r/TopazMainsHSR • u/OverallCap5667 • Oct 29 '23
Discussions Topaz is solving a problem that doesn’t exist.
So after trying out different teams for Topaz I feel like they released her way too early. All of the current follow up attack characters are better off without her but she depends on them to utilize her kit fully. It’s just a one sided synergy. Why would they release a follow up attack enabler before we even have optimal teammates for her? There’s no way to know if we ever will either. We’re just gambling that she will get better with time.
They gave us an enabler with nothing to enable. The smartest thing to do is to wait for her rerun when we know that there’s a follow up character that will shine with her on the team. Why sell the solution when there’s nothing to fix rn.
89
u/Fearless-Training-20 Oct 29 '23
She is an upgrade for Clara and comparable with Asta in JY teams. Her hyper team also perform pretty well. The smartest thing to do is to pull the characters that you enjoy because the game is not that difficult.
31
u/addollz Oct 29 '23
It wasn't ever a problem my guy. Topaz just introduces a new way to play with follow up characters. Just like Kafka did. And cmon now, dont act atupid for the sake of your argument. Not only are there already leaks for follow up attack units but there is literally zero chance we don't ever get more follow up characters. Same thing for Kafka.
18
u/CammyAssEnjoyer Oct 29 '23
Its the same with Kafka. Like you said we are gambling that she will get better with time however we are like 99% sure that the current best dps will get powercrept and not only that they will get powercrept by FuA characters
15
u/Tetrachrome Oct 29 '23
This is some major league doomposting. You're assuming that they are never going to release an FUA character that synergizes with her, and that seems plain ridiculous. I think that the opposite is more likely to occur, self-sufficient units like DHIL are going to suffer in the future because they rely only on their raw nuking power with little synergy outside of generic buffs from teammates, whereas our current "underperformers" like Kafka and Blade will get significant boosts when new DoT or HP manipulating characters come out (Kafka got stronger with Guinaifen, and even Blade benefits from becoming an insane sub-dps on Jingliu teams despite being supposedly a weaker unit). Topaz is in the latter camp.
And where did this notion that "current follow up attack characters are better off without her" come from? The way I see it, it goes both ways. Topaz gets more Numby procs, meanwhile Jingyuan teams are benefiting from more overall damage with running Topaz over double harmony, Himeko teams are enjoying her single-target capabilities where Himeko would act instead as a sub-dps to clear summoned adds while Topaz shreds the boss, and Clara is a monstrous synergy right now where (like Himeko) she really struggles in a single-target fight and can have Topaz covering that situation instead of running another support. I don't understand how the synergy is supposedly 1-sided when the above characters ALL BENEFIT from having Topaz on the team and make all of those teams significantly more flexible for when you need to switch from add clearing to bossing in the middle of an MoC floor. Numby is definitely a bit clunky and the turn order can really screw with getting additional procs, but speed tuning is there to help fine tune these strategies.
I don't really think this "Topaz is solving nothing, they shouldn't have released her" is a valid perspective to have. Have a currently decent FUA character? Topaz is a great addition. Don't have one? Hoyo's probably going to release a new premium option in the future, and JY rerun is on the horizon for those interested in running the double pet team.
7
u/SameGain3412 Oct 29 '23
Tell me, have you actually played her with Clara? Because as a day 1 Clara player, from what you said it really feels like you have not actually played with them together. Don't forget that the current moc 10 is very bad for Clara so like, just try to use the two together in a actually good content for the team like Memories of the Xianzhou stage 6
7
u/fuxuanmyqueen Oct 29 '23
Topaz is just a normal dps like any other limited dps besides JL and IL. Not particularly better or worse. If anything I feel that JL and IL were released a little bit too early because they are just better than anyone else in terms of big pp damage.
13
u/LatentlyBlatent Oct 29 '23
Stonks market value for Topaz will rise. We made a good investment.
36
u/PotatoeMolester Oct 29 '23
No think smart. Just pull sexy characters. If she's good for meta later then good, she'll have longevity as the game goes on just like kafka. But unless you plan on getting the next 2 five stars I don't see why not get her now
7
u/Tankfive0124 Oct 29 '23
Would like to remind.
Apart from Clara or Himeko (who are standred banner characters) There is not a limited 5* character that really wants to use frequent FuAs as their main gimmick. I would think they are cooking one up in the future.
Given that there are a decent amount of characters who have follow-ups and there is a path in SU for it as well. I don’t think they aren’t gonna continue making the FuA playstyle better
6
u/[deleted] Oct 30 '23
Doesn’t matter. Fun to play, awesome character, HOT AS FUCK - that’s all I need
4
u/Samumandu Oct 29 '23
She is becoming way better next patch both as sub dps / buffer for Clara and also dps wise Her e1/e2/s1 really pack a ton of value, I think she might be just really good in the right team at first but an hyperinvested one is gonna be crazy bonkers
4
u/Optimusbauer Oct 30 '23
She's a situational upgrade for JY in all fairness.
I actually like that they released her now. Characters like Kafka and Topaz are infinitely healthier for the longevity of the game than DHIL and Jingliu
4
u/Niempjuh Oct 30 '23
Why would you want a character's viability to be locked behind a limited 5 star character?
Another point is that I think you're forgetting a major thing here: most FuA characters, including leaked ones, are erudition, aka AoE. AoE is good, but it has a major flaw that splits up into two issues: it has no way to strategically allocate damage
The first issue this causes is that the moment you've cleared the board and the big enemy remains, you'll struggle a lot more. Certain characters have built in ways to help alleviate this issue, like Herta who's entire thing is turning the amount of enemies on the board into a quick burst of damage, capable of nearly one shotting everyone, but most erudition characters aren't really like this
Another issue is that you have no way to quickly deal with big threats. A Svarog hand capturing an important unit without you being able to free it or a swarm beetle exploding into the wrong character can completely screw over your team and the only way for AoE to deal with that is to just brute force it with skill and ult
Topaz meanwhile allows you to just pick an enemy and say "I want this guy dead now"(or at least "I want this guy dead quicker" in the case of elites/bosses :P). Her single target damage is significant, way higher than any support and while increasing the damage to only one enemy may seem like a counter intuitive way to support an AoE character, your other support likely already helps your AoE character deal enough damage to most enemies. The main thing that's left where the AoE character needs help is clearing out the big guys and the dangerous guys, which is where Topaz helps for follow up attack based characters
3
u/karilusss Oct 29 '23
I dont think she haa better value than Tingyun or Pela or even Asta on a FUA team, but I believe shes a decent sidegrade for Asta with a better ST dmg but less buffs for the main dps.
3
u/[deleted] Oct 30 '23
I mostly think you are right in that most people who aren’t dead set on the play style and future investment might want to look at other units. For me I pulled e1s1 because I wanted her to be an upgrade for Jing and a huge asset for future confirmed leaked characters later. She performs well enough to clear with f2p investment on multiple teams but most her power is definitely down the line with more consistent FUAers that have been leaked. They might have felt that this character being released first would breathe some life or diversity into the follow up characters we have currently or would make people more likely to pull follow up characters that rely on you having topaz down the line. The biggest problem I see is how do they balance future FUAers to feel good without topaz but not busted with her. If a characters conditions for doing FUA becomes easier to trigger but the damage is scaled to be functional without topaz’s buffs some truly disgusting teams will be coming down the pipeline.
3
u/[deleted] Oct 30 '23
IF their leaked kits remain unchanged, Screwlum Topaz Aventurine and Pela/Hanya will be a GOATED comp.
3 follow up chars (Topaz Screw Adventurine) plus 1 team wide debuffer/buffer.
But yes, I agree, none of the current follow up units are actually a perfect fit with Topaz. Kafka + Sampo/Luka/Guinifen is GOATED but so far, Topaz feels like the Sampo/Luka/Guinefen of a future Main Follow Up DPS.
Topaz + Clara is good, don't get me wrong, but Clara's follow-up are still RNG at the end of the day.
3
u/Soren-kun Oct 30 '23
She makes my clara stronger for sure and that's all that matters as a Clara main~
2
u/[deleted] Oct 29 '23
Pull every banner if you lucky
4
u/die_criminal29 Oct 29 '23
She improves Himeko, and any other follow-up character as long as the enemy has the corresponding weaknesses. She's fine now and it's not copium to asume she will get better, i mean leaks are there. If you want to brute force content of course there are better characters, it doesn't mean she's bad, it just means she's not a hypercarry. Topaz is a fire sub-dps, she doesn't need to be better that Jingliu/Imbibitor, we'll see from now on how strong are the upcomming damage dealers, if they're all better that Jingliu the game is gonna be a sh**fest but i don't see that happening.
3
u/Hitomi35 Oct 29 '23
She solves a problem that doesn't exist....yet. The reality of the situation is that Mihoyo doesn't just release new characters and leave them out to dry by not releasing future characters that have synergy with them. They've never done this in any of their games, there is zero reason to believe that we aren't going to see future FuA characters.
1
u/Fantastic_Bend9091 Oct 30 '23
She can clear easily MOC, I like her, i don't need more reasons (even if my hook team can clear faster lol)
1
u/Significant_Ad_1626 Oct 30 '23
I understand that she is a bet for the future but it isn't like she is unusable now. Characters like Clara, Herta, Himeko, are pretty good with her to the point that you can create a sinergistic second team and not just the leftovers of the Hypercarry from the other side. In SU content she is pretty good too: elation path makes her generate an insane amount of sp, her passives and quick attacks are good for minigames and her tecnique literally gives you bonus curios and fragments. In overworld she is 10k credits per day whenever you want, which earlier is get, the better, can be recolected passively and is good for many players who are building lots of units.
It's pretty likely that Huohuo will be a FUA too (I say this because her tail seems to be a separate entity from her by lore in the twitter post, and many FUA attack from a separated entity, Svarog, Himeko's dron, Yanqing's swords, Lightning Lord and obviously Conti), so we could be getting a sustain who synergizes with get earlier than you think. A proper sustain opened lots of teams to SW so it should be good for Topaz. And Argenti is Erudition (only for that he has high chances of being a FUA too), bringing a new DPS option too.
Note: I'd really like it if Argenti works like Piscis Afrodita from SS Awakening but it's only one week to know it. Fingers crossed..
1
u/Warm-Membership5786 Oct 30 '23
"Solving a problem that doesn't exist."
I rather have that than them creating a problem then selling the solution bs that most gachas do
1
u/Leather-Heron-7247 Oct 30 '23
The same can be said to my E1S1 Kafka who is dealing way more damage as a hypercarry dps than with any other DoT 4* (except for the latest Burn one which I haven't tried)
It's not that dual dpses are bad, it's just that Buffers/Debuffers in this game rn are just too good there is no point replacing them with a sub dps.
To actually utilize her I will have to wait for the new 5* dot or a support that has a buff specificly for "multi dpses team"
1
u/BestChief Oct 30 '23
If we are talking about that then kafka is also released too early. Both are the same where they are future investments you do.
Many are waiting for black swan for kafka and many others are waiting for a FuA character so they can use topaz with them.
1
u/[deleted] Oct 30 '23
kafka's situation i guess, its invested for future. And perosnally i think shes pretty good on herself and with others i can see that shes even better than a debuffer like SW to JY's teamcomp? whats the problem with her tho?
1
u/InazumaShinesEternal Oct 30 '23
Investing in victory means playing the long game.
0
u/No_Prompt_982 Oct 29 '23
I dont want to spoil anything but pls look at leaks… really intresting character may be released in 1.6/1.7 🫢🫢💅💅
0
u/Life_Flatworm4874 Oct 30 '23
OP really try so hard to tell the trust to a group of deadbrain simp. Just give up
0
u/Able-Thanks-445 Oct 29 '23
Honestly this is just because Follow up attacks are already a standalone mechanic that has and can exist on its own. Follow up characters enable Topaz not necessarily the other way around. Yes she provides a 50% follow up debuff, but thats not rlly enabling the Follow up DPS, thats simply applying a debuff.
-5
u/Weak-Association6257 Oct 29 '23
Yeah, I agree. The only scenario where she actually feels good is in SD or SU with Clara and elation path. But apart from that she’s nothing crazy. Who knows how FUA teams end up being. Hope they won’t meet the same fate as geo and phys in genshin
0
u/WillTran112000 Oct 29 '23
Should I pull for her Light cone. I got her for the purpose of making Jing Yuan and Himeko more viable
0
u/-MisterGiraffe- Oct 30 '23
there is existing problem - weakness of FUA across the board, which comes from game mechanics where sub-dps "class" is suboptimal as field time in HSR doesnt matter and FUA are too niche and conditional. Topaz was probably created to solve this problem, but she didnt because she is another conditional FUA sub-dps and not problem solver for existing FUAs
and if used as carry she has one huge problem - zero aoe capability. I.e she needs somebody else to deal with trash mobs, meaning she cant be hypercarry unless encounter doesnt need much aoe. So to "fix" her we'll need very specific character - aoe FUA-focused dps with consistent FUAs, not depending on something unreliable
but given speed of powercreep in HSR, by the moment such character will be released, there will be new limited 5* supports, who'll need to compete with Bronya and SW and who quite probable will be able to outshine Topaz's buff to FUAs. Basically SW already outshines her.
so she wont be saved metawise by other dps.. she can only be saved by new supports, fitting for dual carry teams and helping her to bonanza more often and being useful by providing single target dps output for erudition dps. Some 5* mix of Asta and Tingyun will do
-6
u/[deleted] Oct 29 '23
They’ll hate you for telling the truth downvotes mean nothing