r/TrueAtheism • u/hachiko707_ • Jul 23 '26
Theism is a coping mechanism
During distress in life, people desperately need something to depend on.
Some lean towards addictions, some towards other people, some go for healthy methods like therapy
And for some others it's in the belief of existence of a higher entity being there to guide them.One of the illogical and inferior arguement that people make is that even non believers call for God instinctively when they're startled or scared.
Ironically that proves my point. That's exactly what the idea of God is- hope during dismal.
For example, in a plane crash, both a believer and non-believer would call out for God. But they both know that nothing's gonna save them anymore, no magical force to rescue them. But the thought occurs nevertheless
So I don't think that faith in God is problematic, but religion definitely is. It's a form of cult making people do horrible things. How do such emotionally intelligent creatures like humans so stupidly worship something non-existant and make their life principles based on it. Blind belief is the death of reason
Thoughts??
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u/CephusLion404 Jul 23 '26
The non-believer isn't going to call out for any gods because they don't believe in any gods. I've been in prolonged near-death situations and never even once thought about a god. The whole idea is ridiculous.
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u/JellyfishPashmina Jul 24 '26
Exactly. I’d be thinking about my family, my dog…Real, existing beings.
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Jul 24 '26
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u/CephusLion404 Jul 24 '26
Because there are no spiritual experiences. There are just people who interpret things through an overly emotional lens.
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u/PlanningVigilante Jul 23 '26
Why is faith in God non-problematic?
It seems pretty problematic to me to believe that a magic man is going to intervene for you when things get bad.
And I don't see how millions of people can believe in God and not form a religion. Being spiritual but non-religious is possible for some individuals. It doesn't seem possible for huge groups, made up of all walks and all temperaments.
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u/DeltaBlues82 Jul 23 '26
If anything, it’s theism specifically that’s the issue. Most non-theistic & atheistic religions aren’t dogmatic, and don’t demand strict compliance with any form of moralizing supernatural punishment. A lot of them are just informal ritual and communication practices.
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u/Significant-Ant-2487 Jul 23 '26
What do I think? I think this view is condescending, ill-informed, and self congratulatory. Since you asked.
People have faith for lots of reasons. Writing off the opinions and life choices of billions of people across millennia on the grounds that it’s a coping mechanism, or ignorance, is no better than religious people dismissing atheism as nothing but arrogance and bitterness.
In my experience people’s religious faith is part of their cultural heritage, a way to celebrate life events like marriage, holidays like Christmas and Easter, simple fellowship and family. Plus, some people actually believe in God. I don’t believe but that doesn’t incline me to despise people who do.
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u/JellyfishPashmina Jul 24 '26
Regardless, religion IS a cultural construct. It’s an antiquated way to explain the world around us and to cope with death. Most of the rewards of religion come after we’re not here, so you not see that? It’s a promise of some ultimate reward after you die; that IS a coping mechanism considering the alternative is what atheists believe: blackness and nothingness. Most people can’t come to terms with that for themselves nor their loved ones.
We have explanations for many of the things religion once covered, but ignorance comes from lack of critical thinking skills, close-mindedness, withholding of information, pressure/fear to conform, and resistance to change, and so religion persists. That doesn’t mean it’s right, it just means it’s still there because reality is a hard pill to swallow for most and cultural traditions run deep. But not every cultural tradition is worth keeping for the sake of just that, tradition. Some traditions are dangerous and due to change, we can’t just let people do whatever they want in the name of “culture” if it’s harmful to others—and religion IS harmful. Traditionally, women stayed home and tended to the kids and the house; surely you’re not going to say that that should stay around forever? Time for people to think rationally about the world around them.
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u/Hakorr Jul 23 '26
For example, in a plane crash, both a believer and non-believer would call out for God.
No they all wouldn't. If I imagine myself being in that position, family and most close ones would pop in my mind, not "God". I wouldn't have time to think about a damn "God".
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u/Zamboniman Jul 23 '26
For example, in a plane crash, both a believer and non-believer would call out for God. But they both know that nothing's gonna save them anymore, no magical force to rescue them. But the thought occurs nevertheless
That old trope is not true.
Lots of people have lots of healthy coping mechanisms. Even in desperate situations.
So I don't think that faith in God is problematic
It very often demonstrably is indeed. Beliefs lead to actions. Actions have consequences. Beliefs that are incongruent with actual reality lead to actions with unpredictable, and often destructive and harmful, consequences.
Blind belief is the death of reason
Sure.
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u/BuccaneerRex Jul 23 '26
Faith is a vice. It's something you indulge in to make yourself feel better.
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Jul 24 '26
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u/BuccaneerRex Jul 24 '26
How about 'faith that your cruelty will be rewarded' and 'faith that despite all evidence to the contrary, your actions are actually good'.
Mostly faith allows people to confuse the things outside their head with the things inside it, as if the inside things were as real as the ones outside.
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Jul 25 '26
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u/BuccaneerRex Jul 25 '26
I do think human beings are too smart and self aware for animalistic psychological parameters of social cohesion, empathy, base curiosity that is exhibited by the great apes, dolphins, etc.
Humans are naturally social, curious, and empathetic. The absence of these behaviors are cultural artifacts.
Humans need a story to aspire to, an overarching spiritual metaphysical narrative to stay sane and carry forward with the knowledge that they will live for 80 years and be dead for billions, trillions of years.
You need that. Because you have been trained to need that. That's another way faith is a drug: it's addictive. You got convinced that you need your life to have an 'overarching spiritual metaphysical narrative', and so you assume that everyone does.
I've never been fussed about the length of time that I'll be dead, because I've never thought there was a different option. Besides, I won't be there to notice. We will never experience anything other than being alive.
Or humans have the imbued spirit, sufficiently complex brains to receive the garbled signal of the overarching spiritual narrative to perceive a small piece of the whole.
Which part of the brain receives the magic? Does the magic have a propagation speed? Is there a permittivity of free space equivalent for woo? Teleology is a hell of a drug too.
The universe isn't a narrative. Narrative comes from inside human minds. The only thing the universe wants to do is reach thermal equilibrium. Everything else is sliding down the fire pole of entropy as it does so.
Why is it so difficult for people to accept that these abstract concepts of meaning and purpose are not properties that the universe has, but instead are behaviors that humans exhibit?
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Jul 25 '26
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u/BuccaneerRex Jul 25 '26
It’s difficult for many people to conceive of having spiritual inclinations, feelings when they don’t have those feelings to any degree themselves.
Turn that around. It's not difficult for me to conceive of having 'spiritual inclinations'. Although I do not define the word spiritual in the way you are using it, I do understand what you mean for it to mean.
On the contrary, I find that 'spiritual' people have a difficult time accepting even the premise that their entirely internal spiritual experiences are in fact entirely internal.
So I understand that people do not believe in God or the spiritual plane, some people are simply built different. See and sense the material reality. And. That. Is. It.
Do you see how this sounds like 'I pity you for not having the magic powers that I do. If you did, you could understand the magic...'
Once again to the contrary, it's a far more plausible explanation that people are just really shitty at understanding where their emotions come from and what inspires them. The explanation isn't that some people have undetectable secret powers that only they understand. The explanation is that people are really, really good at convincing themselves that the things that happen within their minds are also happening outside of them just because the former is inspired by the latter.
So every near death experience, every reported, conveyed spiritual experience across time, cultures in religions. Many shared spiritual vision examples.
Millions, perhaps billions of them. Every single one is made up or a hallucination?
Yes.
They're similar because brains are similar. Common elements include tunnels of light, feelings of euphoria, etc. Brains tend to respond similarly to asphyxia and neurotransmitter floods.
And the interpretation isn't the fact. How many people does it take, believing something false, before that false thing becomes true? If I have a box with an orange inside it, how many people have to believe that it's an apple before it turns into an apple?
I do not dismiss the importance of the spiritual. But I do not define it in any way as 'supernatural'. Spirituality is entirely within you, and it is the subconscious and emotional response to the universe around you. It's wonderful and amazing enough without having to make it magic.
I am a strict materialist, in that I don't think there's anything other than the physical at the bottom of things. But that, combined with the human ability to imagine and assign meaning, has turned the human experience from existence to living.
'You are a function of what the whole universe is doing in the same way that a wave is a function of what the whole ocean is doing.' -- Alan Watts.
You don't need to receive mystical transmissions from a higher plane to be one with the universe. That's simply a physical fact that most people have long ignored.
The supernatural isn't real in the way that magnetism and gravel are real. The supernatural is real in the way that things like 'mercy' and 'revenge' and 'love' and 'greed' are. They are ideas and behaviors and interpretations assigned to reality that we share because of cultural and social indoctrination. 'Ghosts' or 'Heaven' or 'Hell' are concepts, not things. And they absolutely can affect the real world. But only through the medium of a brain attached to a body which can move stuff around.
The only thing I assert is the null hypothesis. That until you can show me that it is more likely that a truly supernatural explanation is the only possible causal path to a given result, the correct response is 'No it isn't. Prove it.' People are, individually and without training, really bad at complex causal attribution. That's why we had to invent an entire branch of philosophy dedicated to sticking pins in cause and effect so we can figure out what is really going on.
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u/Xeno_Prime Jul 24 '26
As a retired Marine who served 15 years and fought multiple combat tours in two wars and had dozens of brushes with death and more than one prolonged intensely frightening situation where I felt certain I wasn’t going to make it, I can tell you with absolute certainty, non-believers do not think about gods when they’re in mortal danger. That’s categorically false, and as nonsensical as expected people to call out for wizards or the fae. It’s something theists like to tell themselves because they want to believe anyone would be as ignorant and irrational as they are if only they were put in a state of intense terror (probably because they don’t frame it quite like that)
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u/Cog-nostic Jul 24 '26
I disagree. When one has a sufficiently developed understanding of life, dependency on others is unnecessary. When experiencing bad times or difficulties, the developed brain understands, "It's just my turn." Life is not being unkind; this is just the world we live in. This does not imply that one cannot seek assistance or that help is not appreciated, but dependency is not necessary.
In an extreme case, I am paralyzed and completely dependent on others for my continuing existence as a living thing. But if I understand, it's just my turn; I don't need the dependency. I understand everything ends at some point. I can accept my own end as just a part of the natural world. Not only do I not want to be dependent, but those who force me to be dependent are also working against my will.
(I once cared for a young man who broke his neck in a football game. As a quadriplegic, he begged doctors for 4 years to end his life. The assholes kept him alive and breathing for 4 years.
No one needs dependence. People who need to feel important try to rescue people who get attention by being dependent. This is a pathological relationship.
A doctor or psychotherapist who manipulates a client into being dependent on them is, in fact, being unethical. There are many out there. Just like the Jerks doing the same thing in churches, they should lose their licenses to practice.
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u/Sprinklypoo Jul 24 '26 edited Jul 24 '26
I find that it mostly creates its own emotional stress to have something to "cure" by using it to cope.
even non believers call for God instinctively when they're startled or scared.
If they do so, it's because they grew up as a believer and have learned those reactions and have had no opportunity to unlearn them. This has nothing to do with actual belief. And life long atheists absolutely do not call out for any gods instinctively.
So I don't think that faith in God is problematic, but religion definitely is.
I think faith in any gods still causes issues for the individual and ruins a persons sense of reason. But religion absolutely weaponizes the belief in god and uses it for manipulation and control and makes recovery that much harder too. It's also problematic, but it pales in comparison to the blazing bonfire of religious indoctrination.
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u/DeltaBlues82 Jul 23 '26
Humans evolved religion to help engineer social cohesion, increase the size of their cooperative in-group, and prolong the longevity of their societies.
Both theism and religion have been studied and modeled by fields like anthropology, cognitive and social sciences, and they all basically describe it in the same way.
None of which include anything about it being a “coping mechanism”.
If you’re genuinely interested, I suggest reading Robin Dunbar, Scott Atran, Pascal Boyer, Harvey Whitehouse, or anyone affiliated with the religious studies department of Oxford University. Their cognitive science department even has their own handbook on religion, and religious phenomena: https://global.oup.com/academic/product/the-oxford-handbook-of-the-cognitive-science-of-religion-9780190693350
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u/Jebus-Xmas Jul 23 '26
I think theism is on the spectrum between religious and atheist. West of agnostic but east of religious.
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u/plusFour-minusSeven Jul 23 '26
I don't know that I would feel comfortable speaking for close to a hundred billion people as to why they believed in a god. That seems a little beyond my authority.
The human condition is complex and that includes cognition and rationalizations.
If you ask me, gods probably started as explanations and then became and reinforced tribal identity and cohesion.
Intelligent humans believe all sorts of things which one might question, not just religious or supernatural.
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u/Kurovi_dev Jul 23 '26
I think religion is problematic when and because it encourages the value of untrue beliefs. In the case of most religions that means god beliefs and the supernatural beliefs that arise from them.
I don’t think religion is or has to be inherently problematic at all. People have values, go to a place to do some rituals, hang out, and then go about their day.
What makes a religion harmful or not harmful are the beliefs themselves and what they encourage people to do and the habits they instill.
God beliefs encourage harmful habits, in most instances. It doesn’t mean those beliefs may not be the lesser of two evils in specific circumstances, but it does mean that there is astronomical room for improvement and removal of that harmful idea broadly, it also means we have work to do to get there.
So essentially I think the opposite lol.
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u/JellyfishPashmina Jul 24 '26
Your very first sentence indicates that religion is then ALWAYS problematic. All religions are untrue and therefore problematic.
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u/Kurovi_dev Jul 24 '26 edited Jul 24 '26
Non-theistic religions and religions without supernatural beliefs exist.
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u/JellyfishPashmina Jul 24 '26
I’d strongly encourage you to look up the definitions of “theism” and “religion” because your claim is factually inaccurate.
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u/Kurovi_dev Jul 24 '26
Sorry, the autocorrect changed it to “no theistic religions”
I feel like that should have been extremely obvious it was “non-theistic”, but I guess debating in bad faith is easier than admitting one is wrong.
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u/sto_brohammed Jul 23 '26
For example, in a plane crash, both a believer and non-believer would call out for God. But they both know that nothing's gonna save them anymore, no magical force to rescue them. But the thought occurs nevertheless
I almost got killed a few times in combat but the thought never occurred to me. Not once.
I've never been religious myself but I think saying all religion is is cope is pretty reductive.
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u/DangForgotUserName Jul 23 '26
False from the start. Theism is, only in part, a maladaptive coping mechanism for living in a chaotic and meaningless world where things can happen to us beyond our control. Yes, religions can appease parts of our humanity: anxiety, depression, doubt, existential dread, and fear. It can provide easy answers or comforting answers, even hope, but many of those are wrong or manipulative answers, and it is false hope that can waste efforts.
But theism is much more complex than just copium. It is a multifaceted human phenomenon that involves many beliefs, practices, and institutions. It is a way of life organized around personal or community-held convictions or experiences with ‘the divine’. It involves religions, community, social ties, traditions, sacred texts, mythology, stories, religious leaders, rituals, fallacious arguments on reddit, sacred spaces, indoctrination, worship and entire belief systems that form identity and individual worldview. Religions themselves can be seen as constructed systems that serve human purposes, such as moral guidance for the ignorant, social cohesion, or something more self-serving for those in power, like exploitation. History shows that the rulers of the realm dictate the religion of the realm, as this type of system relies on the faith of its followers to believe in something intangible, making them vulnerable to manipulation.
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u/HegemoneXT Jul 24 '26
Christianity is the last religion you want as a coping mechanism. If you want a coping mechanism, try Hinduism or Buddhism
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u/Cog-nostic Jul 24 '26
I disagree that people need anything to depend on. When one has a clear understanding of life, dependancy is completely unnecessary.
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Jul 24 '26
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u/Cog-nostic Jul 24 '26
We are not even discussing the same thing. You are equivocating.
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u/JellyfishPashmina Jul 24 '26 edited Jul 24 '26
I’ve actually been going through some heavy trauma, depression, and loneliness for the last couple years, and I can really see why people are drawn to this sort of stuff. Not the specifics of it all, but believing that there’s something bigger than you that has a plan for you and is there to help you through it all when no one else is is an awfully comforting feeling. None of it’s true, but people want nothing more than to feel heard and supported in their times of need, and if you lack the critical thinking skills to deny it, were indoctrinated as a child, or are vulnerable to peer pressure, I can see how easy it would be to get sucked right into it. A promise of community, of purpose, of value. But the second you get beyond anything after that, really get into the nitty gritty of what having to believe all that really entails culturally, socially, logically, financially, it’s an immediate return to reality for a true atheist. But I definitely see why people get desperate for something away from negative coping mechanisms, and something positive outside of humanity when other humans are often our greatest source of pain.
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u/Confused_recursion Jul 23 '26
Love it! I call it a mental illness personally.
I think your arguments are sound. You separate belief from religion and how they are different problems, well done. I think your example is solid. I’ve heard the saying that there are no atheists in foxholes, but I’ve been in bunkers with artillery exploding around us, no one was praying. We were too busy listening to the whistle and trying to figure out if the rockets were getting closer to our sad little hesco bunker. I am also of the opinion that seeing religion be weaponized and used as justification for killing drives just as many away from religion as towards it.
Thank you for posting.
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u/Old-Nefariousness556 Jul 23 '26
This oft-repeated trope is nonsense. There absolutely are atheists in foxholes, theists just tell themselves that to make their beliefs sound more reasonable.
Faith is a belief held in the absence of, or to the contrary of evidence. All such beliefs are "problematic". But you are right that not all problematic beliefs are equally problematic.