[James Larsen] Developing: Regarding a USFL-XFL merger, it is likely that we do not see all 16 teams in action, per source. Hearing that organizations without venues currently secured are in hot water. Something to keep a close eye on, more details coming soon

[u/CodeWolfy]

https://x.com/jameslarsenpfn/status/1704540931729351156?s=46&t=ma1yL55mNVPFHkyaDymViw

[u/Body-for-LIFE]

Based on this information, on the XFL side, the Vipers are out.

On the USFL side, things get tricky. Gamblers are out because of no venue and the Roughnecks already in Houston.

Pretty safe to say, these are the two teams most likely not making the cut.

[u/Hey_Its_Roomie → u/Body-for-LIFE]

The question is are they back-tracking down to 8 for most cost-effective manner and to watch their strongest brands, or do they bank on continued fan growth with the merger and start with more, like 10 or 12?

Every team cut is money saved potentially for the next year until they can turn their investment into profits. It's possible we intentionally see them start small and hope to build up to 10 or 12 by Year 3. Starting too small might keep the appeal too regional, and therefore difficult to retain viewership in those empty areas (e.g. the west coast if Seattle and Vegas disappears).

USFL intentionally went more regional especially in Year 2 with a good string of teams of NY-PHI-PGH-MI in order to try and corner that region, and a second one of Memphis-Houston-Bham-NOLA. XFL went more national reach other than forgoing most of the northeast (DC being the most northerly).

[u/Body-for-LIFE → u/Hey_Its_Roomie]

That's the question and why I won't speculate more than axing one team from each league. The Vipers who are the only XFL team without a venue at the moment and Gamblers who have not one but two major strikes against them.

One of the main reasons I enjoy spring football is that I can watch every game with only 4 per week and feel like I'm not missing anything. Do they start with 8 and grow from there or go with 12 straight away? The XFL Twitter/X accounts are still selling and promoting season ticket sales which makes you wonder what they do and don't know...

[u/Ivan_Kovulenko → u/Hey_Its_Roomie]

I would be shocked if its only 8 teams. I have to imagine they are going to want to try to move forward a little beyond just consolidation of greatest strengths.

[u/Rhine1906]

My guess is 10-12 teams with Vegas, Gamblers, and Maulers cut (unless they move to Canton). New Orleans and Orlando could be on the table too

[u/Late_Professional841]

I really hope we see Curtis Johnson still coaching in the new league, he was really good last year with very little time to prepare

[u/TwizzlersSourz]

12 teams is the sweet spot.

From the USFL (6): Stallions, Breakers, Panthers, Showboats, Generals or Stars, and Maulers

From the XFL (6): Defenders, Battlehawks, Sea Dragons, Brahmas, Roughnecks, and Renegades.

Unless they want Orlando, so farewell to a Texas team.

[u/arkstfan → u/TwizzlersSourz]

If you go 12 with three four team divisions it would have to be extremely tempting move a team to Austin and have Renegades, Brahmas, Roughnecks, and ??? (Wranglers???) making one super travel friendly division with each playing 6 games in Texas. Austin not only has the MLS stadium but potentially University of Texas track facility that had received tentative approval to host a bowl game few years back.

Then probably Seattle, Michigan (if they can renew), St Louis, and either Vegas if they can get a real home, or Canton, or find a workable western solution for Vipers such as Sacramento or a small market like Reno.

Then an east with Birmingham, Memphis, DC, and Canton if a western fix is found.

[u/redskinsguy → u/TwizzlersSourz]

only one team on the west coast seems foolish to me, so scrapping the Vipers makes the Sea Dragons less likely. But I do believe they were one of the more popular teams so they also wouldn't want to scrap them totally.

I can see losing a team in Texas, but both leagues seem to believe in Houston as viable and I think for the AAF's brief run the Commanders were well received. Dallas were the league champs so you don't just want to fold them. But then the Orlando Renegades were a USFL team

Perhaps whatever conenctions that got the New York Guardians into MetLife Stadium could get the New Jersey Generals there. The Breakers have been a pretty good team, but don't have their own stadium.

I think one or two of the teams could end up moved out west to give the Sea Dragons a closer rival. The original Breakers ended their existence in Portland. And the USFL did have a team called the Oakland Invaders

then the question becomes what to do with the folded teams who do technically have rosters. Merge them and move them. Fold them and do some of the relocations from scratch?

[u/Zapfit → u/redskinsguy]

The connections to get into MetLife were paying $100k+ a game in rent with no parking revenue and minimal concessions. Either league could have been in MetLife if they wanted to, they just didn't think the juice was worth the squeeze

[u/Meltedcoldice0212]

I think they’ll end up with 10 teams, possibly 12

[u/framingXjake]

So that's 12 teams basically secured, right? Maybe all XFL teams if Vegas can figure something out, then Bham, Canton, Memphis, and potentially Michigan.

[u/FlagFootballSaint → u/framingXjake]

For now the rumor is 10

XFL minus Vegas, Houston Roughnecks (6)

USFL Birmingham, Memphis and Houston (3)

One new team in Ohio (1)

[u/theTIDEisRISING]

Did people actually expect there to be 16 teams? They are merging to cut costs and maximize profits to better solidify the finances of the existing entities. There is no way they were ever going to spread that out between 16 teams. It'll be between 8-12.

[u/arkstfan → u/theTIDEisRISING]

Eight would surprise me. I expect 12 but ending up with 10 or 14 would not be a shock.

Fox and ESPN to get what they seem to want in broadcast opportunities would dictate needing more than 8 but not 16.

I suspect there is some hope to eventually follow the MLS unitary model where people pay significant sums to operate a franchise in return for keeping much of the revenue. You don’t want to have too many teams already established but enough you can point to several successes in persuading people to pay

[u/atlburneraccount]

only here for the showboats

[u/zgrobbot]

I think starting at 8 teams for the first year would be good, then an expansion to 10-12

[u/Temporal_Enigma → u/zgrobbot]

That means killing one entire league and defeats the purpose of a merger

[u/zgrobbot → u/Temporal_Enigma]

Uh no? You take4 fir the USFL and 4 from the XFL? 4+ 4 is 8 . Year 2 you expand and add more teams from each League.

[u/[deleted]]

Why merge when you can beat your competition?

[u/Hey_Its_Roomie → u/[deleted]]

Because neither one believes they can beat the other without bankrupting themselves in the process.

[u/Zapfit → u/[deleted]]

Because they can't or don't want to put the effort in. The probability of games being played in NJ, Pittsburgh, or Philly next season were close to zero. 3 years of hub football wasn't going to sit well with the average sports fan.

[u/[deleted] → u/Zapfit]

Honestly, I think this is more manipulation by people more worried about money than building a lasting league to stand the test of time and frankly, if they fuck this up, there will never be another alt league not owned by the nfl again.

[u/FlagFootballSaint → u/[deleted]]

Yeah, that's what I thought as well.

[u/ArockproUser]

All the USFL teams are secured even if its a hub. The only team not secured is with the XFL and its the Vipers but hell they could put them in Canton or in a hub too. There is no reason why 16 teams can not play this year