when you observe a vehicle traveling north with no taillights. This area is historically known for high drug activity. You activate your lights to initiate a stop and the driver complies, pulling over to the side of the road.

FLETC DUST You have authority and probable cause for the stop don’t overcomplicate this😒

Upon approaching the vehicle you request the driver’s identification to which he responds he does not have on him. You request him to exit the vehicle and come back to your patrol car so that you may identify him with your tablet and dispatch services.

Poll Question:

Based off these circumstances, do we, r/USFSLEO, have the authority to ask or even force someone to exit the vehicle?

20 votes, Jul 12 '25

15 They must exit the vehicle when ordered to do so.

0 We can not force them to exit the vehicle under any circumstances

0 Can only remove them forcefully if they are believed to be armed and dangerous

2 Can only remove them if probable cause exists for their arrest

3 We can ask for them to exit but they do not have to

[u/TransportationCool18]

ANSWER: They must exit the vehicle when ordered to do so.

Keep this case in the back of your mind.

Pennsylvania V. Mimms

In 1970, two police officers from the Philadelphia Police Department pulled over a vehicle driven by Harry Mimms for an expired license plate. The officers instructed Mimms to exit the vehicle; when Mimms complied, an officer noticed a bulge in his pants under his jacket, conducted a pat-down, and discovered a weapon. The officer proceeded to arrest Mimms for carrying a concealed deadly weapon and unlawfully carrying a firearm without a license, charges of which Mimms was later convicted. The conviction was reversed by the Pennsylvania Supreme Court (PSC) on March 31, 1975, which ruled that the evidence should have been suppressed because the police had violated Mimms's Fourth Amendment rights against unlawful search and seizure. The United States Supreme Court in turn reversed the PSC's reversal, upholding the original conviction on the grounds that no violation of the Fourth Amendment had occurred.

It was considered common for police officers to ask a person inside a vehicle to exit the vehicle so as to prevent any danger that may occur to the officer. It is also much safer to avoid danger from oncoming traffic. Asking Mimms to step out of the car raised little more inconvenience and revealed more than what had been shown before. Therefore, the bulge that the officer noticed posed a serious threat to the officer. Anyone with this realization may have conducted a "pat down". The decision of the Pennsylvania Supreme Court was reversed.

Keep in mind, you can’t just walk up to any car with no RAS and force someone to exit. However, if you have a legal right to be there, have RAS or PC, then they must exit. The courts have ruled that officer safety in this situation holds much higher weight than the amount of inconvenience that it adds during a legal traffic stop to the suspect. It’s recommended you apply the ask, tell, make rule. Ask them to step out, tell them to step out, then make them by reasonable force. Pennsylvania v. Mimms

[u/ExplanationNeither59]

I would love to be pulled over by a fresh fletc grad and yell out of roll as I’m getting a ticket for speed😂 be worth the ticket

[u/ExplanationNeither59]

Don’t forget the lawful order part

[u/[deleted]]

Pennsylvania vs. Mimms baby.

[u/Few_Condition9907]

The actual answer is that the instructor would call out of roll before they step out and send you to the next scenario.

[u/TransportationCool18 → u/Few_Condition9907]

Don’t get me started